DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post

**Evoncalabbalo** · 06-22-2012, 10:27 PM

The issue of predestination is a philosophical conundrum as well and it leads to some perplexing questions which can only be sorted out through belief in the Almighty. So why should one feel that he has a free will when everything around us is so fixed? This fixation encompasses each and everything and their is no exception to that. The earth revolves around the sun through a constant speed and it can not be altered by a fragment of a second. The trees around us are made of hydrocarbons and nothing other than hydrocarbons can form the trees. The force of gravity acts in downward direction with a magnitude of 9.8 m/s2 and it can not be any other way around. So we live in a fixed universe. Liver produces bile and stomach produces Gastric. None of these can be the other way around , none of these can be different and none of these realities can have alternate descriptions.

The only thing which assures a human being to be a special enough to be out of this fixation is his free will. We intend to do something and execute our intentions in a free way. This free will seems to be random enough to transcend the orderly fixation around us. However , deep down this free will is just an illusion and religion has nothing to do with this illusion. Suppose there is a person who freely wills to go for a bank robbery. He has freely intended to do so and it seems that due to this free intention , the person is out of the game of fixation. However , their is a deep disciplined line of cause and effect governing the intention of this person. This man decided to go for a robbery as he saw his daughter weeping. His daughter was weeping because she could not buy her desired cell phone. The thought of that desired cell phone came into the mind of his daughter only when she saw that cell phone in the hands of her friend.her friend thought of buying that cell phone only when she saw it in an add on TV. Her friend has bought that cell phone because her father could pay for. Her father could pay for it because he was wealthy enough. He was wealthy enough because his parents had properly educated him in the right discipline. His parents had properly educated him because they had attended some good educational seminars about which a friend of them had informed them............. one can add much to it.

So the person who apparently seems to have a free will to intend for a robbery is just a participant in a chain of cause and effect. It was already fixed somewhere in the distant past and he did not have any option/choice in that. His free will is just an illusion. If it is so then whats the way out? The only way out is to believe that all the good and bad comes from the Almighty. He is just and he knows how much justly have i used the amount of my intention in which i am free. He knows how much i deserve and accordingly i become a participant in a good or bad chain of cause and effect.

Your creating a materialist narrative of freewill that is filled with errors.

- True nature moves in directed way, yet we see undirectedness in Quantum mechanics.
- True nature you see moves in a directed way, but your soul is of a quality different from the material object you see and hence to project it onto the soul is also a error.
- True when a person makes a decision he has several issues that are fixated around him from past history, yet that does not mean his freewill was absent in the past history. Moreover, Freewill has to by neccssity operate on fixated things otherwise its impossible to make a decision if everything is just shifting around in fluidity and no directedness. In other words,there has to be some level of fixity in order for a person to rationally conceive the world around him and make a decision hence forth. In order to answer a question the question has to be fixed and not something that randomly shuffles every second. So the whole casuality thing you bring means nothing and implies nothing and is based on borrowing pseudo scientific materialist dilemmas..

Freewill is not a illusion. Its intuition and pre-inbuilt and known from birth, just as was the intuitive ability to see and hear. Calling it a illusion is self refuting and implies your comment itself is a illusion. Its also absurd for how could a person with no freewill even think about freewill ? Its because you taste freewill that you are capable of questioning it and conceptualize it.

So freewill is intuitive knowledge and impossible to reject. We also learn from revelation that pre-destination is true. And we also know from revelation that we are held accountable for our actions. There are several ways in which compatibility between them was explained by scholars whoch i will not go into.

For a laymen its enough to accept it and leave it details to Allah. A laymen is born with freewill and there is no reason for him to suddenly reject it as an illusion. With that inborn free will the laymen is made accountable for his actions by Allah. At the same time we are to believe in Qadr and hence always remind yourself of Allah's Supreme Will and nothing happens without Allah's Supreme Will and therefore acknowledge your ultimate servitude and humility towards Allah.

06-22-2012, 10:27 PM	#12
Evoncalabbalo Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 572 Senior Member	The issue of predestination is a philosophical conundrum as well and it leads to some perplexing questions which can only be sorted out through belief in the Almighty. So why should one feel that he has a free will when everything around us is so fixed? This fixation encompasses each and everything and their is no exception to that. The earth revolves around the sun through a constant speed and it can not be altered by a fragment of a second. The trees around us are made of hydrocarbons and nothing other than hydrocarbons can form the trees. The force of gravity acts in downward direction with a magnitude of 9.8 m/s2 and it can not be any other way around. So we live in a fixed universe. Liver produces bile and stomach produces Gastric. None of these can be the other way around , none of these can be different and none of these realities can have alternate descriptions. The only thing which assures a human being to be a special enough to be out of this fixation is his free will. We intend to do something and execute our intentions in a free way. This free will seems to be random enough to transcend the orderly fixation around us. However , deep down this free will is just an illusion and religion has nothing to do with this illusion. Suppose there is a person who freely wills to go for a bank robbery. He has freely intended to do so and it seems that due to this free intention , the person is out of the game of fixation. However , their is a deep disciplined line of cause and effect governing the intention of this person. This man decided to go for a robbery as he saw his daughter weeping. His daughter was weeping because she could not buy her desired cell phone. The thought of that desired cell phone came into the mind of his daughter only when she saw that cell phone in the hands of her friend.her friend thought of buying that cell phone only when she saw it in an add on TV. Her friend has bought that cell phone because her father could pay for. Her father could pay for it because he was wealthy enough. He was wealthy enough because his parents had properly educated him in the right discipline. His parents had properly educated him because they had attended some good educational seminars about which a friend of them had informed them............. one can add much to it. So the person who apparently seems to have a free will to intend for a robbery is just a participant in a chain of cause and effect. It was already fixed somewhere in the distant past and he did not have any option/choice in that. His free will is just an illusion. If it is so then whats the way out? The only way out is to believe that all the good and bad comes from the Almighty. He is just and he knows how much justly have i used the amount of my intention in which i am free. He knows how much i deserve and accordingly i become a participant in a good or bad chain of cause and effect. Your creating a materialist narrative of freewill that is filled with errors. - True nature moves in directed way, yet we see undirectedness in Quantum mechanics. - True nature you see moves in a directed way, but your soul is of a quality different from the material object you see and hence to project it onto the soul is also a error. - True when a person makes a decision he has several issues that are fixated around him from past history, yet that does not mean his freewill was absent in the past history. Moreover, Freewill has to by neccssity operate on fixated things otherwise its impossible to make a decision if everything is just shifting around in fluidity and no directedness. In other words,there has to be some level of fixity in order for a person to rationally conceive the world around him and make a decision hence forth. In order to answer a question the question has to be fixed and not something that randomly shuffles every second. So the whole casuality thing you bring means nothing and implies nothing and is based on borrowing pseudo scientific materialist dilemmas.. Freewill is not a illusion. Its intuition and pre-inbuilt and known from birth, just as was the intuitive ability to see and hear. Calling it a illusion is self refuting and implies your comment itself is a illusion. Its also absurd for how could a person with no freewill even think about freewill ? Its because you taste freewill that you are capable of questioning it and conceptualize it. So freewill is intuitive knowledge and impossible to reject. We also learn from revelation that pre-destination is true. And we also know from revelation that we are held accountable for our actions. There are several ways in which compatibility between them was explained by scholars whoch i will not go into. For a laymen its enough to accept it and leave it details to Allah. A laymen is born with freewill and there is no reason for him to suddenly reject it as an illusion. With that inborn free will the laymen is made accountable for his actions by Allah. At the same time we are to believe in Qadr and hence always remind yourself of Allah's Supreme Will and nothing happens without Allah's Supreme Will and therefore acknowledge your ultimate servitude and humility towards Allah.
	Quote