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**LottiFurmann** · 06-06-2012, 01:30 AM

If someone really knows jazz, their first reaction would be Raja's jazz is more jazz than Rahman's jazz

Because by very definition jazz is undefinable !!! Basically there is 'something' we can call jazz but it is not definable. The boundaries keep getting pushed. As groucho mentioned earlier, what Rahman has done in 'Jaane Tu..' or 'Joota Hi Sahi' is sticking very close to the genre. The traditional 'jazz' sound is maintained there but for someone who has heard lot of standard jazz of Armstrong etc, there is nothing much there which transcends their work. Infact there is almost no signature of Rahman in the song from 'Joota Hi Sahi'. I had a major argument with Milliblog Karthik about a 'Joota Hi Sahi' song regarding this issue. He felt that it showed Rahman's greatness because it had no Rahman signature !!! Whereas I felt that lack of signature is equivalent to not internalizing a genre.

Coming from a jazz viewpoint, I guess strictly speaking Raja would be pushing the boundaries of jazz, since jazz is all about mixing new genres and yet maintaining a 'jazz' sound. Now this 'jazz' sound is the one which is very very difficult to define. Most of people, when talking about jazz, only think of smooth jazz most of the time. But there lot of Brazilians jazz players and others whom my friend had introduced me to and they they sound very different from Coltrane and Armstrong. So from a jazz enthusiast point of view, the way Raja puts his own stamp is truly keeping with the spirit of Jazz. A 'poo poothadhu' with his style inbuilt into it strictly is pushing the boundaries of jazz.

Mumbai Express has already been mentioned. A few songs which gives the 'jazz' flavor while maintaining Raja signature are here:

All of these will fall under the 'Raja Jazz' genre.

The problem with sticking close to the genre is that you will end up being compared with the standards in that genre. For example, I don't see any reason why I should listen to Rahman's song from 'Joota Hi Sahi' when it has no stamp of his. I might as well go and listen to Coltrane, Armstrong or Ella Fitzgerald. Whereas in Raja's case I am listening to jazz as conceived by him. And believe me, jazz music allows you do it. (You may not be allowed to do your own 'carnatic' or 'hindustani' music but in jazz, yes you can do it.)

06-06-2012, 01:30 AM	#33
LottiFurmann Join Date Jan 2008 Posts 4,494 Senior Member	If someone really knows jazz, their first reaction would be Raja's jazz is more jazz than Rahman's jazz Because by very definition jazz is undefinable !!! Basically there is 'something' we can call jazz but it is not definable. The boundaries keep getting pushed. As groucho mentioned earlier, what Rahman has done in 'Jaane Tu..' or 'Joota Hi Sahi' is sticking very close to the genre. The traditional 'jazz' sound is maintained there but for someone who has heard lot of standard jazz of Armstrong etc, there is nothing much there which transcends their work. Infact there is almost no signature of Rahman in the song from 'Joota Hi Sahi'. I had a major argument with Milliblog Karthik about a 'Joota Hi Sahi' song regarding this issue. He felt that it showed Rahman's greatness because it had no Rahman signature !!! Whereas I felt that lack of signature is equivalent to not internalizing a genre. Coming from a jazz viewpoint, I guess strictly speaking Raja would be pushing the boundaries of jazz, since jazz is all about mixing new genres and yet maintaining a 'jazz' sound. Now this 'jazz' sound is the one which is very very difficult to define. Most of people, when talking about jazz, only think of smooth jazz most of the time. But there lot of Brazilians jazz players and others whom my friend had introduced me to and they they sound very different from Coltrane and Armstrong. So from a jazz enthusiast point of view, the way Raja puts his own stamp is truly keeping with the spirit of Jazz. A 'poo poothadhu' with his style inbuilt into it strictly is pushing the boundaries of jazz. Mumbai Express has already been mentioned. A few songs which gives the 'jazz' flavor while maintaining Raja signature are here: All of these will fall under the 'Raja Jazz' genre. The problem with sticking close to the genre is that you will end up being compared with the standards in that genre. For example, I don't see any reason why I should listen to Rahman's song from 'Joota Hi Sahi' when it has no stamp of his. I might as well go and listen to Coltrane, Armstrong or Ella Fitzgerald. Whereas in Raja's case I am listening to jazz as conceived by him. And believe me, jazz music allows you do it. (You may not be allowed to do your own 'carnatic' or 'hindustani' music but in jazz, yes you can do it.)
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