[Stoottnoiciek]

Saward questioned who ran the RB team - either team principal Christian Horner or their "motorsport consultant" Dr Helmut Marko, on behalf of Red Bull boss Dietrich Mateschitz.
"In recent weeks it has seemed that Marko was the man calling the shots. http://tvnz.co.nz/motorsport-news/ha...d-bull-3662691

Unconfirmed reports on motorsport websites indicate that Hartley has been axed from the Red Bull junior development programme to which he has been attached for the past five years, ending his involvement as a reseve and test driver with the RB Formula One team.
Joe Saward, a respected motorsport insider whose internet blogs are considered accurate, revealed that Hartley had been dropped.

[Stoottnoiciek]

http://www.girlracer.co.uk/motorspor...ll-racing.html

But the Hartley story is potentially disastrous. The test driver may not have the biggest fanbase in F1, but the news that his dismissal order came from Austria – and was contrary to the wishes of your Formula 1 team, who have been impressed by his simulator work – plays right into the hands of your (now many) detractors.

[hujdrftgkas]

I am not surprised if he is out. I have always been surprised that he was IN.

When compared to Daniel Ricciardo, most likely to find a seat at Toro Rosso if one of the current drivers are promoted after Webber leaves - and beyond 2011 I dount that - Hartley is seriously found wanting.

His simulator work may be excellent but would he want to end up like Gary Paffet as far as f1 is concerned?

There are so many good up and coming other drivers and these days with F1 so safe and the likelihood of injury outside of a freak accident so improbable, drivers tend to have careers on average almost TWICE what it used to be.

Even 300ths slower - as Nelson Piquet was for example - is TOO slow.

Hartley is a competent driver, nothing special, and can if he can associate with a good agent, have a great motor racing career - just not in f1.

[TeLMgNva]

I am not surprised if he is out. I have always been surprised that he was IN.

When compared to Daniel Ricciardo, most likely to find a seat at Toro Rosso if one of the current drivers are promoted after Webber leaves - and beyond 2011 I dount that - Hartley is seriously found wanting.

His simulator work may be excellent but would he want to end up like Gary Paffet as far as f1 is concerned?

There are so many good up and coming other drivers and these days with F1 so safe and the likelihood of injury outside of a freak accident so improbable, drivers tend to have careers on average almost TWICE what it used to be.

Even 300ths slower - as Nelson Piquet was for example - is TOO slow.

Hartley is a competent driver, nothing special, and can if he can associate with a good agent, have a great motor racing career - just not in f1.

In full agreement. He hasn't done anything that warrants being in line for a drive in the best car on the grid. With the backing he's had, his CV should read like Hamiltons but it just plain doesn't.

[Pszinygv]

Quite - if Hartley was so good he'd have been chucked into GP2 to prove himself on track.

But that's not the complete story here - it's RBR's management. Clearly they wanted to keep Hartley to work on the simulator and someone decided to take matters into their own hands.

[loginptsa]

Hartley is a competent driver, nothing special, and can if he can associate with a good agent, have a great motor racing career - just not in f1.

Yep.

It is unfortunate however that there is no world sportscar championship in motorsport at the moment. It means as far as open-wheel drivers go, there's not much to choose from if F1 is no longer an option.

[Apparpsmose]

While they are at it, they should axe the Algaeboi as well, and make room for Ricciardo to give Buemi a run next year, with Vergne moving up to reserve. Time to actually get some TALENT back into the line-up!

[pfcwlkxav]

http://www.girlracer.co.uk/motorspor...ll-racing.html

The problem with this story is that its trying to create tension in RB. Hartley is a junior driver, so he comes directly under the controle of Helmut Marko who runs that program, and has been soundly thrashed by team mate Ricciardo in Renault 3.5 this year (Daniel is fighting for the title, ironically against ex RB driver Aleshin, whilst Hartley barely troubles the scorers). Thats badly underperforming and so he's rightly being sacked.

[nithhysfusy]

The problem with this story is that its trying to create tension in RB. Hartley is a junior driver, so he comes directly under the controle of Helmut Marko who runs that program, and has been soundly thrashed by team mate Ricciardo in Renault 3.5 this year (Daniel is fighting for the title, ironically against ex RB driver Aleshin, whilst Hartley barely troubles the scorers). Thats badly underperforming and so he's rightly being sacked.

tend to agree.

The only issue the other side of the argument is that Red Bull has a tendency of killing their own young and therefore folks are always likely to view these decisions with a dubious eye. It is probably the right decision as Hartley has not really impressed me to date. But as many know, being average in the lower series in no indicator of predicted form in F1. We will just have to wait and see how things turn out with him. He'll probably get a look by another team

[JimmyHas]

Yeah, there was just no need for Hartley anymore. It's become evident he could never make it in Formula 1 and with Ricciardo, Vergne, and much further down the road 15-year-old Sainz in the fold, he's just taking up space.

I was surprised, actually, that they even kept Hartley for 2010, especially when they released Aleshin and, to a lesser extent, Wickens (I'd say Wickens just doesn't have what it takes for F1, either, so...). Funny, in a way, that Aleshin's beating both their drivers in WSR now.

On a side note, Hartley really ought to get a haircut now.

[loginptsa]

Yeah, there was just no need for Hartley anymore. It's become evident he could never make it in Formula 1 and with Ricciardo, Vergne, and much further down the road 15-year-old Sainz in the fold, he's just taking up space.

I was surprised, actually, that they even kept Hartley for 2010, especially when they released Aleshin and, to a lesser extent, Wickens (I'd say Wickens just doesn't have what it takes for F1, either, so...). Funny, in a way, that Aleshin's beating both their drivers in WSR now.

On a side note, Hartley really ought to get a haircut now.

I didn't realise Sainz jr was on the RBR development program. Hopefully he's more than just a name.

[nithhysfusy]

I didn't realise Sainz jr was on the RBR development program. Hopefully he's more than just a name.

yep

[JimmyHas]

I didn't realise Sainz jr was on the RBR development program. Hopefully he's more than just a name.

Yeah, time will tell in that regard, but he is doing well for his inexperience in Formula BMW. He has one win from eight races in Formula BMW Europe (Silverstone) and two from six in Formula BMW Pacific, so he's off to a good start in single-seaters. If Red Bull give him the time to developed and don't just rush him off to exploit the name or whatever, he could turn out to be a solid candidate.

[HotDolly]

Its interesting to see who they've got on their books in this Junior driver programme, it used to be a huge number but now there are only 4

CURRENTLY ON PROGRAMME
Daniel Ricciardo (AUS) - Renault World Series (Currently 2nd, 2 wins)
Jean-Eric Vergne (FRA) - British F3 (Currently leading, 5 wins)
Carlos Sainz jr (SPA) - Formula BMW (Currently 3rd, 1 win)
Danill Kvyat (RUS) - Formula BMW (Currently 15th)
*Scott Speed (USA) - NASCAR (Currently 24th)

*I dont know if he still counts as he is signed up to Red Bull's NASCAR team

And the drivers they've recently let go from the programme to name but a few (Excluding Hartley)

Mikhail Aleshin (RUS) - Currently leading the Renault World Series with Carlin
Robert Wickens (CAN) - Currently in 5th place in the GP3 series with Status GP
Filipe Albuquerque (POR) - Currently looking for a drive despite a successful period in A1 Grand Prix
Jean Karl Vernay (FRA) - Currently leading the Firestone Indy Lights
Karun Chandhok (IND) - Currently in F1 with Hispania
Neel Jani (SUI) - Currently racing a Ford GT in the FIA GT1 Championship

[nofkayalk]

See i must be honest i disagree with some of the statements, did anyone see his drive at Monaco in the WSR, or look back at his 08 F3 season, winning more races than Jaime? He has two bad seasons which admitedly he shouldn't but the last time i spoke to him (Okay it was a few months back!) things were looking up, and even then he was saying that RB were happy with him, and that they needed to sort out his erratic driving (one minute flying, the next not!) but sim work was brill, so a bit strange to be honest.

[hubua990]

What surprises me is the way Red Bull have just about expunged his name from their junior driver programme website, almost like he never existed.

For example the Monaco results - Hartley's name has just disappeared from the list even though drivers from other teams are mentioned. It just seems really petty.

http://www.redbull-juniorteam.com/20...il.php?id=1435

I see they have left his name on their records page for 2007 when he won them a title. Other than that, looking at the site, you would never know he had been there.

http://www.redbull-juniorteam.com/2006/records.php

I am beginning to wonder if he p*ssed in Helmut's stein of Gösser.

[Narkeere]

Whoever is running the team needs to lay off their own beverage as it is affecting their judgement.

[Nmoitmzr]

Whoever is running the team needs to lay off their own beverage as it is affecting their judgement.

Welcome back..

I would quite like to see post race interviews of Red Bull drivers and personel rushing their tits off on a hefty dose of the fizzy yellow stuff..

[Narkeere]

Welcome back..

I would quite like to see post race interviews of Red Bull drivers and personel rushing their tits off on a hefty dose of the fizzy yellow stuff..

Cheers Henners.

I did enjoy Silverstone for 2 reasons;

Vettel forgetting to think off the line, and Onslo/Ferrari for the delicious payback for Spa.

Most satisfying so it was!

[MineOffedOvex]

Christian Hernandez? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_612622.html