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**Indessasp** · 01-29-2012, 05:29 AM

If you approach the word 'emptiness' as a concept then there will be an obvious opposite which my 4 years old child could tell us right away. However one will not understand the first thing the Buddha taught by using the conditioned conceptual mind. The Four Noble Truths tell clearly about how this grasping after and pushing away conceptual identifications, as if they had inherent existence, will cause suffering.

welcome Stoneflow

Emptiness, in the original Pali, does not mean "empty of concepts".

The Pali reports the Buddha taught each of the five aggregates is empty. One of the five aggregates is conceptual thought (sankhara khandha).

Thus, it seems, conceptual thought itself is empty.

Empty of what? Empty of 'self' or anything pertaining to 'self'.

The Four Noble Truths tell clearly about grasping with self-identifications.

Best wishes

Now suppose that a man desiring heartwood, in quest of heartwood, seeking heartwood, were to go into a forest carrying a sharp ax. There he would see a large banana tree: straight, young, of enormous height. He would cut it at the root and, having cut it at the root, would chop off the top. Having chopped off the top, he would peel away the outer skin. Peeling away the outer skin, he wouldn't even find sapwood, to say nothing of heartwood. Then a man with good eyesight would see it, observe it & appropriately examine it. To him — seeing it, observing it & appropriately examining it — it would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in a banana tree?

In the same way, a monk sees, observes & appropriately examines any [conceptual] fabrications that are past, future or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near. To him — seeing them, observing them & appropriately examining them — they would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in fabrications?

Phena Sutta: Foam And what is the emptiness mind-release? There is the case where a monk, having gone into the wilderness, to the root of a tree or into an empty dwelling, considers thus: 'This is empty of self or of anything pertaining to self.' This is called the emptiness awareness-release.

MN 43 'Self-identification, self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which self-identification is described by the Blessed One?

There is clinging to these five aggregates, friend Visakha: form, feeling, perception, fabrications, consciousness. This clinging to the five aggregates is the self-identification described by the Blessed One.

'The origination of self-identification, the origination of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which origination of self-identification is described by the Blessed One

The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This, friend Visakha, is the origination of self-identification described by the Blessed One.

The cessation of self-identification, the cessation of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which cessation of self-identification is described by the Blessed One?

The remainderless fading & cessation, renunciation, relinquishment, release & letting go of that very craving: This, friend Visakha, is the cessation of self-identification described by the Blessed One.

'The way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification, the way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification is described by the Blessed One?

Precisely this noble eightfold path — right view, right resolve, right speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, right concentration: This, friend Visakha, is the way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification described by the Blessed One.

MN 44

01-29-2012, 05:29 AM	#39
Indessasp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 458 Senior Member	If you approach the word 'emptiness' as a concept then there will be an obvious opposite which my 4 years old child could tell us right away. However one will not understand the first thing the Buddha taught by using the conditioned conceptual mind. The Four Noble Truths tell clearly about how this grasping after and pushing away conceptual identifications, as if they had inherent existence, will cause suffering. welcome Stoneflow Emptiness, in the original Pali, does not mean "empty of concepts". The Pali reports the Buddha taught each of the five aggregates is empty. One of the five aggregates is conceptual thought (sankhara khandha). Thus, it seems, conceptual thought itself is empty. Empty of what? Empty of 'self' or anything pertaining to 'self'. The Four Noble Truths tell clearly about grasping with self-identifications. Best wishes Now suppose that a man desiring heartwood, in quest of heartwood, seeking heartwood, were to go into a forest carrying a sharp ax. There he would see a large banana tree: straight, young, of enormous height. He would cut it at the root and, having cut it at the root, would chop off the top. Having chopped off the top, he would peel away the outer skin. Peeling away the outer skin, he wouldn't even find sapwood, to say nothing of heartwood. Then a man with good eyesight would see it, observe it & appropriately examine it. To him — seeing it, observing it & appropriately examining it — it would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in a banana tree? In the same way, a monk sees, observes & appropriately examines any [conceptual] fabrications that are past, future or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near. To him — seeing them, observing them & appropriately examining them — they would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in fabrications? Phena Sutta: Foam And what is the emptiness mind-release? There is the case where a monk, having gone into the wilderness, to the root of a tree or into an empty dwelling, considers thus: 'This is empty of self or of anything pertaining to self.' This is called the emptiness awareness-release. MN 43 'Self-identification, self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which self-identification is described by the Blessed One? There is clinging to these five aggregates, friend Visakha: form, feeling, perception, fabrications, consciousness. This clinging to the five aggregates is the self-identification described by the Blessed One. 'The origination of self-identification, the origination of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which origination of self-identification is described by the Blessed One The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This, friend Visakha, is the origination of self-identification described by the Blessed One. The cessation of self-identification, the cessation of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which cessation of self-identification is described by the Blessed One? The remainderless fading & cessation, renunciation, relinquishment, release & letting go of that very craving: This, friend Visakha, is the cessation of self-identification described by the Blessed One. 'The way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification, the way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification,' it is said, lady. Which way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification is described by the Blessed One? Precisely this noble eightfold path — right view, right resolve, right speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, right concentration: This, friend Visakha, is the way of practice leading to the cessation of self-identification described by the Blessed One. MN 44
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