[ethigSmimbine]

Quote Originally Posted by Yuan View Post
My guess is that most if not all of us here are not enlightened. But I think this forum is helping some people walk or starting on their path to enlightenment. Isn't that what it means to help others reach enlightenment?

Is your teacher enlightened? If not, why is she/he teaching you, helping you to reach your enlightenment?

Why do we have to wait until we are enlightened before we help others? Hi Yuan,

Can I just point out that I was refering to the Mahayana phrase ''liberating /saving all sentient beings" which in my opinion is an unrealistic and entirely different aim for anyone to uphold .

Helping another person in some way, or running/posting in a Buddhist internet forum, or someone being a Dhamma teacher, is a natural outcome of exposure to the Dharma, but is hardly part of an expectation of 'saving all sentient beings.' This isn't something the Buddha told people to do, its a later add-on.

I also pointed out that the Beginners forum isn't really the place for discussions about specific Mahayana teachings.

Thanks I hope this is the right forum to pursue this inquiry a bit further.

First of all, I don't think the Bodhisattva vow is about "saving" anyone. As you are well aware, there is no omnipotent God in Buddhism that can save anyone, and Buddhism doesn't really think anyone need to be "saved." They just need to be "awoken." I am objecting to the word "save" because in English's religious context, "save" has a connotation of salvation, with its implication of "original sin" which is totally incompatible with Buddhism.

Second, it is also commonly understood that in Buddhism, no one can liberate anyone else. People must liberate themselves. So at best, Bodhisattva or Buddhists can only help others toward enlightenment, maybe with words, maybe with actions, maybe with answering questions, maybe with pointing out available resources. Whether you admit it or not, the "Right view" and "Right speech" presented on this forum or by various teachers, are all helping accomplishing this vow.

So if your view is that "helping all sentient beings" reach enlightenment is the goal of one single Bodhisattva and can only be done by one Bodhisattva, then maybe you have a point that it is an unrealistic goal. But this is not the case. It is the vow of all Bodhisattvas and many Buddhists, and with a group effort, the goal might be difficult, but not unrealistic. Many seeming impossible tasks become possible because of collective and focused group efforts, helping all sentient beings is no different.

You are probably right that this is an unrealistic goal in your life time. But for many Buddhists, this vow does not have a time frame.

Maybe you are right that this is not what Buddha personally instructed. I felt that it is immaterial. Why? Because I cannot accept that there are no "advancement" in the teaching and concepts of Buddhism after Buddha, and that this vow does not negate any of Buddha's original teachings. This vow is really about Dāna pāramitā (generosity). Generosity is not just about charity with money, but also about helping others toward enlightenment by been generous about your understanding of Dharma. As I noted in another post, by helping others toward enlightenment, you also help yourself toward enlightenment. What is not to like about doing something that helps both others and self at the same time?

Wiki/ actually has a good entry on Bodhisattva vow:

In the various Bodhisattva vows (sometimes called the Bodhisattva Precepts) of Mahayana Buddhism, the bodhisattvas take a vow stating that they will strive for as long as samsara endures to liberate all sentient beings from samsara and lead them to enlightenment. The Bodhisattva does not seek bodhi (Awakening) solely for him/herself, but chiefly for the sake of freeing all other beings and aiding them into the bliss of Nirvana. Anyway, just my two cents.