[MwhwF6bp]

Originally posted by Confound
[snippage]

Think about it really hard, does it intrinsically matter which team wins a hockey match? Thought about it really hard. Now my brain hurts. Or maybe it's a carry over from the 'Cross Swords-Know love' thread. I digress.
Have a think about english soccer fans, to whom the outcome of a match is like (and often is) a matter of life and death. Hooliganism aside, football is like a religion to many and pursued with a fanaticism rarely seen since weird religious zealouts were offing each other in record numbers early last millenium.
Anyway, the intrinsic importance of winning would appear, given my rationale, to depend on things ouside the sphere of the game itself.


Sports are a tool of the socio-economic elite, especially televised sports. they distract the masses, providing mindless entertainment that masquerades as 'healthy fun', but serves no purpose beyond that of taking up time that could be used for intellectual activities. the distraction serves the purposes of the elite, yet again deflecting the attention of the masses away from the flaws of society as run by the socio-economic elite. sounds like a perfectly potted description of just about any organised religion I could name. No offence intended to you religious types.


pseudo-marxism and noam-chomsky-esque feelings aside, I really don't like the culture of sports either. Come back and tell me that after Nike pay you millions of dollars to wear their new velcro hakama and gatorade beat down your door for their new television commercial.


[major snippage]

Hey, I'm with you on the liking the non-sporting elements of kendo. They're much more my thing. I enjoy shiai, sometimes I even don't suck at it, but I can't say it's my favourite part of kendo.


finally, the mental aspects of kendou are not to be found in sports. people claim that it is possible to approach a traditional sport, like baseball or tennis, the same was as a budo, but it seems farcical to me. dunno about this. Not having done any sports to an elite level it's hard for me to say one way or another. Doubtless there are some others around that might care to take up the argument.

in short: i detest exclusive development of the body and emphasis on teams. I have never worked well in groups, so sports annoy me incredibly. plato can take his 'well-rounded development' and shove it.

c ] You're a harsh marker, but to each their own I guess.
Different strokes, different folks. Personally I think exclusive development of the body has some excellent fringe benefits. Team sports are also good imho - it all depends on what you want to get out of it.
Sounds to me like you play to win (ironically) no matter what you do, so your wanker-tolerance level would be pretty low. I think one needs to ease up on that for stuff like team sports.

Um, I'm sure I had a point to make when I began to reply to this. Buggered if I can remember what it was. Oh well.
-Ares.

[beriarele]

" I have never worked well in groups, so sports annoy me incredibly"
(Missed this one the first time around)

Hmm so how do you function in a dojo, which is pretty much a group. I certainly every single person in the dojo a part of the training and you have to work together to get the most out of it.

Jakob

[FreeOEMcheapestPHOTOSHOP]

also, i forgot to mention that i do Bikram yoga (basically yoga in a very hot room) which is brilliant for flexibility and weight loss, but obviously has no serious impact on fitness.

[mralabama]

Cycling..bought a road (racing) bike 3 months ago. Limited (as with my kendo) in the moment due to injury, but otherwise about 70-90 miles per week. + 30 miles of commuting (weekly total ).

Jakob

[T1ivuQGS]

yeah i went to that sort of school, and yes i was very fit, but i hated sport with a vengeance - 8 years, 3 afternoons a week of hell.

I still have bad dreams about it 14 years after leaving.

On the other hand, Kendo I love, so to my mind there must be some qualitative difference in the experience.

I think it is because Kendo seems mercifully free of all the thuggish macho BS that seems to accompany sport - in this country at least.

As someone said, at a Shiai, no air punching or running around the circle or hugging team mates.

[swoluelvede]

Hmm, not sure if you count this as a sport, but I hit the gym three times a week around kendo training. Wish I had the time for other stuff, but there are only so many hours in a week.

[EjPWyPm4]

All true - plus kendo isn't done in the freezing cold, nor overseen by some demented sadist who was kicked out of the army for being too cruel....

[favwebbb]

Why being so negative about something that so many people enjoy all around the world. Kendo is a stupid activity too. Think about it really hard!!! What does it matter to hit the head of an opponent and screaming at the same time?

There is many things in life that can be call "useless", however we can still do them and enjoy them. If you think that everyone watching professional sports is an idiot because everyone else in the world says it's cool to do so then. Why do you have to hit the "kote" of your opponent and not his/her arm?


ah I can't wait for hockey season..

[jenilopaz]

I think part of the difference is how you are made to feel if you're no good. In "normal" sports at school, being picked last was always a real humiliation. In comparison, most people who do Kendo are very encouraging to novices, and are very aware of their own limitations and quite humble. (I'm sure there are exceptions...). Even Shodan or Nidan players tend to start conversations with "don't worry, I'm not very good at Kendo either".

The shame in school sports is how you're treated. I was rubbish at football, cricket etc so always got bad grades, even though I tried hard. I was later allowed to do badminton, at which I was pretty good - suddenly I get good grades, even though it was a breeze in comparison.....



Dave

[NumsAmenniams]

I wasn't refering to you!

The acid is from the excitement of a Kendo seminar in 10 hours later. See you in 3 days!

[WaydayNef]

Standing up at the bar constitutes exercise does it wabbit?

i go to the gym, and have now started running. But Kendo was the first exercise i had done in years as well.

the other stuff is supposed to supplement and improve my Kendo, which is my primary activity.

[huerta]

Kendo cannot be considered as a group sport. You won't have a chance to fight in a team against a team like football/soccer!!! Team sports can be: tennis doubles, swimming relay etc. Team members have to compete against another team at the same time. In Kendo, you're always alone, vs another kendoka. In the Dojo it's not the "group" that we're talking about. You fight against each other inside! Although you can make friends with each other, it is irrelevant to what we're talking about.

Mind you, Confound, that Kendo IS a televised sport! Every year the AJKF championship is broadcasted all over the nation, eg. on the NHK channel. In fact, you can buy this year's tickets (the 50th, on 3-4 Nov) already. For the 2-day event, arena seats 8000 Yen each, 1st floor seats 5000 Yen each. Free for middle-school kids!!

Mental aspect... really depends on how you treat the thing. You can approach everything mentally. I can play computer games psychologically. I can have lunch in a spiritual way. Taking football again, football players play it mentally so much. They cry (either win or lose, you'll see it)!! While in Kendo, I'd rather like to hear a 7-year old kid say to me, "Hey I practise Kendo for building up my character!". It really depends.

Noam Chomsky on Sports, for those who don't know:-
"Take, say, sports-that's another crucial example of the indoctrination system, in my view. For one thing because it-you know, it offers people something to pay attention to that's of no importance. That keeps them from worrying about-- keeps them from worrying about things that matter to their lives that they might have some idea of doing something about. And in fact it's striking to see the intelligence that's used by ordinary people in sports. I mean, you listen to radio stations where people call in-they have the most exotic information and understanding about all kind of arcane issues. And the press undoubtedly does a lot with this.

"You know, I remember in high school, already I was pretty old. I suddenly asked myself at one point, why do I care if my high school team wins the football game? I mean, I don't know anybody on the team, you know. I mean, they have nothing to do with me, I mean, why I am cheering for my team? It doesn't mean any-it doesn't make sense. But the point is it does make sense: it's a way of building up irrational attitudes of submission to authority, and group cohesion behind leadership elements, in fact it's training in irrational jingoism. That's also a feature of competitive sports. I think if you look closely at these things, I think, typically, they do have functions, and that's why energy is devoted to supporting them and creating a basis for them and advertisers are willing to pay for them and so on. "

*****
From "Kendo vs Sports?", let's get back to cross-training. I'm against cross training for the sake of Kendo, because you probably would not need it. Kendo is something that do not relate to your physical built. You don't even need to be healthy to be good at it. I'd say, use your brain more, maybe cross training by playing more chess. Fat people welcomed . Short and/or Old (eg Yoda) welcomed. Alcoholic welcomed. Smokers welcomed. Drugs....err not sure (but certainly get disqualified in Shiai). Who do you think all the 8th Dans are? Mental counts. Experience counts. And reaction time/reflex has nothing to do with muscles too. Of course, you can do other sports. Again it's a matter of personal interest. I go hiking too, but not for Kendo.

[chuecaloversvv]

Sigh...

Back in High School(English Style Private School) I was really fit. Sports was compulsory and there was always this "air" of SCHOOL COMES FIRST. I used to love it though.

Cross country, Rugby, Rowing, etc...sigh


After that the discipline was gone. heh...soccer with your mates doesn't count as hard training.

After 6 years of slacking I think its time to get back in the saddle.

MENG

[unsamiSlini]

Originally posted by Matthew Lagden
All true - plus kendo isn't done in the freezing cold, nor overseen by some demented sadist who was kicked out of the army for being too cruel.... Heh - never done kangeiko have you?

[scemHeish]

Three things,
1) I've seen some HUGE kendoka!
2) Confound are you a brain in a glass jar of bubbling liquid in a laboratory in a secret bunker hooked up to the internet.
3) Confound how come you always get to use over 2000 characters in your posts where I get stopped if I use over 1000 (serious question).

[Anymnillulky]

Kendo - god love it, but it is an asymetrical kind of activity as far as overall health is concerned.
Do people just do Kendo, or another sport/activity to compliment aid Kendo, or maybe kendo is not their main sport?
I'll kick off by saying I occaisionally go swimming, but haven't managed to factor it into a regular schedule, main activity is kendo; but I do believe I need some other kind of cross-training would help to balance what I am doing and indeed increase my fitness for Kendo.
(My idea of weights is a kebab in one hand and a Guiness in the other) But I would be interested in hearing about more succesful regimes.

[lkastonidwedsrer]

I do a lot of martial arts, but moreso because it just sort of happened that way than because those are the only things I enjoy.

I kickbox once a week, play judo once a week, and kendo once or twice a week. Oh, and iaido, which I need to make more time for. If I had more time, I'd like to swim, and I love racquet ball and baseball.

Hey, Lewis, can you expand this? I just turned 30 and I never heard this before!

"As a general note to the younger people, once you reach 30, you really need to do some kind of regular weight training or you will lose strength, muscle mass, and bone density. You'll also be much more prone to injuries. The reason why I mention it is because it happens REGARDLESS of whether you remain active in kendo, cycling or whatever. If you're in your 30s and it feels like you just keep getting worse no matter how much you practice, that's the reason."

[Cxcvvfbgtr]

Originally posted by Confound
Think about it really hard, does it intrinsically matter which team wins a hockey match?
Does anything intrinsically matter? Surely the whole process of "mattering" relates to the significance that is attached to something by one or more beings. If no-one attaches significance, it doesnt matter. If they do, it does (to them).

Sorry if we into alt.philosophy.pointless here.....



Dave

[jgztw2es]

I like how James said "to balance up the asymnetry of kendo" or something like. That's actually different to cross-training. Cross-training implies something you do to make your kendo more effective (like weights). But doing something to rebalance your body because kendo is so one sided recognises an idea of health above and beyond kendo. We kendoka last much longer than any other budoka (other than maybe taikyoka or aikidoka) but still our bodies could be straighter. Well-being for its own sake maybe?

I totally agree with the gist of Confound's rant BTW. And Lewis' too: "Faster, Higher, Stronger" has a lot to answer for in my book. Drugs in sport being the main one. Excessive sponsorship and endorsements another. Worship of the youthful body over wonder at the body's amazing longevity and accumulated wisdom another.

*Rambling rant warning*:
But it's not the athletes who are to blame for this, it's the spectators. We create the need for the spectacle, whether it is victory or disappointment. So how cheated would a US TV audience (ie PT Barnum's proverbial 'American public') feel watching the All Japan Kendo Championships, not being able to tell, once they took off their men, which competitor had won and which had lost because neither showed any emotion at the outcome? Where is the drama? Where is the tragedy? Where is the ego? Where is the fist in the air?

Nowhere to be found, thank God. Maybe just a wry smile.

*end ranting ramble. thank you.*

b

[curcercanty]

I love playing other sports.

I'm not too good at any of them, but i love to play no very seriously with friends, (american football, street hockey, tennis, baseball, soccer). I think i got a bit better in sports since i do kendo.

But my main other sport is to watch hockey on tv.

Go habs go!!!