[inchaaruutaa]

What a stupid threat title "Christianity should stay out of Asia" Christianity, Islam and judaism came from Asia. Israel and the mid east is located in Asia right?

[zatronanec]

I know what "christianity" did to the Americans.

Christianity is a religion, not an empire. Read more and open less threads like this one.

[Yinekol]

What a stupid threat title "Christianity should stay out of Asia" Christianity, Islam and judaism came from Asia. Israel and the mid east is located in Asia right?

He basically means East Asia.

[alias]

I think in Asia Christianity has been associated by Western colonial expansionism... I know that it was the case in China.
For instance, it's historically attested that the 19th-century Taiping Rebellion led by Hong Xiuquan, one of the bloodiest civil wars in China (you have to take a look at the numbers of deaths, the country where I live in right now hasn't that much of overall population), was literally manufactured by Western Christian missionaries, so it may have its influence on the popular negative stereotypes about the religion held by (some) Chinese.

[Z2sc8gEz]

Christianity is a religion, not an empire. Read more and open less threads like this one.

It's the pope and several other christian autorities who said Blacks and Amerindians didn't have soul.

[wsbizwsa]

It's the pope and several other christian autorities who said Blacks and Amerindians didn't have soul.

Most of the time Popes are not even Christians, they are just kings like any other. If you want to understand what real Christianity is, read the Bible.
Besides, Amerindians have always been considered humans by the Catholic Church. The Pope clearly stated that Amerindians have souls in its document Sublimis Deus, published in 1537.

Here you have the text of Sublimis Deus:

"
Sublimus Dei

Pope Paul III (Topic: the enslavement and evangelization of Indians)

To all faithful Christians to whom this writing may come, health in Christ our Lord and the apostolic benediction.

The sublime God so loved the human race that He created man in such wise that he might participate, not only in the good that other creatures enjoy, but endowed him with capacity to attain to the inaccessible and invisible Supreme Good and behold it face to face; and since man, according to the testimony of the sacred scriptures, has been created to enjoy eternal life and happiness, which none may obtain save through faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, it is necessary that he should possess the nature and faculties enabling him to receive that faith; and that whoever is thus endowed should be capable of receiving that same faith. Nor is it credible that any one should possess so little understanding as to desire the faith and yet be destitute of the most necessary faculty to enable him to receive it. Hence Christ, who is the Truth itself, that has never failed and can never fail, said to the preachers of the faith whom He chose for that office 'Go ye and teach all nations.' He said all, without exception, for all are capable of receiving the doctrines of the faith.

The enemy of the human race, who opposes all good deeds in order to bring men to destruction, beholding and envying this, invented a means never before heard of, by which he might hinder the preaching of God's word of Salvation to the people: he inspired his satellites who, to please him, have not hesitated to publish abroad that the Indians of the West and the South, and other people of whom We have recent knowledge should be treated as dumb brutes created for our service, pretending that they are incapable of receiving the Catholic Faith.

We, who, though unworthy, exercise on earth the power of our Lord and seek with all our might to bring those sheep of His flock who are outside into the fold committed to our charge, consider, however, that the Indians are truly men and that they are not only capable of understanding the Catholic Faith but, according to our information, they desire exceedingly to receive it. Desiring to provide ample remedy for these evils, We define and declare by these Our letters, or by any translation thereof signed by any notary public and sealed with the seal of any ecclesiastical dignitary, to which the same credit shall be given as to the originals, that, notwithstanding whatever may have been or may be said to the contrary, the said Indians and all other people who may later be discovered by Christians, are by no means to be deprived of their liberty or the possession of their property, even though they be outside the faith of Jesus Christ; and that they may and should, freely and legitimately, enjoy their liberty and the possession of their property; nor should they be in any way enslaved; should the contrary happen, it shall be null and have no effect.
By virtue of Our apostolic authority We define and declare by these present letters, or by any translation thereof signed by any notary public and sealed with the seal of any ecclesiastical dignitary, which shall thus command the same obedience as the originals, that the said Indians and other peoples should be converted to the faith of Jesus Christ by preaching the word of God and by the example of good and holy living.

[Dated: May 29, 1537]

I have been born and raised in the site were the Jesuitic Missions were erected with the aim of protecting and educating the Amerindians. Here you can see the Missions:

[Franchise]

Most of the time Popes are not even Christians, they are just kings like any other. If you want to understand what real Christianity is, read the Bible.
Besides, Amerindians have always been considered humans by the Catholic Church. The Pope clearly stated that Amerindians have souls in its document Sublimis Deus, published in 1537.

I have read the Bible. Amerindians were not always considered as having souls , only when the Pope officially stated , and it is from that date , the slave traders of Americas started to seek for slaves in Africa , where people supposedly didn't have souls.

[wallyfindme]

I'm just wondering which Pope said that. More interesting is defining what is a soul.

[Edwardthe_third]

I have read the Bible. Amerindians were not always considered as having souls , only when the Pope officially stated , and it is from that date , the slave traders of Americas started to seek for slaves in Africa , where people supposedly didn't have souls.

I don't know what's the story with the Africans, but Jesuits did great things for the Indians. Spanish soldiers even joined the Jesuit order to provide the Indians with military training (like Robert Deniro in "The Mission"), to protect them from the Portuguese slave traders. Afterwards, those Indians were among the first elite troops of the American continent, the "Granaderos a caballo", summoned to fight for Argentina during the war of independence.

---------- Post added 2012-07-14 at 01:21 ----------

I'm just wondering which Pope said that. More interesting is defining what is a soul.

Paul the third.

[Affolfembonge]

The concept of soul was very important before the 19th century , more important than it is today. Not having a soul would make you closer to the animal , albeit not identical. For instance in Paris , there were big colonial expositions where people from Senegal , New Caledonia etc.. came to show themselves in front of Parisian people, they were paid to act like crazy barbarians for hours before the eyes of people , the expositions had names such as "Le Canibale" etc..It was just manipulation to make the public and christian opinion of Europe to think that indigenous people really deserve forced colonization from the mighty white.

[Enladalusange]

An exposition of Negroes also existed in 1958, during the Brussels Expo. They had a Congolese village with real Congolese for people to watch. One doesn't have to go that far back.

---------- Post added 2012-07-14 at 02:29 ----------

What a stupid threat title "Christianity should stay out of Asia" Christianity, Islam and judaism came from Asia. Israel and the mid east is located in Asia right?

He's talking about (South) East Asia.

On a side note: It amazes me how far Filipinos take their Christianity. Some even that far to say "Thank God we were colonised by Spain. Thanks for giving us the Catholic faith."

[ballingham]

I don't know what's the story with the Africans, but Jesuits did great things for the Indians. Spanish soldiers even joined the Jesuit order to provide the Indians with military training (like Robert Deniro in "The Mission"), to protect them from the Portuguese slave traders. Afterwards, those Indians were among the first elite troops of the American continent, the "Granaderos a caballo", summoned to fight for Argentina during the war of independence.

But on the other hand Amerindians were not protected by christianity in the USA , (it was miaou's map topic) as they were in Spanish America , two cases.

[aAaBecker]

But on the other hand Amerindians were not protected by christianity in the USA , (it was miaou's map topic) as they were in Spanish America , two cases.

But they weren't killed for not being Christians either. The motives for the war between Natives and Anglos was not related to religion at all.

[FjFHQLJQ]

The United States belong to the Native Americans and Animism/Shamanism was the real practice of the natives. You mad?

Taiwan belongs to the Taiwanese and Uyghurs deserve their own state free from Chinese imperialism, you mad? :-)

[DJElizardo]

Taiwan belongs to the Taiwanese and Uyghurs deserve their own state free from Chinese imperialism, you mad? :-)

Don't forget the Tibetans. Okay, they were a backward theocracy before the Chinese invaded in 1950, but they are conquered by China. Moreover, reform-minded forces were also existent in free Tibet.

[dr-eavealer]

Why do religious "whites" people get really mad at East Asia for forbidding "the spread of Christianity" in Asia while "scream hates" for Islam to get the fcuk out of Europe?


Christianity should stay out of Asia.

YES or NO?


I don't mind Christianity staying in Europe or the Middle East where it comes from, but please don't come to Asia. We don't need religious wars and crazy fanatic people.

Both religions are foreign in Europe, but Christianity infected our continent centuries before Islam, and therefore we somehow believe it's "ours".

I personally think your thread should say "Christianity should stay out of Europe, Asia, the Americas and the Pacific", but it's too unrealistic.

[Andrius]

I don't know what's the story with the Africans, but Jesuits did great things for the Indians. Spanish soldiers even joined the Jesuit order to provide the Indians with military training (like Robert Deniro in "The Mission"), to protect them from the Portuguese slave traders. Afterwards, those Indians were among the first elite troops of the American continent, the "Granaderos a caballo", summoned to fight for Argentina during the war of independence.

---------- Post added 2012-07-14 at 01:21 ----------



Paul the third.

crypto, i notice you know the paraguayan history quite well...

[CathBraunn]

Religion shouldn't exist, it's stupid and boring.

[uC4F0NVL]

crypto, i notice you know the paraguayan history quite well...

Thanks. It's because I was born in Misiones, a province which is situated in the border with Paraguay.

[arriftell]

I know what "christianity" did to the Americans.

they went to the americas and had "fun" with indians because the bible told them to do so!

i mean your thought process is pure awesome dear sir!

Most of the time Popes are not even Christians, they are just kings like any other. If you want to understand what real Christianity is, read the Bible.
Besides, Amerindians have always been considered humans by the Catholic Church. The Pope clearly stated that Amerindians have souls in its document Sublimis Deus, published in 1537.

NOTE: we Orthodox Christians concider catholics as heretics and we do not recognise their pope, and neither do the protestants.
NOTE 2: the acts of christians even if they were supported by religious authority shouldn't be attributed to christianity, simply because there is no motivation for any form of violence in the christians holy texts.