DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - Nibbana: Buddha's word about it ..(plus Anapanasati)

**EzequielTMann** · 05-01-2012, 07:09 AM

Sure.

Buddha rejected the pranayama that bore him no result. Buddha realised the violent pranayama he formerly practised was a fruitless path. Buddha explained in his 1st sermon:

Buddha did not teach of "sudden" full enlightenment. Full enlightenment is gradual. But the 1st stage of initial enlightenment, i.e., stream-entry, is certainly sudden. But sudden enlightenment is not full enlightenment. Buddha taught four stages of enlightenment.

Kind regards

Understood sir.

Enlightenment, according to the Nikayas, is not a fixed point however the "self" does get transcended.

Regarding the "Gradual vs. Sudden" debate:
It all can become a matter of semantics IF one just assumes anything one wants.
I say this in order to put proper perspective on meditation.

Krishnamurti was keen about this point as he disbelieved "methods" to enlightenment.
The man never dismissed meditation or awareness but put them in proper context, if you read his works.

Having said that, Krishnamurti's Choiceless Awareness and Dzogchen's Naked Awareness is the same thing actually.

I believe that what the Buddha taught was also Choiceless Awareness but people have taken it to be a "method" such as many erroneously stating that "concentration is meditation" when it is not, Not according to Buddhadhamma or Krishnamurti or Dzogchen or Vedanta, for that matter.

Be well sir,
Stefos

05-01-2012, 07:09 AM	#16
EzequielTMann Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 561 Senior Member	Sure. Buddha rejected the pranayama that bore him no result. Buddha realised the violent pranayama he formerly practised was a fruitless path. Buddha explained in his 1st sermon: Buddha did not teach of "sudden" full enlightenment. Full enlightenment is gradual. But the 1st stage of initial enlightenment, i.e., stream-entry, is certainly sudden. But sudden enlightenment is not full enlightenment. Buddha taught four stages of enlightenment. Kind regards Understood sir. Enlightenment, according to the Nikayas, is not a fixed point however the "self" does get transcended. Regarding the "Gradual vs. Sudden" debate: It all can become a matter of semantics IF one just assumes anything one wants. I say this in order to put proper perspective on meditation. Krishnamurti was keen about this point as he disbelieved "methods" to enlightenment. The man never dismissed meditation or awareness but put them in proper context, if you read his works. Having said that, Krishnamurti's Choiceless Awareness and Dzogchen's Naked Awareness is the same thing actually. I believe that what the Buddha taught was also Choiceless Awareness but people have taken it to be a "method" such as many erroneously stating that "concentration is meditation" when it is not, Not according to Buddhadhamma or Krishnamurti or Dzogchen or Vedanta, for that matter. Be well sir, Stefos
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