[Obenuearema]

Many thanks, Paul, for the info. on St Trevor. There must be an icon of him - perhaps his symbol is a pitcher - or is it a linen loincloth?

[moopierof]

That is interesting, what other languages did you learn?

Tok Pisin is the only one we were taught at Wycliffe's camp - since the grammar is fairly simple and much of the vocabulary is English-based, it works well to test the language-learning ability of prospective translators. Our group was able to pick up enough in two weeks to conduct a church service completely in Tok Pisin.

The other languages I've studied are German and Ancient Greek, plus I've dabbled to various degrees in Latin, Spanish, Quenya, Sindarin, Korean, and a few others (mostly isolated words and phrases). I'd be in serious trouble if I had to converse or read even semi-fluently in anything but English, though . I've been considering trying my hand at Russian - there are native Russian speakers in my parish, so at least I'd be able to talk to someone with it! (plus the bonus benefit of being able to read more icons!)

I don't feel comfortable with the change from t to d though - unless Tok Pisin doesn't have a "d". Maybe they picked up some Latin from a wandering Roman Catholic priest.

It does have a "d", but it shows up more often at the beginning of a word than in the middle or at the end. There are other words that show the "d to t" change, like "pret" for "afraid", "praut" for "proud", or "ausait" for "outside". Other words (like "solda" for "shoulder") keep the "d"; I don't know if there's any rhyme or reason to it.

Mike

[NerbuitW]

Let's keep building the list! Adding my attempt to Wikipedia's listing makes 26 languages: Arabic, Bulgarian, Church Slavonic, Croatian, Dutch, English, French, Georgian, German, Greek, Hebrew, Icelandic, Irish, Latin, Norwegian, Macedonian, Polish, Portuguese, Romanian, Russian, Serbian, Slovak, Spanish, Tagalog, Tok Pisin, and Ukrainian. Why stop there?

I think this is a nice idea.


Sorry I can't manage Quenya. I used to know the inscription on the gates of Moria, but I think that was Sindarin anyway

[hechicxxrr]

Tok Pisin is the only one we were taught at Wycliffe's camp - since the grammar is fairly simple and much of the vocabulary is English-based, it works well to test the language-learning ability of prospective translators. Our group was able to pick up enough in two weeks to conduct a church service completely in Tok Pisin.

The other languages I've studied are German and Ancient Greek, plus I've dabbled to various degrees in Latin, Spanish, Quenya, Sindarin, Korean, and a few others (mostly isolated words and phrases). I'd be in serious trouble if I had to converse or read even semi-fluently in anything but English, though . I've been considering trying my hand at Russian - there are native Russian speakers in my parish, so at least I'd be able to talk to someone with it! (plus the bonus benefit of being able to read more icons!)

That is an impressive collection. I wish you luck with the Russian. I was fortunate enough to find a very nice Russian "language exchange" partner here, so I am trying to learn some too. Unfortunately I have neglected my German, which is a wasted opportunity.


It does have a "d", but it shows up more often at the beginning of a word than in the middle or at the end. There are other words that show the "d to t" change, like "pret" for "afraid", "praut" for "proud", or "ausait" for "outside". Other words (like "solda" for "shoulder") keep the "d"; I don't know if there's any rhyme or reason to it. Interesting, so maybe it could be Portuguese after all.

[ForumMasta]

When I became Orthodox 31 years ago, I loved learning the responses and some of the troparia in many different languages. I could even chant "Christ is Risen" in Greek, Slavonic, and Arabic, and while I was being a substitute Latin teacher in a Catholic girls' high school, I trained a few of my students to sing "Mysterion Xenon" in a Latin translation of my own devising (now long forgotten) on the Byzantine tone, which absolutely amazed the school chaplain.

But lately, my parish (which has many elderly members who speak only Greek) began putting English into the Divine Liturgy. Our first project was to learn to say the Nicene Creed in English after we'd finished saying it in Greek. When they first tried it, I had a terrible time remembering how the Creed goes in English....

And isn't it strange, that now that the Latins are getting their Latin back, the Greeks are going into English. Proof of the wise saying from Monachos.net that God must be an English Gentleman™!

All I can advise here, is, if you want to be a polyglot pray-er, be careful not to get old, because when you get as old as I am, you may let your dimming mind wander from language to language within the same prayer!

"and ever o'er it's Babel sounds, the blessèd angels sing...."

Mary Emily
Kyrie pomilui

[RerRibreLok]

That is an impressive collection. I wish you luck with the Russian. I was fortunate enough to find a very nice Russian "language exchange" partner here, so I am trying to learn some too. Unfortunately I have neglected my German, which is a wasted opportunity.

Thanks. Unfortunately, my collection is mostly the linguistic equivalent of knick-nacks right now; I'd bet nearly all of the bi- and tri-lingual folks on this forum know more vocabulary in just their second language than I do in all my secondary languages combined.

Good luck with your Russian studies also. I know exactly how you feel with German - I was moderately fluent in it back in high school and college, but with no one to practice with since then my fluency has fallen apart. I bet it would come back to us fairly quickly, though, if we had a real need for it.

All I can advise here, is, if you want to be a polyglot pray-er, be careful not to get old, because when you get as old as I am, you may let your dimming mind wander from language to language within the same prayer!

"and ever o'er it's Babel sounds, the blessèd angels sing...."

Mary Emily
Kyrie pomilui

No problem, God still understands us. And it's better than wandering from distraction to distraction and realizing at the end of your prayer that you can't remember what you were praying!

Gospodi eleison,
Mike

[singleGirl]

Thanks. Unfortunately, my collection is mostly the linguistic equivalent of knick-nacks right now; I'd bet nearly all of the bi- and tri-lingual folks on this forum know more vocabulary in just their second language than I do in all my secondary languages combined.

I feel the same way. The old saying about jack of all trades, master of none.

[vicgirl]

Gospodi eleison,
Mike

I loved this, Mike.

[ultramDoctoo]

I believe being able to learn and speak several languages is an inate ability.

Having said that I should mention I am terrible with languages.
My latin (which I studied for 4 years) is a nightmare - to be totally honest I can only remember a few words................

I tried French a few years ago - the lesson in which I was shown the various parts of the mouth and throat from which certain french sounds came from proved to be the lesson that convinced me that the French could keep their language and just leave me alone.

Unless you are a genuis with languages, my experience has been that you learn one perfectly (mother tongue), learn a second and a third and then spend the rest of your life mixing them all up. As Anthony pointed out : " jack of all trades, master of none."

And the cherry on the cake : the older you get, the worse you get.
My son's kind remark : Mama, instead of your Greek improving, it's becoming worse! Children are born to lift your spirits.............

I admire all the expert linguists in this discussion.

Effie

[Broker15015]

When I became Orthodox 31 years ago, I loved learning the responses and some of the troparia in many different languages. I could even chant "Christ is Risen" in Greek, Slavonic, and Arabic, and while I was being a substitute Latin teacher in a Catholic girls' high school,

All I can advise here, is, if you want to be a polyglot pray-er, be careful not to get old, because when you get as old as I am, you may let your dimming mind wander from language to language within the same prayer!

"and ever o'er it's Babel sounds, the blessèd angels sing...."

Mary Emily
Kyrie pomilui

Good post, Mary Emily. I mentioned the age thing as well. I was given a card for my last birthday - sisters!!!!!! they think they will never be as old as I am. On the cover there's a picture of a lady pointing to a drawing of a body on a blackboard. There are arrows pointing to various parts of the body with health problems. The card says " When you reach 55 your body begins to undergo many changes....... " and then on the inside it continues ... "Fortunately your EYESIGHT fades and you can't SEE most of them".

How true!

Effie

.. substitute Latin teacher...... Oh my!

[KernJetenue]

As Anthony pointed out : " jack of all trades, master of none."

Or as a schoolfriend of mine used to say to me, what's the point of learning all those languages when you haven't got anything to say in any of them?

[datingcrew]

Or as a schoolfriend of mine used to say to me, what's the point of learning all those languages when you haven't got anything to say in any of them?

Nonsense, you're putting yourself down! You in particular have plenty to say and to teach. The virtue of silence is one that I, in particular, need to cultivate but even though I don't talk a lot, I do type a lot. Sorry!

Effie

[LarryRda]

Thanks for the kind words for all of us "polyglot pray-ers". It's a comfort to feel that even if we mix up or combine the words, the words are about God and He will hear them and understand.

One of these days, we'll all speak His language, a speech too beautiful for us to be able to utter right now.....

With prayers,

Mary

[HartOvara]

One of these days, we'll all speak His language, a speech too beautiful for us to be able to utter right now.....

With prayers,

Mary

Beautiful, and so true.

[buchmausar]

Or as a schoolfriend of mine used to say to me, what's the point of learning all those languages when you haven't got anything to say in any of them?

I know how to say Christ's name in several languages. That's something to say and worthy.

About language confusion. My grandfather spoke 7 and knew 9 languages. His best advise: Never learn two languages concurrently. I love him and he is my hero (one of them) and I take his advise at heart. I try to learn 3-4 concurrently.

[Adimos]

I know how to say Christ's name in several languages. That's something to say and worthy.

An excellent reply.

About language confusion. My grandfather spoke 7 and knew 9 languages. His best advise: Never learn two languages concurrently. I love him and he is my hero (one of them) and I take his advise at heart. I try to learn 3-4 concurrently. As they say about beers - two is too many, three is too few.

[Afigenatjola]

..... jack of all trades, master of none.

For us girls, that should be "Jill of all trades, mistress of none".

[EvaQWmrm]

For us girls, that should be "Jill of all trades, mistress of none".

There must be a more attractive name than Jill for us! It sounds like chill to me sometimes. I do not like cold.

[mensforyouthis]

Since it did not have in Portuguese, here it is:

Senhor Jesus Cristo, Filho de Deus, tem piedade de mim, um pecador. (for men)
http://www.geocities.com/fabiolins/jesus.mp3

Senhor Jesus Cristo, Filho de Deus, tem piedade de mim, uma pecadora. (for women)

"Our Father"
Pai Nosso

Pai nosso que estais no Céu
santificado seja o Vosso nome
venha a nós o Vosso reino
seja feita a Vossa vontade
assim na terra como no Céu
o pão nosso de cada dia nos dai hoje
e perdoai as nossas ofensas
assim como nós perdoamos a quem nos tem ofendido
não nos deixeis cair em tentação
mas livrai-nos do mal
Amém
http://www.geocities.com/fabiolins/painosso.mp3

[rarpAcconavox]

I just noticed Nina was waiting for the prayer in suomi in January. Here goes in Finnish:

Herra Jeesus Kristus, Jumalan Poika, armahda minua syntistä!

The Lord's prayer:

Isä meidän, joka olet taivaissa,
pyhitetty olkoon Sinun nimesi,
tulkoon Sinun valtakuntasi,
tapahtukoon Sinun tahtosi myös maan päällä niinkuin taivaissa!
Anna meille tänä päivänä jokapäiväinen leipämme
ja anna meille meidän velkamme anteeksi niinkuin mekin annamme anteeksi velallisillemme.
Äläkä saata meitä kiusaukseen vaan päästä meidät pahasta!

Amen

In Christ
Anna K