[BronUVT]

Fatalism pervades Dominican culture. Read up on the connection made between fatalism and the acceptance of domestic abuse by women in RD and other Latin American countries. Dominicans, women in particular, tend to think their spouses are provided by God. Therefore, good or bad, hay que aguantar lo que sea. Fatalism also presents a challenge to health-care workers when treating cancer patients. A study was done on exactly this. The subjects were dominicanas in NY.

Tu si eres disparatoso!

[DenisMoor]

Oh, puh leeeeeze.

The purpose of gubmint is the equal application of constitutional law.

You cannot define "people's happiness" without subjective bias.

Goverments put in place frameworks whereby people can lead happy lives.

Many different areas.

Working hours etc.
\

From...

Time use and happiness


Time use studies provide information on the work-life balance of individuals in society. They provide information on the number of hours an individual spends on work and other activities, such as socializing with family and friends, sports, and other leisure activities. Imbalance in time allocation between work and other activities is caused by a number of factors among which the increased number of work hours is the most prominent. An increase in work hours, in turn, is, among other factors, caused by one’s desire to make more money. Money becomes the focus or the driving force behind long hours of work for many individuals. These individuals exaggerate the importance of money for their well-being, and they get into a situation of what has been called “focusing illusion”. As they devote more time to work they do not find time to do things that they enjoy. Such people are not happier but are much more stressed than others (Kahneman et al. 2006). The European Quality of Life Survey of 2003 revealed a strong correlation between time use and subjective well-being. In most of the countries covered by the survey, it was found that people who had long work hours and poor work-life balance generally had low subjective well-being (Böhnke 2005).As individuals juggle to do so many things, they easily become stressed. Research has documented a series of stress related impacts on the health of workers. Workers in high-strain jobs have been shown to have a higher variety of disease than their fellow workers who are not or are less stressed. Cardiovascular disease, gastro-intestinal disorders, musculoskeletal problems, and the immune system are all affected by stress. Behavioural problems such as poor relations with colleagues, absenteeism, and loss of self-confidence and self-esteem are often caused by stress. All these consequences affect both the actual as well as the perceived well-being of individuals.


There is a bias in saying that someone working 40 hours a week is likely to be happier than someone working 90 hours a week on average.


Why not?

yapask1

[EliteFranceska]

Probably something everybody is aware of, but I was just thinking about it today while driving from a client to my home. In the middle of the afternoon I see men everywhere doing nothing, walking around in casual clothes, sitting with some other guys talking and laughing and I'm not talking about a barrio but sectors like Millon, Evaristo Morales.

When I have to go somewhere early in the morning (before 7am) I see the street full of people going to their jobs: 80% women (were are the men?! they appear a few hours later in the streets doing nothing). Besides there are many men having jobs that are completely unproductive: watchmen, messengers (why does this economy still needs so many messengers, its about time to modernize the paymentsystem, fase out the use of checks and reorganize the economy to be able to generate real jobs for al those people sitting around.

Our maid comes from San Cristobal. I was bringing her to Pintura this week, for her to drop of some notebooks for her daughters, she started fighting with her husband on the phone while I was bringing her (about money). Later I ask her if her husband works. answer: Claro! he works in the weekend as a watchman in for some building and 1 day in the week he collect money for someone....THAT'S HIS JOB??? Letting his wife work from monday till friday long days in the capital and be at home the whole week sitting in the colmado doing (almost) nothing?

My homecountry is a small country, having about 16,000,000 habitants and a GNP of USD770 billion. Why does DR that has 10,000,000 habitants only a GNP of USD37 billion. I know I am comparing a wealthy developed country with a country in development, but that s about 5%. Keeping in mind that my country does hardly have any natural resources and DR does.

I'm afraid that what's wrong with the DR has to do a lot with mentality. As long as a great part of the population is conformist and not willing to do something to improve their situation, this country is going to stay the way it is, with an economy that's always in crisis, the few people that DO want to work (and the few people whose ancestors did) are doing well and will keep developing, while the rest will stay what they are: poor.

[Npbfamgt]

My homecountry is a small country, having about 16,000,000 habitants and a GNP of USD770 billion. Why does DR that has 10,000,000 habitants only a GNP of USD37 billion. I know I am comparing a wealthy developed country with a country in development, but that s about 5%. Keeping in mind that my country does hardly have any natural resources and DR does.

I'm afraid that what's wrong with the DR has to do a lot with mentality. As long as a great part of the population is conformist and not willing to do something to improve their situation, this country is going to stay the way it is, with an economy that's always in crisis, the few people that DO want to work (and the few people whose ancestors did) are doing well and will keep developing, while the rest will stay what they are: poor. If I'm guessing correctly, your home country is secularized, having grown out of childish religiosity. The people realize that they create their destiny. RD is a country still entrenched in superstition and fatalism(si Dios quiere). People there, in general, see very little connection between efforts and rewards. They have little grasp on how consequences arise from action/inaction. This thinking is reinforced by the material "success" of the unashamedly corrupt authority figures. They put a lot of weight on la suerte.

[EliteFranceska]

Well, I'm probably what you would call childishly religious, but my 'religion' actually teaches me that I have my own responsibility, even though I expect everything from above, not as a reward for my hard work but while God provides through our own efforts.

I doubt that all these not working people think: it doesn't matter if I work. I think they accept their reality as it is and prefer to stay miserable and not do a step more than necessary.

[Npbfamgt]

Well, I'm probably what you would call childishly religious, but my 'religion' actually teaches me that I have my own responsibility, even though I expect everything from above, not as a reward for my hard work but while God provides through our own efforts.

I doubt that all these not working people think: it doesn't matter if I work. I think they accept their reality as it is and prefer to stay miserable and not do a step more than necessary.

I respect your sincerity and conviction. I don't judge a person's beliefs until they explain what exactly they are. However, you asked and I answered. If a person is born into a culture with a fatalistic mindset they're less motivated to take initiative. You've not observed this? Ever noticed how busy the bancas are?

[TepSteade]

Probably something everybody is aware of, but I was just thinking about it today while driving from a client to my home. In the middle of the afternoon I see men everywhere doing nothing, walking around in casual clothes, sitting with some other guys talking and laughing and I'm not talking about a barrio but sectors like Millon, Evaristo Morales.

When I have to go somewhere early in the morning (before 7am) I see the street full of people going to their jobs: 80% women (were are the men?! they appear a few hours later in the streets doing nothing). Besides there are many men having jobs that are completely unproductive: watchmen, messengers (why does this economy still needs so many messengers, its about time to modernize the paymentsystem, fase out the use of checks and reorganize the economy to be able to generate real jobs for al those people sitting around.

Our maid comes from San Cristobal. I was bringing her to Pintura this week, for her to drop of some notebooks for her daughters, she started fighting with her husband on the phone while I was bringing her (about money). Later I ask her if her husband works. answer: Claro! he works in the weekend as a watchman in for some building and 1 day in the week he collect money for someone....THAT'S HIS JOB??? Letting his wife work from monday till friday long days in the capital and be at home the whole week sitting in the colmado doing (almost) nothing?

My homecountry is a small country, having about 16,000,000 habitants and a GNP of USD770 billion. Why does DR that has 10,000,000 habitants only a GNP of USD37 billion. I know I am comparing a wealthy developed country with a country in development, but that s about 5%. Keeping in mind that my country does hardly have any natural resources and DR does.

I'm afraid that what's wrong with the DR has to do a lot with mentality. As long as a great part of the population is conformist and not willing to do something to improve their situation, this country is going to stay the way it is, with an economy that's always in crisis, the few people that DO want to work (and the few people whose ancestors did) are doing well and will keep developing, while the rest will stay what they are: poor.

From what I have seen in all my time in the DR, The reason people stay the way they are is because the poor are stuck. They could work 24/7 and not get paid enough to eat well with their families and move up in the class system. The rich, top 10 percent hold onto all the money and they do not share. There is almost no middle class.

Wealthy countries have poor and people in poverty too but most of them have the option to work their way into the middle class if they try. In the DR< they are just stuck unless someone gives them free handouts or a visa or something. It is almost like a rare group of people in wealthy countries whose only option to leave a ghetto is to get free handouts from the government or commit crimes. So, they dont get that low paying job flipping burgers, they get handouts or find ways to cheat the system. You will not see them working to get paid pennies so they can starve the same way they would if they did not work.

The rich int he DR have it made because they can monopolize companies and buy government officials. As long as the rich Dominicans own the country, it will stay that way. The DR is just too corrupt for people to just go out and work their way to a full dinner table and nice life in most cases.

[BeksTeene]

If I'm guessing correctly, your home country is secularized, having grown out of childish religiosity. The people realize that they create their destiny. RD is a country still entrenched in superstition and fatalism(si Dios quiere). People there, in general, see very little connection between efforts and rewards. They have little grasp on how consequences arise from action/inaction. This thinking is reinforced by the material "success" of the unashamedly corrupt authority figures. They put a lot of weight on la suerte.

pollogringo, with each passing day, my esteem for you expands, by orders of magnitude. just today, as i was entering my apartment, the lady nextdoor, a Dominican woman, was fidgeting in her handbag, looking for the keys to her door. in despair, i heard her say, in Spanish, " dear Father God, do not do this to me". at no time did she conceive of the notion that it was by her actions that the keys became misplaced. it was some cosmic interference, over which she has no control. why do you think it is that when you say to a Dominican " see you later", he or she invariably replies " si Dios quiere"?

[BeksTeene]

says .pollogringo

They put a lot of weight on la suerte.

that explains the proliferation of bancas, everywhere. the formula is that if they go to the iglesia often enough, Dios will give them suerte, and they will win the pale , someday. that is why the two biggest growth industries in the country are evangelical churches, and bancas. one, or more, on every street corner.

[gimffnfabaykal]

Buenas dias como estas?

Bien, gracias a Dios!

...the most common verbal exchange in the country and one that truly exposes the fatalistic culture.

[Npbfamgt]

Y...

espero en Dios

ojalá

si Dios quiere

Dios mediante

The fatalism creates the atmosphere where there exists no perception of personal accountability.

[BeksTeene]

Y...

espero en Dios

ojalá

si Dios quiere

Dios mediante

The fatalism creates the atmosphere where there exists no perception of personal accountability.

that is why one of the most familiar remarks you will ever hear in this land is " no es mi culpa".

[Npbfamgt]

that is why one of the most familiar remarks you will ever hear in this land is " no es mi culpa".

Yep. And in response to "Why did/didn't you...?", "Por nada".

[BronUVT]

You guys are putting way too much enphasis on the "si Dios quiere", "con Dios adelante", etc. These are simply idioms. They've been passed down from generation to generation. Back in the old days, people were very religious.

"Si Dios quiere" does not mean that one needs to consult with God or wait for God to do something for one to act...

As an example:

English:
Q: Mike what are you doing tomorrow?
A: Tomorrow morning, God willing, I'll head out downtown to look for a job...

Spanish:
Q: Pollogringo que piensas hacer manana?
A: Manana, "si Dios quiere", I'll go out looking for a job...

Here is the subtler or abstract meaning to this:

I am going to do “x”, if everything is okay. As you know, anything could happen in the future.

When I am leaving my mom’s house, she always tells me “valla con Dios”; translating to “may God be with you” or “may you go with God”. She is simply wishing me a safe ride home...

You guys have to look beyond the translation.

I am having a little difficulty understanding why these expressions are hard to comprehend when we are religious by culture.

PS: If it were up to God, there would be no crime in DR. But since Dominicans are not taking hints from God to commit crimes, we are where we are.

[Npbfamgt]

You guys are putting way too much enphasis on the "si Dios quiere", "con Dios adelante", etc. These are simply idioms. They've been passed down from generation to generation. Back in the old days, people were very religious.

"Si Dios quiere" does not mean that one needs to consult with God or wait for God to do something for one to act...

As an example:

English:
Q: Mike what are you doing tomorrow?
A: Tomorrow morning, God willing, I'll head out downtown to look for a job...

Spanish:
Q: Pollogringo que piensas hacer manana?
A: Manana, "si Dios quiere", I'll go out looking for a job...

Here is the subtler or abstract meaning to this:

I am going to do “x”, if everything is okay. As you know, anything could happen in the future.

When I am leaving my mom’s house, she always tells me “valla con Dios”; translating to “may God be with you” or “may you go with God”. She is simply wishing me a safe ride home...

You guys have to look beyond the translation.

I am having a little difficulty understanding why these expressions are hard to comprehend when we are religious by culture.

PS: If it were up to God, there would be no crime in DR. But since Dominicans are not taking hints from God to commit crimes, we are where we are.

No. I get it. These idioms that you say are meaningless have a powerful influence on the culture, albeit subconsciously. Do you understand fatalism? It's the the idea that one is powerless to change the outcome of one's life. The advantages of planning and being proactive are not understood. Responsibility is not taken for one's action or inaction. Soy como soy. You are correct, most Dominicans are not devout in their inherited beliefs, but just look around and you'll see messages everywhere(on guaguas, buses, stores, restaurants, the highways, etc.) that are indicative of a culture that's counting on someone else to fix what's broken.

[BronUVT]

Well, I'm probably what you would call childishly religious, but my 'religion' actually teaches me that I have my own responsibility, even though I expect everything from above, not as a reward for my hard work but while God provides through our own efforts.

I doubt that all these not working people think: it doesn't matter if I work. I think they accept their reality as it is and prefer to stay miserable and not do a step more than necessary.

I disagree and here is why:

For a lot of people there aren't simply jobs.

It is hard for me to accept that a person, head of a houshold, would prefer to let his family go to bed hungry every night, simply because he is too lazy to get out of his routine and find work.

The government is the biggest employer in the country.. When one party rules, the people of the other party are unemployeed. Mind you most of these pleople have no education...

When I was around 15, I went out for 3 months looking for work in the city... Nothing .... I just needed hang out money...

You see more women than men heading out to work in the morning..
Here is a plausible explanation: Women could work as secretary, receptionist, or any other admin job, maid, etc. without skill.. A man would have to know how to do something.

My then girlfriend, now wife, started working around 16 as a cashier, then a receptionists or something like that.
Me, no one want to give me an opportunity...

I am just say ...

[BeksTeene]

You guys are putting way too much enphasis on the "si Dios quiere", "con Dios adelante", etc. These are simply idioms. They've been passed down from generation to generation. Back in the old days, people were very religious.

"Si Dios quiere" does not mean that one needs to consult with God or wait for God to do something for one to act...

As an example:

English:
Q: Mike what are you doing tomorrow?
A: Tomorrow morning, God willing, I'll head out downtown to look for a job...

Spanish:
Q: Pollogringo que piensas hacer manana?
A: Manana, "si Dios quiere", I'll go out looking for a job...

Here is the subtler or abstract meaning to this:

I am going to do “x”, if everything is okay. As you know, anything could happen in the future.

When I am leaving my mom’s house, she always tells me “valla con Dios”; translating to “may God be with you” or “may you go with God”. She is simply wishing me a safe ride home...

You guys have to look beyond the translation.

I am having a little difficulty understanding why these expressions are hard to comprehend when we are religious by culture.

PS: If it were up to God, there would be no crime in DR. But since Dominicans are not taking hints from God to commit crimes, we are where we are.

do you understand that there is a powerful reason why they say " si Dios quiere"? why don't they say " si mi perro quiere"? it is because of the fatalism that pollogringo alludes to. it is because they feel that all things are controlled by an authority figure that is larger than themselves, that is why. the use of the term has an origin. it did not just appear out of thin air.

[BronUVT]

Yes, our culture is religious... and you still don't get it...

You tell me: NAS, I'll see you tomorrow.
I reply: I'll see you tomorrow, "si dios quiere"

For example, I'll see you tomorrow if we both are still alive....

Dominicans did not invented "God willing" ..

okay I am the one who needs to understand...

[Npbfamgt]

Yes, our culture is religious... and you still don't get it...

You tell me: NAS, I'll see you tomorrow.
I reply: I'll see you tomorrow, "si dios quiere"

For example, I'll see you tomorrow if we both are still alive....

Dominicans did not invented "God willing" ..

okay I am the one who needs to understand...

You're unwittingly proving the point.

[wJswn5l3]

My wife's says these Catholic idioms all the time but it's like a reflex action kind of like North Americans saying Sorry, excuse me. As far as fatalistic my wife is anything but. She works hard and is always looking to the future and trys to teach all her students that their future is what they make of it. She has a lot of sucessful former students so perhaps her message gets through. There are plenty of Dominicans that have a plan A, and plan B, and are looking for ways to get ahead. Many are religious and hrd working and the religion is not a deterent.