DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - Shaykh Muhammad al-Yaqoubi

**layedgebiamma** · 06-13-2011, 03:56 AM

Brother Aspirer, one question.

Do we need Ibn Taymiyyah's approval of Tasawwuf practices, in order for them to be correct?
I would have thought you would ask "Where from the hadeeth of Nabee SAW are these practices approved of?". That would have been more worthy of your ideology.

You're not the first, or last one, to oppose tasawwuf.
The book by Hazrat Sheikh should have been sufficient for you (just in case you're wondering, I'm not from the sub-continent). If it was not, it's unfortunate.

My only advice, is that silence is better than mistakes in judgment.

If you are mistaken in your judgment, when standing in front of Allah ta'alaa, or after being buried in your grave, the sincerity in searching for truth will not be sufficient to justify criticism, slander etc...with silence however, one can not go wrong.

One of the principles of the people of tasawwuf, is for one to get busy in his own affairs, and in improving his spirituality...searching for the faults of the "Sufis" will not help you in that matter. Not to mention the hadeeth of Nabee SAW in Abu Dawud that prohibits from searching into the faults of the Muslims.

In your criciticism of people of Tasawwuf, people with your ideology have not left anyone from East to West.

May Allah ta'alaa grant us tawfeeq.

No, I don't see why we do, as Ibn Taymiyyah is not the be-all-end-all of Shaykhs; however, he is most certainly a figure who is viewed as a great man of the Sunnah by some and others believe him, as Taqi-ud-din al-Subki and Ibn Hajar al-Haytami did, that he was a man whose 'learning exceeded his intelligence' (I believe that is al-Subki's claim); so he is an interesting and important figure and I find it interesting to see which side of the fence he really lands on, since it's difficult to say.

I'm simply asking questions. I don't see why that's such a terrible thing. Nor am I stating that everything that requires doing is based around what Ibn Taymiyyah said or did, nor am I slandering the people of tasawwuf. If you read what I have said, I have not done any of those things- rather, simply questioned what paradigm of sufism that Ibn Taymiyyah would have fit into, in response to a claim by another brother.

Where have I slandered any of the people of tasawwuf? I have claimed that some of their practices have been criticized by prominent Hanbalis through the ages, and that many of them do not fit into the Hanbali paradigm of bid'ah. This is verifiable directly from works written by the Hanbali shaykhs I have cited.

Since when is asking questions equivalent to 'searching for faults,' or 'slander?' I would like an apology if that's the sort of tack you're taking, or the sort that you think I'm taking, because it's most certainly not true. If you'll notice, I've not said a single thing beyond stating that some people made takfeer of Ibn Arabi' (a truthful statement) and including Mansur Hallaj (given that he was executed for a statement, also verifiably true), and that some tariqahs engage in practices that could be termed as singing or dancing depending on one's definition of the term, which is also verifiably true.

What's more is, if a principle of the people of tasawwuf is what you have just stated, then why are there dozens of websites by the people of tasawwuf dedicated to attacking cartoon-caricatures of Shaykh Ibn Taymiyyah in which he is made out to be an anthromorphist bid'a-peddler of the highest order, or odd conspiracy theories passed around about Shaykh Muhammad ibn Abd-al Wahhab and his dawa? I don't really see how that fits in to what you just said.

EDIT - A final note: a good book to read is The Path of Sunnah by Sheikh Safraz Khan Safdar

(I believe he passed into the akhirah recently, if I am incorrect then let me know).

Ameen.

06-13-2011, 03:56 AM	#29
layedgebiamma Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 454 Senior Member	Brother Aspirer, one question. Do we need Ibn Taymiyyah's approval of Tasawwuf practices, in order for them to be correct? I would have thought you would ask "Where from the hadeeth of Nabee SAW are these practices approved of?". That would have been more worthy of your ideology. You're not the first, or last one, to oppose tasawwuf. The book by Hazrat Sheikh should have been sufficient for you (just in case you're wondering, I'm not from the sub-continent). If it was not, it's unfortunate. My only advice, is that silence is better than mistakes in judgment. If you are mistaken in your judgment, when standing in front of Allah ta'alaa, or after being buried in your grave, the sincerity in searching for truth will not be sufficient to justify criticism, slander etc...with silence however, one can not go wrong. One of the principles of the people of tasawwuf, is for one to get busy in his own affairs, and in improving his spirituality...searching for the faults of the "Sufis" will not help you in that matter. Not to mention the hadeeth of Nabee SAW in Abu Dawud that prohibits from searching into the faults of the Muslims. In your criciticism of people of Tasawwuf, people with your ideology have not left anyone from East to West. May Allah ta'alaa grant us tawfeeq. No, I don't see why we do, as Ibn Taymiyyah is not the be-all-end-all of Shaykhs; however, he is most certainly a figure who is viewed as a great man of the Sunnah by some and others believe him, as Taqi-ud-din al-Subki and Ibn Hajar al-Haytami did, that he was a man whose 'learning exceeded his intelligence' (I believe that is al-Subki's claim); so he is an interesting and important figure and I find it interesting to see which side of the fence he really lands on, since it's difficult to say. I'm simply asking questions. I don't see why that's such a terrible thing. Nor am I stating that everything that requires doing is based around what Ibn Taymiyyah said or did, nor am I slandering the people of tasawwuf. If you read what I have said, I have not done any of those things- rather, simply questioned what paradigm of sufism that Ibn Taymiyyah would have fit into, in response to a claim by another brother. Where have I slandered any of the people of tasawwuf? I have claimed that some of their practices have been criticized by prominent Hanbalis through the ages, and that many of them do not fit into the Hanbali paradigm of bid'ah. This is verifiable directly from works written by the Hanbali shaykhs I have cited. Since when is asking questions equivalent to 'searching for faults,' or 'slander?' I would like an apology if that's the sort of tack you're taking, or the sort that you think I'm taking, because it's most certainly not true. If you'll notice, I've not said a single thing beyond stating that some people made takfeer of Ibn Arabi' (a truthful statement) and including Mansur Hallaj (given that he was executed for a statement, also verifiably true), and that some tariqahs engage in practices that could be termed as singing or dancing depending on one's definition of the term, which is also verifiably true. What's more is, if a principle of the people of tasawwuf is what you have just stated, then why are there dozens of websites by the people of tasawwuf dedicated to attacking cartoon-caricatures of Shaykh Ibn Taymiyyah in which he is made out to be an anthromorphist bid'a-peddler of the highest order, or odd conspiracy theories passed around about Shaykh Muhammad ibn Abd-al Wahhab and his dawa? I don't really see how that fits in to what you just said. EDIT - A final note: a good book to read is The Path of Sunnah by Sheikh Safraz Khan Safdar (I believe he passed into the akhirah recently, if I am incorrect then let me know). Ameen.
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