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Old 08-23-2010, 10:50 PM   #29
Rounteetepe

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Oct 2005
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Perhaps it's the difference between the Theravada motivation and the Mahayana motivation we are talking about here.
You aren't seriously claiming that Theravadans are incapable of developing empathy, compassion, understanding of others, etc?


From the forum of Lama Shenpen Rinpoche's Dharmaling Congregation:
This is a post from another forum?

The difference is mainly in the motivation.
While this is often claimed by mahayanists, there are plenty of other more important and obvious differences besides just "motivation".


Theravada practitioners will focus on reaching Nirvana, Emptiness, and once reached, will remain in it for eons!
This is tibeto-centric elitist propaganda, perpetrated by folks who obviously have absolutely no familiarity with Theravada (or the teachings of the Buddha they uphold) at all.



Mahayana practitioners will focus on helping others, wishing to reach omniscience for the sake of the others, reaching Emptiness as a means, not a goal.
And how does the "merit-making" that is mentioned in the paragraph after this statement enter into all this selflessness?


It adds some specific practices to transform every moment in practice, transforming the perceptions, the energies directly into the pristine nature of the Buddha practiced.
Interesting PR spin, however, what the Buddha practiced has been preserved, so how is it claimed that deviating from that practice is going to get one "into the pristine nature of the Buddha practiced" (whatever that is supposed to mean)?

The things that have been added -- oracles, deity worship, etc -- are practices that the Buddha specifically denied the efficacy of.

The Therevada vehicle tends to rely only on Shakyamuni and his teachings whereas the Mahayana way takes into account Bodhisattvas and other Buddhas and their teachings and help.
Actually, most Theravadans have been steered to rely only on the so-called "abhidhamma" and the commentaries, ignoring the noble, liberative teachings of the Buddha and focusing on merit-making.

However, there are some who focus on the teachings of the Buddha, which are not in any need of embellishment or "improvement" from other, later, self-proclaimed "Buddhas and Bodhisattvas".

"If we can attain nondual, nonconceptual awareness in meditation
The Buddha did not teach "non-dualism", nor is nonconceptual awareness an important aspect of the meditation practice he claimed would lead to the ending of the effluents.




As our meditation becomes effective, the attitude of others towards us begins to change, and they themselves begin to turn inward and to search with greater conscientiousness through the stuff of their own minds and lives for spiritual solutions to their own problems.
So, are you seriously proposing that the tibetan religions have exclusive claim to the fact of change in one person having an effect on others around them????

And that this only comes about through their version of "attain[ing] nondual, nonconceptual awareness" in meditation...?


...how the benefits of meditation are not limited soley to the meditator
And, again, this is somehow only the dominion of the tibetan religions...?

The later add-ons you refer to are the teachings of widely accepted realized beings or those who are called Bodhisattvas.
It is widely accepted that flying an aircraft into a building and killing lost of infidels will get you Paradise and 72 virgins. Does that mean it is true?


It is the Mahayana belief that all beings are in reality seeking happiness and want to be rid of their suffering ...
Do you seriously believe that this notion is exclusive to the "mahayana"...? Do you seriously believe that the Buddha's teachings, adn the Theravada tradition that upholds them, do not express this?

...and we are Buddhists not just for ourselves alone to transcend suffering...
Neither is this the case with Theravada. This is just more maha/tibetan propaganda, beating up the tired old Hinayana Straw Man.


but because we see it as a vehicle to bring enlightenment to all.
And helping others out is the exclusive dominion of the maha/tibetan groups? Seriously, this sort of self-serving claim is dying out, as it cannot survive the light of day. It might work for mahayanists deluding themselves and each other, but it simply does not comport with reality.


Mahayana Buddhists believe in a dark age when the Buddhist teachings will be lost
And they seem to be working hard at making sure the Buddha's teachings are lost, buried under centuries of "Bodhisattvas and Buddhas".

Funny that you say "Buddhist teachings" rather than "the Buddha's teachings". Whose teachings are the most relevant here?
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