[DownloadMan]

Maybe ISSAN drivers are better than Thai drivers,,or maybe you just are not the observant type.
When I first came here I used to go a lot of places on Bus' but some were so bad that I finally just gave it up, One from Khon Kaen to Chiang Mai was a very good driver, never did anything I would consider a danger to life or limb, If you consider stopping in the middle of the roadway to load or wait for someone to run up and get on the bus as safety, but it took him 6 hrs longer to make the trip than I could drive it.

[DownloadMan]

Thats fine with me, but I truly believe that without proper enforcement that Thai driving habits will never change because as was stated in another thread that Thai do not pay attention to or even see those they do not know or make direct eye contact with, and it has been proven to me that this is true because just after turning into our village once a Thai in a pickup was passing a Thai Truck [PDA FARM CAR] and the road is very narrow with a school fence close to the road and by taking my side of the road, he ran me off into the grass and almost into the fence and I gave him the mighty finger, the next day he came to our house to talk to my wife and was complaining to her that I disrespected him by giving him the Hawiian peace sign, he admitted he was wrong but that I should not have done the very disrespectful thing I did, so I asked him how much respect he showed me by trying to kill me with his pickup,,END of Conversation ,and he left. And I see no change in the future as there will never be enforcement as long as each policeman is autonomus to the laws and actions of other policemen.
And it can not be used as an excuse for their actions or inactions because they are underpaid because they take a job at a certain wage and therefore should do the job, issue citations and the money should go into the general fund to pay for equip. and wages instead of into their pockets as many policemen seem to have money to buy nice homes and business's, just look at Toxin after his top cop job in Chiang Mai.

[RokeIdeadioke]

today I was forced off at 130 KPH this side of Phetchabun.

And you were LEGAL and SAFE at that speed?

Thai drivers, unfortunatly, lack education, experience and, consequently, skills.
Without any meaningful laws and enforcement, there is a lack of proper training.
Without training the wrong skills are practiced and developed. Hence the problems faced today on Thailand's roads.

And before I get flamed as a tourist, I have been driving in Thailand since 1963, intermitently but regularly, and with a Thai license! I drive there just as I would on the M25, (The Road To Hell!), have seen my share of accidents, many horrific, but fortunatly have never been involved in one, either in Thailand or the U.K., and I put that down to MY due care and constant attention. It takes a lot of practice!
I treat all other road users with respect, and always allow that the next one may be a total idiot or less experienced, and probably both.
I beleive the British Police call it DEFENSIVE Driving.
It has certainly helped me attain a long and happy life on the road, whichever country I have been driving in.
Remember, Thai drivers do not learn to drive at schools, they must learn by experience and example, so the way you, as a foriegner drive, could be taken as an acceptable lesson by one not so experienced.

[boltondd]

And you were LEGAL and SAFE at that speed?

Thai drivers, unfortunatly, lack education, experience and, consequently, skills.
Without any meaningful laws and enforcement, there is a lack of proper training.
Without training the wrong skills are practiced and developed. Hence the problems faced today on Thailand's roads.

And before I get flamed as a tourist, I have been driving in Thailand since 1963, intermitently but regularly, and with a Thai license! I drive there just as I would on the M25, (The Road To Hell!), have seen my share of accidents, many horrific, but fortunatly have never been involved in one, either in Thailand or the U.K., and I put that down to MY due care and constant attention. It takes a lot of practice!
I treat all other road users with respect, and always allow that the next one may be a total idiot or less experienced, and probably both.
I beleive the British Police call it DEFENSIVE Driving.
It has certainly helped me attain a long and happy life on the road, whichever country I have been driving in.
Remember, Thai drivers do not learn to drive at schools, they must learn by experience and example, so the way you, as a foriegner drive, could be taken as an acceptable lesson by one not so experienced.

You are absolutely right, and your comments apply worldwide not just to Thai drivers. Only last night on the local news (Chattanooga) a 18 wheeler had T-boned a passenger vehicle killing everyone. And that happens on a daily basis in the local 4 state area (NC, TN, GA, AL). On the major highways here, you have to do 90 mph to get away from that 60,000 pound truck who is trying to suck your tailpipe.

And if you want to see really bad driving go to Africa, Thai's are pussy cats compared to some of the drivers there.

And FIP, you are to easy to poke fun at and to get you started. Who said I believed anything PM Thaksin says, I only lifted that from the WHO report because it was Thai related, post related, and maybe of some interest to the readers. Anyway, I am done with this subject because no matter what I observe about my experiences on the road in Thailand, you will come back with any excuse to get your point across.

FINI

[DownloadMan]

G'Day,
On a recent trip to LoS my Thai hosts arranged and kindly paid for my minibus fare from Nakhon Phatom to Khrung Thep. As soon as we got out onto the highway I knew it was a BIG mistake because the driver was an insane lunatic. He tail-gated other cars at 120 km/hr and pulled out to pass when there was oncoming traffic. It seemed he was making a lightning decision as to the social status of the oncoming vehicle and if he considered he was "suung khwaa" the other driver he would pull out in a head-on confrontation that forced the other vehicle off the road. My question is: should I have stopped him and berated him in front of the other passengers? (serious loss of face) or demanded to be dropped off in the middle of nowhere? What I actually did was nothing, but sit with my eyes tightly closed for a white knuckle ride I will never forget. What would you guys have done in that situation?

I have read your post over 3 times and I can not see what you mean.
You have just described 95% of all Thai commercial drivers, Bus, Van or Truck which also includes private vehicles, so I guess that is 95% of all drivers in Thailand.
I have been on First class bus' that have done the very same thing but just some are worse than others, One I was on started to do those things as soon as he hit the super hyway out of Arcade terminal at Chiang mai and continued until they changed drivers in Phetsanulok and my trip finished in Lom Sak.
The best driver we have ever had was a van driver that we hired last year to go round trip from Phetchabun to Chiang Mai for a visa renewal, he was the best I have seen, and we will do it again this next month, but will have to be a different driver as the one we had was killed shortly after our trip when he was passing and was hit headon by a truck and killed.

[rusculture]

G'Day,
On a recent trip to LoS my Thai hosts arranged and kindly paid for my minibus fare from Nakhon Phatom to Khrung Thep. As soon as we got out onto the highway I knew it was a BIG mistake because the driver was an insane lunatic. He tail-gated other cars at 120 km/hr and pulled out to pass when there was oncoming traffic. It seemed he was making a lightning decision as to the social status of the oncoming vehicle and if he considered he was "suung khwaa" the other driver he would pull out in a head-on confrontation that forced the other vehicle off the road. My question is: should I have stopped him and berated him in front of the other passengers? (serious loss of face) or demanded to be dropped off in the middle of nowhere? What I actually did was nothing, but sit with my eyes tightly closed for a white knuckle ride I will never forget. What would you guys have done in that situation?

[boltondd]

Also could be just a lot of talk from his short time tourist experiences, Just because you have been there does not mean that you know a whole lot about the country,, I read on here where there have been people thru BKK airport a dozen times and never been downtown too, or just in a taxi to a hotel and back out.

The more I read of his experiences here, the more I doubt that he has spent a great amount of time moving around the country,,ya know ya can get from BKK to CM international without ever going on the hyways.

Typical reaction to someone who doesn't agree with your own views. Judging by your posts the whole country is a chaos of swirling traffic ready to wipe you off the face of the earth. It just ain't so!

Just leave it at "We choose to disagree"

[boltondd]

wrong again, many times have I been ran off the road by a bus heading right at me in my traffic lane in my car and on my motorcycle, both by VIP bus' and also short haul bus between Lom Sak and Phetchabun.

How can I be wrong if I am basing the statements on personal experience? About all you can say is "perhaps you have not done enough traveling on the road in Thailand yet" or I can say "you are probably a lousy driver who get's himself into dangerous situations".

Who's to know.

I will say again though categorically "I have no bad experiences driving in Thailand either in a rented car or on a tourist bus"