[Hrennilasi]

السلام عليكم,

I've moved the posts from the other thread back here. I think that's better than derailing the Clearest Rational Argument thread. Also, the original poster can feel free to post, I don't think there's any need to delete these weak arguments for fear of creating doubts. If someone is prone to such doubts, they shouldn't be on the internet at all. Or at least stay clear of threads on these subjects.


Regarding the subject.

There are two relevant things to understand. First, the real motivation of the brother. Second, whether what he's saying is rationally sound.


Without knowing him personally, the best I can judge from the statements you've quoted here and the way you describe the situation, the "arguments" he's bringing are not logical proofs on the basis of which he made his mind, rather they are excuses. They are just justifications that he is using in his own mind to justify following his base desires. He did not sit down and logically figure out what was the correct way and follow that, rather, as a result of facing difficulties, pressure, etc., not having access to knowledge and true practice, and thus not experiencing any of the enjoyment of Islam, he got tired and decided to follow the path of least resistance.

The point is, when it was not logical argument that caused him to turn away, logical argument is probably not going to turn him back. The posts by DefendingIslam and others are relevant to this. Rather, what will make a difference is if he sees the true example of the prophetic character and behavior in your life and the life of his family and surroundings. This is what you need to focus on. It's the fact that Islam was just talk and no action that really turned him away, he needs to see Islam in action.

Regarding, the proper upbringing, and that is related to this, it is obviously too late for that aspect to be corrected now. But this should be an eye-opening lesson for all the parents. With respect, I disagree strongly with the respected brother's statement:
I personally doubt that such an upbringing is possible in this age, except for a few Muslims, since the world at large is saturated with disbelief and major sins, even in Muslim-majority countries, from the day we are born into this world. In order to undo this, even the born Muslims in most cases have to detoxify themselves from all they have learned, face ostracization from their families and society at large... in short almost convert to Islam anew, since they basically have to go against all of what they have learned up to that time and adopt a radically different way of thinking. (Actually, I suspect he did not mean it the way I'm taking it) Just for clarification, it's definitely not impossible to raise children in the Muslim fashion, and by that I don't mean some vague, "good", "Muslim" ideas about the goals of upbringing, but rather following the specific guidance in the Shariah on the exact method of bringing up children. These guidances are clear, simple, and applicable and useful in every societal situation.