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**TolleyBoymn** · 11-12-2007, 12:59 AM

Originally posted by Cort Haus
Progressive income tax, social security, and national health care are social democratic reforms, not communist. No way bud. Economic equality was a socialist idea way before there were social democrats. All of those things can not be achieved through the market. Only government involvement can achieve them. That's communism.
All that has to happen now to achieve a communist society is market failure on a large scale.

And the proletariate will somehow magically self-organise to seize and control the means of production? Large scale market failures without appropriate levels of class-consciousness and an influential vanguard leadership are more likely to yield a degeneration into fascism. Why do you say that? I don't think class-consciousness is as important as democratic minded citizens.

11-12-2007, 12:59 AM	#10
TolleyBoymn Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 459 Senior Member	Originally posted by Cort Haus Progressive income tax, social security, and national health care are social democratic reforms, not communist. No way bud. Economic equality was a socialist idea way before there were social democrats. All of those things can not be achieved through the market. Only government involvement can achieve them. That's communism. All that has to happen now to achieve a communist society is market failure on a large scale. And the proletariate will somehow magically self-organise to seize and control the means of production? Large scale market failures without appropriate levels of class-consciousness and an influential vanguard leadership are more likely to yield a degeneration into fascism. Why do you say that? I don't think class-consciousness is as important as democratic minded citizens.
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