DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post

**goolen4you** · 04-12-2012, 05:25 PM

dear kara why don't you make a documentary focusing on Muslims who are against it and leave it at that, this is certainly a documentary that has not been made before.

brothers and sisters - beware of the fact that this documentary is almost certainly going to be edited in a way that is not favourable to Islam and if you go and support sunnah circumcision your views will likely be conflated with support for haram Pharoic circumcision.

I had to prepare an essay on this in the context of cultural relativism and what you have mentioned is quite accurate.

However, Kara, I would further urge to be wary of of the terminology being used also, as FGM has a negative connotation and female circumcision less so. Again this is dependent upon the epistemology of the terminology with the first having its grounding in ethnocentrically biased research (if you study the atmosphere of most of the female writers/researchers opposed to FGM, they have a very condescending attitude, and from this stems their extreme opposition to the act and their perceived superiority over the uncouth non-white world). To take a neutral stance on this issue is often difficult, especially for Western women who see it as form of oppression.

However, from the perspective of for example some of the native tribes of Africa, they, the women themselves see it as movement into womanhood and see it as a form of pride.

Caveatted, this is NOT always the case and pharaonic circumcision, regardless of culture is utterly wrong due to the established health problems (difficulty in urinating, intimacy and often fatal pregnancies).

The criteria I used for my human rights essay on this topic was not human rights itself as constructed from a Western perspective, because again this a knowledge set/schisms founded upon Christian theology. My criteria was Islam, which is more balanced than international legal norms. Having spoken to classical Islamic scholars on this topic (note, not the modernist "lets reform Islam-types"), they simple stated from an Islamic perspective, we look to guidance in the Sunnah. There are narrations which indicate to its permissibility and encouragement. However they are unanimous on the fact that it cannot violate her Islamic right to the enjoyment of her spouse. This rules out the injurious types of the circumcisions. In fact one scholar indicated that the narrations refer to the type which exposes the clitoris, thereby enabling the woman to climax more easily, since it is often the case that women are harder to climax than males; if the male cannot climax his wife than that is a violation of her Islamic right to her marital enjoyment.

I have given the Islamic perspective because you claim you wish to do a documentary on FC and then come on an Islamic forum for information - your inherent assumptions are revealing. I do hope you do not follow the status quo and dump all the blameworthy acts of this world on Muslims.

Regards

04-12-2012, 05:25 PM	#11
goolen4you Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 447 Senior Member	dear kara why don't you make a documentary focusing on Muslims who are against it and leave it at that, this is certainly a documentary that has not been made before. brothers and sisters - beware of the fact that this documentary is almost certainly going to be edited in a way that is not favourable to Islam and if you go and support sunnah circumcision your views will likely be conflated with support for haram Pharoic circumcision. I had to prepare an essay on this in the context of cultural relativism and what you have mentioned is quite accurate. However, Kara, I would further urge to be wary of of the terminology being used also, as FGM has a negative connotation and female circumcision less so. Again this is dependent upon the epistemology of the terminology with the first having its grounding in ethnocentrically biased research (if you study the atmosphere of most of the female writers/researchers opposed to FGM, they have a very condescending attitude, and from this stems their extreme opposition to the act and their perceived superiority over the uncouth non-white world). To take a neutral stance on this issue is often difficult, especially for Western women who see it as form of oppression. However, from the perspective of for example some of the native tribes of Africa, they, the women themselves see it as movement into womanhood and see it as a form of pride. Caveatted, this is NOT always the case and pharaonic circumcision, regardless of culture is utterly wrong due to the established health problems (difficulty in urinating, intimacy and often fatal pregnancies). The criteria I used for my human rights essay on this topic was not human rights itself as constructed from a Western perspective, because again this a knowledge set/schisms founded upon Christian theology. My criteria was Islam, which is more balanced than international legal norms. Having spoken to classical Islamic scholars on this topic (note, not the modernist "lets reform Islam-types"), they simple stated from an Islamic perspective, we look to guidance in the Sunnah. There are narrations which indicate to its permissibility and encouragement. However they are unanimous on the fact that it cannot violate her Islamic right to the enjoyment of her spouse. This rules out the injurious types of the circumcisions. In fact one scholar indicated that the narrations refer to the type which exposes the clitoris, thereby enabling the woman to climax more easily, since it is often the case that women are harder to climax than males; if the male cannot climax his wife than that is a violation of her Islamic right to her marital enjoyment. I have given the Islamic perspective because you claim you wish to do a documentary on FC and then come on an Islamic forum for information - your inherent assumptions are revealing. I do hope you do not follow the status quo and dump all the blameworthy acts of this world on Muslims. Regards
	Quote