[emexiagog]

Agree 100% with rcalaimo

[Knillagrarp]

Quote[/b] ]Here are some tips:

1. Live here. (Two-week shortie incursions don't count, duh!)
2. Live here - the Thai way. (gated moo-bans, condos and all-falang isaan villages are not the best way to include Thais in your everday life, unless you count the service staff and bought wives, respectively.)
3. Know the Thai ways of doing things (or make an effort to learn them).
4. A few Thai words go a long way...
5. Most important: integrate, don't separate (duh, again).

Do all these things and you will be a well-integrated farang. However, regardless of what people call you to your face, or how they treat you, you will always be farang.

[doctorzlo]

Thank you very much SiamJai. Too thank you Vision because I am sure you read my statement (I seen you online) and you did not reply, so you must agree to an extent. Thank you for the restraint. SiamJai consider too that some of us it is hard to accept what you have done. I do feel a considerable amount of jealousy and maybe even some light contempt for the fact that you have just up and moved to Thailand. I wish I could do that at this point in my life and am sure that many others probably feel the same way.

The problem with educated people is we always read too deep into something. Mr Brad showed the farang shirts and coffee cups, now SiamJai is the joke on you.... Don't read too deep into this. Just imagine yourself knowing you are not a tourist but a resident of Thailand with the culture deeply engrained into yourself, putting that shirt on and wearing it when going out with your Thai associates or even going to work with it on. That would be funny!

Not funny because you are farang, but funny because they all know you are not a farang inside. Your name says it all. That is why the shirt or the coffee mug would be so cute. Even on the more literal side that Vision was talking about, passer's by on the street who don't know you would be amused at the shirt because you are and you proudly admit it.

The crazy thing is you both are very correct (as usual) which is why I think Mr Brad did a great job of trying to point it out with his post.

[emexiagog]

Please take a look at my website and note the top banner

Link to iamguava.com

As I said earlier in this thread, (but didnt explain) for those that dont know - my name (Guava) in Thai is "Farang" too. My signature slogan (gai pen farang jai pen thai) means body of farang, heart of Thai. That sums up how I feel but was actually first said to me many years ago by one of my Thai language teachers who has since become a dear friend.

Yes I will always be Farang, however I believe its what is inside each individual that is important.

[Knillagrarp]

Quote[/b] ]I would be very disappointed to see him go.

Me too. It would be much more boring around here without his humorous perspective.

[spoddersedpn]

Hi, for me I don't like being called farang. It really hurts my feelings, because actually I'm 100% thai on paper. I'm more thai then all the chinese, lao and other people in Thailand. And just as much thai as many 1/2 chinese 1/2 thai.

When a merchant is talking to my mother about prices, he always tells me that I'm farang and that the price should be higher. Why? I'm thai. In a few years I will confirm my thai nationality by joining the army. Everywhere I go I'm always a stranger, in Thailand or Europe. I think you guys don't understand.

But I find it funny that I never heard about the word farang untill 3-4 years ago. I always knew it as a fruit. And when I surf the forums about Thailand western tourists always learned it as foreigner first. And when I tell them it's a fruit they laugh at me. Shows where they go and how they are in Thailand.

Ok enough rant.

[doctorzlo]

Paul_au I think most of it was in hopes of finding an argument with you. LOL Just kidding, thank you for the compliment. I only hope nobody is considering my posts spam. I do try and put thought into them.

Someday I hope to have the number of posts that you have, all with the same amount of thought put into the writings. Regardless thank you.

Rcalaimo, I agree to a large extent. But some words due to the way they are used come shipped with a negative context automatically. For example, have you locally ever heard the terms hapa, howlie or h'aole'? In any part of the world other than Hawaii they will mean nothing. But for someone from Hawaii to be Japan and hear a Hawaiian person call them this they would be very offended by it. Because it has it's own baggage associated with the term.

I notice you say you enjoy he comment when in Thailand. So I assume you have a similar feeling on the Thai person using it as they often do elsewhere. Have you heard it used in a negative way?

[RokeIdeadioke]

ati,
there are many, many things worse than 'farang' that you could be called, in my time I have been called by them all at various times and in various ways. Don't let it bother you.
You know best what you are, and if you are not yet something you can be proud of, work on it, do not be distracted by foolish words on the wind!

[LomodiorCon]

I am jealous that the word farang is used so much more in Thailand than Kaek! Even though the latter may have negative origins once, you know how jealousy works

[markbila]

I don't particularly like being called Farang either, but if you can't beat them, join them.

On my last visit to Thailand I came prepared with my Farang T-Shirt. It got lots of laughs. Great fun.

I also have a ¿ÃÑè§ oval sticker for my car as well as a ¿ÃÑè§ coffee mug (which doesn't seem to be available anymore).

You can order the oval here, and the shirt here or here or here.

[Drysnyaty]

ok, I've been thinking about this. I have no idea about the minds and identity of people who have successfully made the big jump to the "Land of Dreams". nevertheless, people are to blame if they hurt you, not words.... that was my point, I guess.

[Drysnyaty]

words in themselves are not loaded.... I don't think that in itself "visually impaired" is any better or more considerate than "blind", that "black" is necessarily rude and calls for a punch in the face.... it's the way these words are said that counts. the intention, the feelings behind the words, the look in the eyes of the person talking to you. I would like to be called a "farang" by a nice person making comparisons about people or inquiring how we do things, rather than an "alien" or "caucasian" by someone who is not interested and considers me a nusiance. personally, I have never ever heard Thais use the word "farang" with a negative implication or disrespect. maybe because I have always done my best to respect them and their culture, too. "farang" is just a word like "flower" or "rice": it desribes the real world as seen by Thais. open up and listen behind the words, that's my advice to you.

[doctorzlo]

Well said.

[Soassesaisp]

I don't know how many hundreds of times during my decade or so in Thailand that have i come across Farangs up-in-arms in disgust at being labeled a Farang.

The problem here is the Farang pysche. In the language of the Farang most derogatory slang words to call someone is usually two syllabled (i'll let your brain work on that one). So, with the cultural and social conditioning of the Farang, on hearing the word Farang, he instantly gets negative feelings.

One other issue that the Farang fails to get is the notion of Thai language. In the Farang Language, basic pronouns such as i/you/he/she are in everyday common use when referring to the first/second or third person etc...

As for Thai however, the Farang fails to understand the differences.

If i talk about or to an elderly lady, i'll refer to her as 'Khun Yai' as in grandmother.
If i talk to or about a Rickshaw Driver, i'll call him 'Samlor'
If i talk to or about a teacher, i'll call him Khru or Ajarn etc....

In Thailand, everyone gets labeled and that includes Farangs. As for those of Indian/Muslim origins they are called 'Kaek', Blacks are called 'Negro' etc....

Kaek and Negro are not derogatory in modern age Thai language, though their origins may be, same goes for Farang.

There are still derogatory sounding words in Thai for foreigners but not for the whiteman but instead fellow Asians.
'Ai Yoon' as in Japanese is derogatory by nature. 'Kaew' as in Vietnamese is derogatory in nature and 'Jek' as in Chinese is derogatory in nature.

The word Farang is not derogatory but the label 'Hua Daeng' is. Hua Daeng is the only derogatory phrase i know of in Thai language to call a caucasian (Red Head) but it is almost 'defunct' in everyday usage.

[Caursedus]

Being call a Farang does not bother me at all, but having to pay extra for being one does.

[Knillagrarp]

My Issan neighbors and friends call me "Farang Lao." We all have a great laugh at the notion. I never deceive myself into believing that I will ever be considered the same as my friends and neighbors. I am afforded special status, and I don't much mind it. It is kind of cool being the local anomaly.

[Podosinovik]

Quote[/b] (thaistyle @ Sep. 29 2005,14:08)]being married to a thai for many years and living in the U.S. most of the time i really get sick and tired of thais calling me a farang in my own country.....i.m not the farang i was born here.....any
thai born in thailand and living here is a farang
thais need to remember when their in the u.s. try treating everyone the same that goes foe charging everyone the same price......its always one price for thais and one price for americans or should i say farangs....
wake up or take your business back to thailand....

Friend. the word Farang does not mean foreigner. It is actually derived from Farang-set (for France). Farang is more a Thai word for caucasian. The thai term for foreigner is "dtang-chart".

[doctorzlo]

Ok longer answer.... I agree with the reasoning above and the last few statements about it not being a negative term.

I am not disgusted by being labeled a farang alone. There are other factors. I am angered by the generalization that goes with it.

You mention you asked the students why the farang comes to Thailand. They answer for a dark skinned wife. These are young children saying this. I am sure you had to have seen their opinion on the reason evolve as they get older! Well maybe not since they wouldn't say anything that could offend you, but I assure you that as they age, they come to learn what some massage parlors are for, they learn why so many young women have moved from their small villages to make money in the tourist areas. Eventually they have a fairly good idea why many farang come to Thailand.

Another post was talking about Generilzations that Thai's make about farang, (over a year ago I think) and one of them was the commmon view that farang simply are not a clean people. Meaning no showers, soap, anti-perspirant and wears dirty clothes regularly.

Thai's have generalizations of farang, that is why I don't care for the term being associated with me in the negative sense. It certainly is more commonly used in a positive sense though. More often than those to combined it is simply used as a pro-noun in place of the English terms He, She, Him, Her, You, They etc...completely opinion free as far as judging a person goes as you mentioned.

[AndyPharmc]

being married to a thai for many years and living in the U.S. most of the time i really get sick and tired of thais calling me a farang in my own country.....i.m not the farang i was born here.....any
thai born in thailand and living here is a farang
thais need to remember when their in the u.s. try treating everyone the same that goes foe charging everyone the same price......its always one price for thais and one price for americans or should i say farangs....
wake up or take your business back to thailand....

[Wachearex]

I do actually agree with thaistyle quite a bit, I absolutely understand it means nothing bad or anything but its just something that is irritating I guess...the main reason is how it takes away any feeling of individuality because a farang is somebody from...europe....australia...america...south africa....I don't go around saying stop calling me a farang as like I said i know nobody is trying to offend but I feel that there is a lot of difference in white cultures that is just bundled into one name. Like Thai's are very proud of what they are and are called Thai's by farang.....I am proud to be called British....this is a bit petty I guess and not a big deal but its just how I feel as well on this topic hehe