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**NickGrass** · 01-05-2011, 05:45 AM

in having freedom of those things, you also get peace and joy,

That's it Balgore,

but I think Craig has posted it very well:

All that is left is coolness and peace

Just an additional comment,

Saccavibhanga Sutta (MN 141) gives you a wide exposition of the Four Noble Truths. Its a good place to start the understanding and practice of the Dhamma. Along the Sutta there is an exposition of the Eightfold Noble Path step by step.

is it possible to attain enlightenment without fully following the noble eightfold path?

The Eight Fold is much more a kind of organism than a mechanism. It is convenient to watch through it carefully and see that all the steps are a whole. We can not be selective. The practice of one needs the practice of the others. It is needed a carefull practice in each of it's steps or stages of realization. The Dhamma is a living being. Its a way of life; a way to awake, to see things as they really are. There is a sutta, a wonderfull one, quoted in a thread by Craig; it is the Maha-Assapura Sutta (MN 39) which opens wonderfully...

in having freedom of those things, you also get peace and joy,

when we are talking about pace and joy we need to have in mind this kind of realization through what is meant by Right Concentration, a core aspect for meditative skills. To be joyfull and in peace is a good indicator of a right understanding and practice of Dhamma.

"And what is right concentration? Herein a monk aloof from sense desires, aloof from unwholesome thoughts, attains to and abides in the first meditative absorption (jhana) which is detachment-born and accompanied by applied thought, sustained thought, joy, and bliss.

"By allaying applied and sustained thought he attains to, and abides in the second jhana which is inner tranquillity, which is unification (of the mind), devoid of applied and sustained thought, and which has joy and bliss.

"By detachment from joy he dwells in equanimity, mindful, and with clear comprehension and enjoys bliss in body, and attains to and abides in the third jhana which the noble ones (ariyas) call: 'Dwelling in equanimity, mindfulness, and bliss.'

"By giving up of bliss and suffering, by the disappearance already of joy and sorrow, he attains to, and abides in the fourth jhana, which is neither suffering nor bliss, and which is the purity of equanimity-mindfulness. This is called right concentration.

Note here the condition for right concentration: "Aloof from sense desires and unwholesome thoughts" and then the description of the four mental states that are reached through meditation which goes from joy and bliss to equanimity mindfulness where Craig has told as coolness and peace in his own words.

Meditation is a core aspect for the understanding and practice of the Buddha Dhamma.

01-05-2011, 05:45 AM	#20
NickGrass Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 585 Senior Member	in having freedom of those things, you also get peace and joy, That's it Balgore, but I think Craig has posted it very well: All that is left is coolness and peace Just an additional comment, Saccavibhanga Sutta (MN 141) gives you a wide exposition of the Four Noble Truths. Its a good place to start the understanding and practice of the Dhamma. Along the Sutta there is an exposition of the Eightfold Noble Path step by step. is it possible to attain enlightenment without fully following the noble eightfold path? The Eight Fold is much more a kind of organism than a mechanism. It is convenient to watch through it carefully and see that all the steps are a whole. We can not be selective. The practice of one needs the practice of the others. It is needed a carefull practice in each of it's steps or stages of realization. The Dhamma is a living being. Its a way of life; a way to awake, to see things as they really are. There is a sutta, a wonderfull one, quoted in a thread by Craig; it is the Maha-Assapura Sutta (MN 39) which opens wonderfully... in having freedom of those things, you also get peace and joy, when we are talking about pace and joy we need to have in mind this kind of realization through what is meant by Right Concentration, a core aspect for meditative skills. To be joyfull and in peace is a good indicator of a right understanding and practice of Dhamma. "And what is right concentration? Herein a monk aloof from sense desires, aloof from unwholesome thoughts, attains to and abides in the first meditative absorption (jhana) which is detachment-born and accompanied by applied thought, sustained thought, joy, and bliss. "By allaying applied and sustained thought he attains to, and abides in the second jhana which is inner tranquillity, which is unification (of the mind), devoid of applied and sustained thought, and which has joy and bliss. "By detachment from joy he dwells in equanimity, mindful, and with clear comprehension and enjoys bliss in body, and attains to and abides in the third jhana which the noble ones (ariyas) call: 'Dwelling in equanimity, mindfulness, and bliss.' "By giving up of bliss and suffering, by the disappearance already of joy and sorrow, he attains to, and abides in the fourth jhana, which is neither suffering nor bliss, and which is the purity of equanimity-mindfulness. This is called right concentration. Note here the condition for right concentration: "Aloof from sense desires and unwholesome thoughts" and then the description of the four mental states that are reached through meditation which goes from joy and bliss to equanimity mindfulness where Craig has told as coolness and peace in his own words. Meditation is a core aspect for the understanding and practice of the Buddha Dhamma.
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