DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - barelvi and deobandi movements' views about islamic govt

**meencegic** · 06-22-2012, 10:39 AM

are the views compatible?
are they the same?
if not, how different?

plus, is it an accepted ruling from both sides that one cannot pray behind the other in jamaat? or are there any minor opinions that say otherwise?

why am i asking the second question:
from a secular's article:
"Pray tell: Photograph showing late Pir Pagara talking to the press at the Karachi Press Club in 1977. Pagara was heading a right-wing movement against the Z. A. Bhutto regime.
Here he is seen talking to the press (surrounded by some members of the Jamat-i-Islami, Jamat Ulema Islam and Jamiat Ulema Pakistan).
The men then got up to say their evening prayers.
However, a commotion broke out between the religious leaders of the movement when JI and JUI men refused to pray behind JUP leader, Shah Noorani.
JUI was inclined towards Sunni Deobandi school of thought whereas Noorani was from the pro-Barelvi JUP. Though united in their opposition to Bhutto’s ‘socialism’, both men thought the other was a ‘misguided Muslim.’

this isnt helpful. liberals, apologists, modernists always quote this.

important thing is: can they unite if there is an islamic shariah govt in pakistan even if they cant pray behind one another?

JI not praying behind Noorani? It is surprising as JI's can even pray behind Shias so whats the big deal about Barelvis? Shah Ahmad Noorani ra was the last (and may be the first) sensible person who was called barelvi. Not only with the deobandis but Shah Ahmad Noorani was a close friend of Allama Ehsaan Elahi zaheer ra who was the uncrowned king of Ahli Hadees in Pakistan then. Shah Ahmad Noorani ra not only united stood united with the rest of the Islamic groups in the movement against Qadyanis but he struggled against Bhutto with them as well. His political party known as JUP has become irrelevant and ignorable now. It has split into many fragments and has no political importance. Shah Anas Noorani and Sahibzada Abul Zubair of JUP do appear in the rallies of Islamic parties even now.

The rest of the barelvis are a mess when it comes to Islamic government and politics. The most venomous attacks on the first and most notable freedom fighter against the british was Shah Ismaail Shaheed ra. He was the first notable Muslim to have a plane to get rid of the british regime and establish Khilafat in the subcontinent. The worthless barelvi scholars of the past and present have left no stone unturned to abuse him and castigate him. Calling him kaffir is and sending lanat on him is something usual. The opposition of Jihaad , impracticality and passiveness is innate in the religion of Raza khan.

The best example of Barelvis opposition towards Islam and Islamic system surfaced during the swat fiasco. The Taliban are Hanafis and they wanted to establish Islamic system in Swat. Ofcourse Fiqh e hanafi was going to be implemented there but they barelvis opposed it. They staged rallies against it. In a TV hosted by Dr Shahid masood , the chairman of Sunni tehreek was asked that why does he oppose the Islamic system in Taliban when he himself is a Hanafi and Taliban are going to implement the Hanafi Fiqh? The response was that Taliban belong to an evil sect and nothing from the evil can be accepted. The Same Barelvi Suuni Tehreek has sided with Shias against Deobandis in Karachi. The same chief barelvi tehreek surprisingly sided with a liberal fascist lady of Pakistan , Farzana Bari , against Maulana Ahmad Ludyanvi db of Sipaah e Sahaba.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPPGDk01ZIA

As far as praying behind Deobandis , watch this one and keep in mind that the dork appearing in the video is one of the most orthodox Raza khani http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjVo4...eature=related . Here is a "Soft" barelvi issuing Fatwa against praying behind Deobandis. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9Dsk9mtGC8

06-22-2012, 10:39 AM	#2
meencegic Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 375 Senior Member	are the views compatible? are they the same? if not, how different? plus, is it an accepted ruling from both sides that one cannot pray behind the other in jamaat? or are there any minor opinions that say otherwise? why am i asking the second question: from a secular's article: "Pray tell: Photograph showing late Pir Pagara talking to the press at the Karachi Press Club in 1977. Pagara was heading a right-wing movement against the Z. A. Bhutto regime. Here he is seen talking to the press (surrounded by some members of the Jamat-i-Islami, Jamat Ulema Islam and Jamiat Ulema Pakistan). The men then got up to say their evening prayers. However, a commotion broke out between the religious leaders of the movement when JI and JUI men refused to pray behind JUP leader, Shah Noorani. JUI was inclined towards Sunni Deobandi school of thought whereas Noorani was from the pro-Barelvi JUP. Though united in their opposition to Bhutto’s ‘socialism’, both men thought the other was a ‘misguided Muslim.’ this isnt helpful. liberals, apologists, modernists always quote this. important thing is: can they unite if there is an islamic shariah govt in pakistan even if they cant pray behind one another? JI not praying behind Noorani? It is surprising as JI's can even pray behind Shias so whats the big deal about Barelvis? Shah Ahmad Noorani ra was the last (and may be the first) sensible person who was called barelvi. Not only with the deobandis but Shah Ahmad Noorani was a close friend of Allama Ehsaan Elahi zaheer ra who was the uncrowned king of Ahli Hadees in Pakistan then. Shah Ahmad Noorani ra not only united stood united with the rest of the Islamic groups in the movement against Qadyanis but he struggled against Bhutto with them as well. His political party known as JUP has become irrelevant and ignorable now. It has split into many fragments and has no political importance. Shah Anas Noorani and Sahibzada Abul Zubair of JUP do appear in the rallies of Islamic parties even now. The rest of the barelvis are a mess when it comes to Islamic government and politics. The most venomous attacks on the first and most notable freedom fighter against the british was Shah Ismaail Shaheed ra. He was the first notable Muslim to have a plane to get rid of the british regime and establish Khilafat in the subcontinent. The worthless barelvi scholars of the past and present have left no stone unturned to abuse him and castigate him. Calling him kaffir is and sending lanat on him is something usual. The opposition of Jihaad , impracticality and passiveness is innate in the religion of Raza khan. The best example of Barelvis opposition towards Islam and Islamic system surfaced during the swat fiasco. The Taliban are Hanafis and they wanted to establish Islamic system in Swat. Ofcourse Fiqh e hanafi was going to be implemented there but they barelvis opposed it. They staged rallies against it. In a TV hosted by Dr Shahid masood , the chairman of Sunni tehreek was asked that why does he oppose the Islamic system in Taliban when he himself is a Hanafi and Taliban are going to implement the Hanafi Fiqh? The response was that Taliban belong to an evil sect and nothing from the evil can be accepted. The Same Barelvi Suuni Tehreek has sided with Shias against Deobandis in Karachi. The same chief barelvi tehreek surprisingly sided with a liberal fascist lady of Pakistan , Farzana Bari , against Maulana Ahmad Ludyanvi db of Sipaah e Sahaba.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPPGDk01ZIA As far as praying behind Deobandis , watch this one and keep in mind that the dork appearing in the video is one of the most orthodox Raza khani http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjVo4...eature=related . Here is a "Soft" barelvi issuing Fatwa against praying behind Deobandis. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9Dsk9mtGC8
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