DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - Hamza Yusuf on the Lahori Ahmadis / Qadianis

**VanDerSmok** · 10-07-2012, 08:52 PM

The footnote is too little to make any conclusion. It only mentions a factual point that the aim is no longer achieved. It does not go beyond that to say "therefore the ruling is over ridden. ". Someone should go question it on his website as to what he intended, rather than draw conclusions here.

Except the 'aim' here is not obvious from the text. Who knows what the aim is? Maybe it's ta'abuddi.

What's more, two of Hamza Yusuf's associates - Abdul-Hakim Murad and Abdullah ibn Hamid Ali, both argue against the hadd for riddah.

Then in this video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naEj915VU20

Hamza Yusuf said (5:20): "The Prophet

never... nobody during his lifetime was killed for apostasy. And there are apostasy laws, just like in Catholicism [...] there's one hadith that they base this on, but there are other hadiths, and they weren't in agreement on this. One of the greatest scholars of Islam (inaudible) did not believe there should be a capital punishment for this."

And he said (7:21) "The other thing that's very problematic in Islamic tradition, and I have to say this, you know, full disclosure - Islamic tradition is not as amenable as other traditions are to reformation. Because the Islamic tradition sees itself as a reformation [...] there are many verses saying 'Don't change your religion.' As Muslims, it's much more difficult for us. We have to find the dissenting opinions. Those dissenting opinions are there, and they need to be brought to the fore-front, because right now they are in the background. [...] And this is what I try to do."

A lot of people accuse Salafis of bringing ancient, abandoned opinions to the fore-front. Where's the consistency? Accuse everyone who does it or keep silent.

10-07-2012, 08:52 PM	#18
VanDerSmok Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 521 Senior Member	The footnote is too little to make any conclusion. It only mentions a factual point that the aim is no longer achieved. It does not go beyond that to say "therefore the ruling is over ridden. ". Someone should go question it on his website as to what he intended, rather than draw conclusions here. Except the 'aim' here is not obvious from the text. Who knows what the aim is? Maybe it's ta'abuddi. What's more, two of Hamza Yusuf's associates - Abdul-Hakim Murad and Abdullah ibn Hamid Ali, both argue against the hadd for riddah. Then in this video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naEj915VU20 Hamza Yusuf said (5:20): "The Prophet never... nobody during his lifetime was killed for apostasy. And there are apostasy laws, just like in Catholicism [...] there's one hadith that they base this on, but there are other hadiths, and they weren't in agreement on this. One of the greatest scholars of Islam (inaudible) did not believe there should be a capital punishment for this." And he said (7:21) "The other thing that's very problematic in Islamic tradition, and I have to say this, you know, full disclosure - Islamic tradition is not as amenable as other traditions are to reformation. Because the Islamic tradition sees itself as a reformation [...] there are many verses saying 'Don't change your religion.' As Muslims, it's much more difficult for us. We have to find the dissenting opinions. Those dissenting opinions are there, and they need to be brought to the fore-front, because right now they are in the background. [...] And this is what I try to do." A lot of people accuse Salafis of bringing ancient, abandoned opinions to the fore-front. Where's the consistency? Accuse everyone who does it or keep silent.
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