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**Ltftujkg** · 10-31-2007, 04:22 PM

I see two primary differences in the situations.

Effie said it was hard to see how anyone could defend the Israelis. The answer is really quite simple - the "reality" that defenders of the Israelis see through their news sources bears almost no resemblance to the "reality" that defenders of the Palestinians see through their news sources. Indeed, from the "reality" they are presented with, defenders of the Israelis have a hard time seeing how anyone can defend the Palestinians.

The first reality sees a protective fence to guard against terrorist attacks; the second sees an "apartheid wall". The first sees tremendous Israeli restraint in the face of unthinkable hatred and intense provocations; the second sees callous Israeli aggression against an oppressed and impoverished people. And most who buy into one "reality" can't understand how those buying into the other can be so blind.

There is an old saying that "Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." When it comes to the Israelis and the Palestinians, however, everyone has their own facts. And figuring out which ones are really facts is a very difficult exercise.

In Christ,
Mike

Mike, putting aside opinions and feelings for the moment, look at the facts.

Look at the distribution of the land, look at the laws that have been passed against the Arabs, look at what the Jews had in the past and what they have now. I was once very sympathetic to the Jews and what they had suffered at the hands of Nazi Germany, but look at what they are doing now.
Put yourself in the place of a Palestinian - an ordinary palestinian who has no connection with any groups terrorist or otherwise - I should say here that the word "terrorist" is subject to many meanings, it all depends on who is using it - and then ask yourself how you would feel towards the Israelis.

Last night on the news, we heard that fuel would also now be rationed - you know of course that even in this area of the world winter is hard - it even snows. These measures against the Arabs remind me of similar measures taken against the Jews more than 50 years ago.

Emotion and feeling have nothing to do with the conclusions my mind has come to. I know no Arabs and although I met some Jews in the past, I was too young to have formed any opinion whatsoever. My opinions are based on "facts". Facts are facts. The first book I read that started to form my opinion about Israel and Palestine was "O Jerusalem" by two French reporters.
A good book. Very objective and full of "facts".

I realize that most of us get our information from TV stations. I don't. I read a lot and I try to research what I am interested in. No one side is ever entirely innocent in conflicts but injustice, no matter how people try to cover it up and supply us with disinformation, can usually be uncovered and seen for what it is.

Effie

10-31-2007, 04:22 PM	#19
Ltftujkg Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 443 Senior Member	I see two primary differences in the situations. Effie said it was hard to see how anyone could defend the Israelis. The answer is really quite simple - the "reality" that defenders of the Israelis see through their news sources bears almost no resemblance to the "reality" that defenders of the Palestinians see through their news sources. Indeed, from the "reality" they are presented with, defenders of the Israelis have a hard time seeing how anyone can defend the Palestinians. The first reality sees a protective fence to guard against terrorist attacks; the second sees an "apartheid wall". The first sees tremendous Israeli restraint in the face of unthinkable hatred and intense provocations; the second sees callous Israeli aggression against an oppressed and impoverished people. And most who buy into one "reality" can't understand how those buying into the other can be so blind. There is an old saying that "Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." When it comes to the Israelis and the Palestinians, however, everyone has their own facts. And figuring out which ones are really facts is a very difficult exercise. In Christ, Mike Mike, putting aside opinions and feelings for the moment, look at the facts. Look at the distribution of the land, look at the laws that have been passed against the Arabs, look at what the Jews had in the past and what they have now. I was once very sympathetic to the Jews and what they had suffered at the hands of Nazi Germany, but look at what they are doing now. Put yourself in the place of a Palestinian - an ordinary palestinian who has no connection with any groups terrorist or otherwise - I should say here that the word "terrorist" is subject to many meanings, it all depends on who is using it - and then ask yourself how you would feel towards the Israelis. Last night on the news, we heard that fuel would also now be rationed - you know of course that even in this area of the world winter is hard - it even snows. These measures against the Arabs remind me of similar measures taken against the Jews more than 50 years ago. Emotion and feeling have nothing to do with the conclusions my mind has come to. I know no Arabs and although I met some Jews in the past, I was too young to have formed any opinion whatsoever. My opinions are based on "facts". Facts are facts. The first book I read that started to form my opinion about Israel and Palestine was "O Jerusalem" by two French reporters. A good book. Very objective and full of "facts". I realize that most of us get our information from TV stations. I don't. I read a lot and I try to research what I am interested in. No one side is ever entirely innocent in conflicts but injustice, no matter how people try to cover it up and supply us with disinformation, can usually be uncovered and seen for what it is. Effie
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