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Old 11-22-2005, 08:37 PM   #2
AALee

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Oct 2005
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Hmm..there are a few things that needs a little more explanation. But first, to answer you questions:

My question is why? weren't they assassins? ruthless hitmans?

The Shinsengumi, first and foremost, functions as a police force that kept the peace during the Bakumatsu (End of the Shogunate; not the Meiji era). They're like the NYPD or SWAT, if you may, but they certainly were not in it out of malice. Yes, they were pro-Tokugawa, and yes they have been known to cause fear amongst the townsfolk, but one must understand that just because history dictates that it was their faction that lost in the war--and, in terms of more relative media, that a certain Saitoh Hajime and Okita Souji were after the head of the hitokiri-turned-hero Himura Kenshin--does not necessesarily conclude that they should be viewed so negatively. Their history is often misconstrued by popular wisdom that is sometimes rather differently (not wrongly, mind you) influenced.

Admittedly, there was a time when the group were reputd to be "ruthless" killers. However, this was when Serizawa Kamo was still their commander; they were not even called Shinsengumi then. They were the Roshigumi, hence where the nickname "Miburoshi" or "Miburo" was derived from. It was only when Kondo assumed the position of Commander after Serizawa's death that they became the Shinsengumi.

They were not assassins, though it would be presumptious to say that they were not capable of doing so (as is with the case with Serizawa's assassination who was assassinated under the order of Aizu's daimyo, Matsudaira Katamori), but this was not their primary--nor was it their--purpose. During those times, it was the hitokiri that was responsible for assassinations. They do have, however, shinobi: spies, in the english language (such as Yamazaki Susumu). And as such, they were the eyes and ears of the Shinsengumi that infiltrated suspicious circles and foil their attempts to disrupt the peace that the group so fiercely protected.

were they good guys or bad guys? I've heard that they were like the police in the meiji era, but, was their duty to kill samurais? Samurais who were against the "new era" and wanted to keep their tradition and culture and didn't want to 'weternize'.

I would have to agree with KenShi_Job in what he said that there is "no such thing as absolute line for good guy or bad guy...They are not saints for sure." But what is also true is that they stayed true to their purpose and did what they were supposed to do.

While it is certain that many of them did not like the idea of a westernized Japan, they weren't the ones who instigated riots either. They were the ones who contained these incidents from blowing way out of proportion. Samurai weren't the only ones that were capable of such deeds, but since it was their ranks that were most vocal and most visible, it's not hard to see why majority of their most wanted list are samurai.

The popularity of the group did not depend on one man alone. It depended on the fact that they were friends and stayed true in their loyalty despite how difficult things became for them. Success depends on the cohesiveness of a unit and their discipline, and these are important factors why they functioned so well and gained the status that they were in. Despite their awful start (that unfortunately hounded them to the very end), what they did afterwards did outweigh the misdeeds that were done by Serizawa Kamo and Niimi Nishiki, not Yamanami. (And Yamanami was not a captain; he was also a Vice-Commander. If Hijikata Toshizowas the right hand mand of Kondo Isami, Yamanami Heisuke was the left hand man. Also, he was NOT assassinated behind Kondo's back as it was Kondo's group who carried out the job. I believe it was Kondo himself, Hijikata, Okita, Ito and Yamanami; I'm not sure. But it certainly was NOT without Kondo's knowledge.)

The Shinsengumi attacked people in groups another reason they lived up to their nickname as wolves.

They didn't attack randomly in "packs". They patroled around the city in groups of two or three's on shifting schedules; sometimes even more depending on where they were going. So when a disturbance occurs, naturally there would be some sort of back up hence why they seemed to be found in numbers.

They were heroes in japan because they adhered to the strict code of samurai ethics and if not they were punished by their superiors.

Not so severely. There were certain sanctions for certain misdeeds, that's for sure.

Kondou Isami was the leader of the Shinsengumi until Hijikata took over.

Hijikata NEVER took over Kondo's leadership. You could say that Kondo was the brains; Hijikata, the muscle. Basically, Kondo was active with politics of the time. He was the guy who went out and met with the high-ups. Hijikata was the only one under him, so he dealt with the day-to-day functions. The high-ups of those times usually had lots of men to do this for them, so Kondo leaving it to Hijikata was not unusual, but rather expected. What was unusual was Hijikata handling it all alone. It made the group more efficient than most at that time because only one person had to reach a decision. However it put Hijikata in the difficult position of not being able to make a mistake. The dirty part of the job was the guys lower down had to take responsibility to save the boss' face. But in general, several people were to blame and could get off rather easy. Hijikata had no one to take the blame with him and might have had to commit seppuku for the slightest mistake. If he was strict and careful, it was for this reason. And that's also why Kondo would have not been dealing with the day-to-day stuff.. To protect him if something did happen. Nevertheless, when it really mattered, he was in charge.

Hijikata would kill anyone more mercilessly than his predecessor if they didn't follow the rules of the Shinsengumi. I believe their was a story that said he even killed one of his best friends.

If they did "cut people down immediately", how did they question so many people about the events that lead up to Ikedaya? They only detained those they captured or surrendered. The only time they cut down anyone was when they resisted arrest or put up a fight. It was all necessary brutality, but who wasn't brutal during the Bakumatsu? They studied the way of the sword, which is highly stylized murder.

Also, the "Dreaded Articles" or "Kyokuchu Hatto" were five basic rules that was based on the principles of Bushido. It was strict, yes, but only applied to those foolish enough to turn their backs against the Shinsengumi. However, it is said that this was only a fabrication by a certain historian namend Shimosawa Kan. He claimed to have found this in Saitoh's notes, but nobody seemed to have even seen the documents.

While it is a commonly accepted idea that leaving the group was tantamount to seppuku, they did actually let people leave. Tani Mantaro and Abe Juro both left the group at one time or another. Abe quit after Serizawa's death. He did NOT hide from them, because he stayed in Osaka at the Tani dojo while all three Tani brothers were still part of the group. So he had permission to leave.

Tani Mantaro got permission to leave after the death of his older brother, Capt. Tani Sanjuro. Again, he did not hide but went back to his dojo in Osaka. The very fact that Takeda approached them about his leaving under the guise that he wanted to go home was proof that they did in fact let people who wanted to go leave. They only prevented it in the cases like takeda's or Ito's where they knew the person was up to something.

As for the additional rules that they should commit seppuku when wounded? Harada was slightly injured on several occasions. Oishi was injured at least once or twice as well... They were not ordered to kill themselves. Think about it...Souji was said to have collapsed during the Ikedaya-jiken. If he did, then the whole 1st unit would have been wiped out, ne?

For more information on the Shinsengumi, go to Shinsengumi no Makoto. It has a very comprehensive database on the personas of the ten captains and other people that constituted the group.

Hope that helps.
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