DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - Spiritual harms of argumentation and debates

**lapInsalm** · 12-15-2011, 02:38 PM

http://www.muftisays.com/forums/peop...5/debates.html
Con't By Mufti Taqi Usmani:

04:42 – If something needs to be said, then (do it in such a way) and say it in a way such as desiring to seek the truth. With the genuine desire to seek knowledge, speak to the other person, state your own position [on a matter], listen to the other person's position, if you understand it, accept it, if you don't understand it, then leave it be, that's it. Don't argue.

05:00 – People [keep sending] to me, I don't know, morning and evening, telephone [messages], letters, and (emails), that, “Sahab, I get into an argument with so and so person, and [he] delivers a certain proof. What reply (rebuttal) should I present in [return]”. So you [all] tell me, if such a system [of argument and rebuttal] remains in place, that the other person delivers a proof, then you ask me for a rebuttal and present it to him, then he (states another proof [or reply to your rebuttal of his proof], then you ask me again [and so on and so forth]. What (kind of a system is this)? The straight of it is that Argument & Debate, just don't do it at all What you know to be Haqq, state it once, and if the other person accepts, (unintelligible) or doesn't accept, [idiom – to you is whatever you know and understand]. What (each) has come to understand, that is what they should accept. There is no need to move past this point [to additional argumentation].

05:44 – Take the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad (Sallalahu alaihe wassalam), that,

“You are truthful, you are on Haqq, even then, don't participate in Argument & Debate.”

This became a veritable talent [avoiding argumentation] of his; an incredible talent. [He participated] in intellectual debate [with a scholar] and [had the talent to] give the other person (leeway). This skill [of reserved argumentation] began to be known as [a veritable] talent [in its own right].

06:11 – (Mufti Taqi Uthmani mentioned the names of some of his teachers at Dar-ul-Uloom Deoband who have since passed on, may Allah increase their ranks in the Aakhirah), so at the time, Hadhrat (one of his teachers) had a great passion, regarding the deviant sects / [groups], in intellectual debates with them. And for a period of time, he kept up his system of intellectual debates with them. And when he used to go [to debate with them] he used to really defeat them [in their arguments]. Allah had blessed him with the gift of eloquent speech. But after some time, Hadhrat stated himself, “After that [period of debating], my heart turned away from this [debating], it turned away so much, that now, in no way am I prepared to participate in intellectual debates with anyone. [This is] due to the fact that whenever I used to debate, I would feel a [spiritual] darkness in my heart. Debating would cause a [spiritual] darkness in my heart.”

12-15-2011, 02:38 PM	#16
lapInsalm Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 409 Senior Member	http://www.muftisays.com/forums/peop...5/debates.html Con't By Mufti Taqi Usmani: 04:42 – If something needs to be said, then (do it in such a way) and say it in a way such as desiring to seek the truth. With the genuine desire to seek knowledge, speak to the other person, state your own position [on a matter], listen to the other person's position, if you understand it, accept it, if you don't understand it, then leave it be, that's it. Don't argue. 05:00 – People [keep sending] to me, I don't know, morning and evening, telephone [messages], letters, and (emails), that, “Sahab, I get into an argument with so and so person, and [he] delivers a certain proof. What reply (rebuttal) should I present in [return]”. So you [all] tell me, if such a system [of argument and rebuttal] remains in place, that the other person delivers a proof, then you ask me for a rebuttal and present it to him, then he (states another proof [or reply to your rebuttal of his proof], then you ask me again [and so on and so forth]. What (kind of a system is this)? The straight of it is that Argument & Debate, just don't do it at all What you know to be Haqq, state it once, and if the other person accepts, (unintelligible) or doesn't accept, [idiom – to you is whatever you know and understand]. What (each) has come to understand, that is what they should accept. There is no need to move past this point [to additional argumentation]. 05:44 – Take the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad (Sallalahu alaihe wassalam), that, “You are truthful, you are on Haqq, even then, don't participate in Argument & Debate.” This became a veritable talent [avoiding argumentation] of his; an incredible talent. [He participated] in intellectual debate [with a scholar] and [had the talent to] give the other person (leeway). This skill [of reserved argumentation] began to be known as [a veritable] talent [in its own right]. 06:11 – (Mufti Taqi Uthmani mentioned the names of some of his teachers at Dar-ul-Uloom Deoband who have since passed on, may Allah increase their ranks in the Aakhirah), so at the time, Hadhrat (one of his teachers) had a great passion, regarding the deviant sects / [groups], in intellectual debates with them. And for a period of time, he kept up his system of intellectual debates with them. And when he used to go [to debate with them] he used to really defeat them [in their arguments]. Allah had blessed him with the gift of eloquent speech. But after some time, Hadhrat stated himself, “After that [period of debating], my heart turned away from this [debating], it turned away so much, that now, in no way am I prepared to participate in intellectual debates with anyone. [This is] due to the fact that whenever I used to debate, I would feel a [spiritual] darkness in my heart. Debating would cause a [spiritual] darkness in my heart.”
	Quote