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**fedordzen** · 11-20-2010, 04:10 AM

Santi, bhikkhave, bhikkhū imasmiṃ bhikkhusaṅghe pañcannaṃ orambhāgiyānaṃ saṃyojanānaṃ parikkhayā opapātikā tattha parinibbāyino anāvattidhammā tasmā lokā – evarūpāpi, bhikkhave, santi bhikkhū imasmiṃ bhikkhusaṅghe. In this community of monks there are monks who, with the wasting away of the five lower fetters, are due to be reborn [in the Pure Abodes], there to be totally unbound, destined never again to return from that world: such are the monks in this community of monks.

Anapanasati Sutta (Thanissaro Bhikkhu) "Bhikkhus, living in this community there are bhikkhus who are Non-Returners through having ended the five lower fetters, who are spontaneously arisen, who will realize perfect coolness in that existence and by nature will never return from that world. Bhikkhus such as these are living in this community of bhikkhus.

Anapanasati Sutta (Santikaro Bhikkhu translating from Buddhadasa's Thai translation) Hi

Personally, I have always felt something is missing or lost in these translations.

However, one point is clear, which is the Pali does not use the term "reborn". It uses the term 'opapātika', which is "spontaneously arisen".

Also, 'opapatika' is not something that exclusively applies to the manifestation of non-returning.

Kind regards

32. "Sariputta, there are these four kinds of generation. What are the four?

Egg-born generation, womb-born generation, moisture-born generation and spontaneous generation (opapatika yoni).

33. "What is egg-born generation? There are these beings born by breaking out of the shell of an egg; this is called egg-born generation. What is womb-born generation? There are these beings born by breaking out from the caul; this is called womb-born generation. What is moisture-born generation? There are these beings born in a rotten fish, in a rotten corpse, in rotten dough, in a cesspit, or in a sewer; this is called moisture-born generation. What is spontaneous generation? There are gods and denizens of hell and certain human beings and some beings in the lower worlds; this is called spontaneous generation. These are the four kinds of generation.

Maha-sihanada Sutta

11-20-2010, 04:10 AM	#6
fedordzen Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 406 Senior Member	Santi, bhikkhave, bhikkhū imasmiṃ bhikkhusaṅghe pañcannaṃ orambhāgiyānaṃ saṃyojanānaṃ parikkhayā opapātikā tattha parinibbāyino anāvattidhammā tasmā lokā – evarūpāpi, bhikkhave, santi bhikkhū imasmiṃ bhikkhusaṅghe. In this community of monks there are monks who, with the wasting away of the five lower fetters, are due to be reborn [in the Pure Abodes], there to be totally unbound, destined never again to return from that world: such are the monks in this community of monks. Anapanasati Sutta (Thanissaro Bhikkhu) "Bhikkhus, living in this community there are bhikkhus who are Non-Returners through having ended the five lower fetters, who are spontaneously arisen, who will realize perfect coolness in that existence and by nature will never return from that world. Bhikkhus such as these are living in this community of bhikkhus. Anapanasati Sutta (Santikaro Bhikkhu translating from Buddhadasa's Thai translation) Hi Personally, I have always felt something is missing or lost in these translations. However, one point is clear, which is the Pali does not use the term "reborn". It uses the term 'opapātika', which is "spontaneously arisen". Also, 'opapatika' is not something that exclusively applies to the manifestation of non-returning. Kind regards 32. "Sariputta, there are these four kinds of generation. What are the four? Egg-born generation, womb-born generation, moisture-born generation and spontaneous generation (opapatika yoni). 33. "What is egg-born generation? There are these beings born by breaking out of the shell of an egg; this is called egg-born generation. What is womb-born generation? There are these beings born by breaking out from the caul; this is called womb-born generation. What is moisture-born generation? There are these beings born in a rotten fish, in a rotten corpse, in rotten dough, in a cesspit, or in a sewer; this is called moisture-born generation. What is spontaneous generation? There are gods and denizens of hell and certain human beings and some beings in the lower worlds; this is called spontaneous generation. These are the four kinds of generation. Maha-sihanada Sutta
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