When They Come For Your Guns . . . You Will Turn Them Over - DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate

**Mowselelew** · 07-31-2012, 02:42 AM

"When they come for my gun, they will have to pry it out of my cold, dead hands," is a common refrain I often hear from the Neo-Cons when there is a threat, credible or otherwise, that the US government is going to take their firearms.

And, when I hear this crazy talk, I agree with them openly. "You are right. They will pry your gun from your cold dead hands," which I often follow with the question, "And where will that leave you except face down in a pool of your own blood the middle of the street, just another dead fool resisting the State?"

This is not a question they are comfortable with, if only because the intent of their saber-rattling was to imply they would fight to keep their weapons, and win.

Nice fantasy. It’s not happening.

If the federal government decides to disarm the public, and one of these (see photo below) rolls down your street after a not-so-subtle request that you kindly turn over your firearms and ammunition "for the common good," it will be nothing less than suicide by cop to do anything other than what you are told.

"Want to take this on?"

The militarization of US police forces is ongoing and escalating. Many cities and towns now own tanks, armed personnel carriers, even attack helicopters, and almost all are outfitted with military weapons not available to the general public.

And, it is not just your hometown cops who are getting new boy-toys. The military itself is buying up weaponry not just for use in the current or next scheduled war, but to deal with the likes of you, citizens who don't seem to understand that the Bill of Rights has been overruled, and that specifically includes, but is not limited to, the right to protest and engage in civil disobedience.

Also ignored (as if it didn't even exist) is the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 which generally bars the military from law enforcement activities within the United States.

According to Public Intelligence:

"...for the last two years, the President’s Budget Submissions for the Department of Defense have included purchases of a significant amount of combat equipment, including armored vehicles, helicopters and even artillery, under an obscure section of the FY2008 National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) for the purposes of “homeland defense missions, domestic emergency responses, and providing military support to civil authorities.” Items purchased under the section include combat vehicles, tanks, helicopters, artillery, mortar systems, missiles, small arms and communications equipment. Justifications for the budget items indicate that many of the purchases are part of routine resupply and maintenance, yet in each case the procurement is cited as being “necessary for use by the active and reserve components of the Armed Forces for homeland defense missions, domestic emergency responses, and providing military support to civil authorities” under section 1815 of the FY 2008 NDAA." (Emphasis supplied.)

And, they are not just arming cops and weekend warriors for domestic purposes. Active duty Marines are now being trained for law enforcement operations all over the world (of which the US remains a part) specifically to deal with civil uprisings, and the US government knows that civil uprisings are coming to a town near you just as soon as the fantasy of a healing economy is shattered, the US dollar fails, and unemployment goes to 30%+ in real numbers.

And, to you tough-talking Neo-Cons with your AR-15 rifles and a few thousand rounds of ammo, here is reality: they will take your guns, and no, all your Second Amendment bluster aside, you are not going to do anything about it. You are not going to take on a platoon of Marines with state of the art automatic weapons and the best body armor you cannot buy protected by armed personnel carriers and attack helicopters unless you choose to die that day -- for nothing.

You will either be in the country or out, and if you are in, you will stay in and you will comply.

That is your choice . . . for the moment.

http://www.dollarvigilante.com/blog/...them-over.html

**Lt_Apple** · 07-31-2012, 02:50 AM

I'm not afraid of dying and I won't be bullied.

**DuesTyr** · 07-31-2012, 02:59 AM

They would have to do it all in one massive roll out which is impossible.

Once the word starts spreading of mass confiscation everything becomes twilight zone.

**idobestbuyonlinepp** · 07-31-2012, 03:03 AM

Three problems:

Many retired military and peace officers take their (lifetime) oath very seriously
Many current military and peace officers take their oath very seriously
Those who don't won't want to be anywhere except with their families if sugar turns to shit after the first 'surge'

This isn't the sandbox.

**Lebybynctisee** · 07-31-2012, 03:18 AM

FEMA camp < death

**ranndomderr** · 07-31-2012, 03:42 AM

A simple road flare can remove those nasty tanks from the chessboard, fuel trucks burn easily and are much softer targets.

**goatteatromiag** · 07-31-2012, 04:02 AM

They may have bad machines, but considering they can't even beat a bunch of towel heads with 40 year old technology, I don't consider them invincible.

I don't look forward this scenario, but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them.

**CowextetleSix** · 07-31-2012, 04:16 AM

City folk in the Major Metros are going to have a hard time because that is where they can hit hard and quick.......

Hopefully I will be gone before it happens .......... but if the hammer falls and im in town.

I got some hard descions to make.

My Firearms are the last line of defense for those who i care the most about in this world............ I take that sh!t very seriously

So Its not going to be a good day for my self and at least several of them.

**abouthotels** · 07-31-2012, 04:21 AM

but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them.

That's very well said. I'm not turning in my guns. I'll try to avoid a fight if I can, but I ain't about to be bullied, and I'm not afraid to die either.

I've been a hair trigger to being in a gunfight in the past. I've pointed a gun a lot of folks too, in the past.

At the time, you do what you need to do. You can think about it afterwards. For each thread that is posted, about taking guns away, I smile because I know it's not going to happen. Even if they try it. There's too many folks here, in our nation, that would not let it happen.

That, I believe in.

**plantBanceper** · 07-31-2012, 04:23 AM

get a couple of stolen firearms, then promptly bury them w/several cases of ammo...that way, an unregistered piece is safely off the streets and if/when tshtf (and the current rules no longer apply) and they've confiscated all your legal stuff, you can still bug out and be able to protect yourself. in a shtf scenario, i won't care if the gun i'm carrying is registered or not. all that matters is whether it fires or not.

**NudiJuicervich** · 07-31-2012, 04:27 AM

For those of you who have lots of guns, wouldn't you keep them stashed in different places, and if they come after you, just surrender some of them to make it look like you are complying? How would they know how many you have?

Edit: I see that freespirit has just brought this up as an option!

**abouthotels** · 07-31-2012, 04:28 AM

get a couple of stolen firearms, then promptly bury them w/several cases of ammo...that way, an unregistered piece is safely off the streets and if/when tshtf (and the current rules no longer apply) and they've confiscated all your legal stuff, you can still bug out and be able to protect yourself. in a shtf scenario, i won't care if the gun i'm carrying is registered or not. all that matters is whether it fires or not.

This is very good idea. I like this idea! I would never recommend acquiring stolen guns, or unregistered guns, or guns with #'s filed off, etc. That is a felony. But, if you bury them in a smart place, with ammo, it actually would get a gun off the street and could be used for lawful purposes in the future, in a collapse scenario.

Excellent idea, Freespirit.

**abouthotels** · 07-31-2012, 04:32 AM

For those of you who have lots of guns, wouldn't you keep them stashed in different places, and if they come after you, just surrender some of them to make it look like you are complying? How would they know how many you have?

Sparky, every gun, that's legally registered, they know that we have it. A simple click of a mouse button, they could bring up every gun you own, your mother owns, etc. We are all profiled. It's all in the system.

They need a reason to come take our guns. And we need the courage to not let them. That's the bottom line.

**NudiJuicervich** · 07-31-2012, 05:13 AM

Sparky, every gun, that's legally registered, they know that we have it. A simple click of a mouse button, they could bring up every gun you own, your mother owns, etc. We are all profiled. It's all in the system.

They need a reason to come take our guns. And we need the courage to not let them. That's the bottom line.

I know that's true here in Massachusetts where our guns laws are strict, but I didn't know that was true everywhere. Is all the ownership paperwork kept up-to-date and reported for transactions that take place at gun shows?

Believe me, I fully respect everyone's passion for resisting a gun confiscation, and support their rights to do so. I don't expect I'd hand mine over very readily, but I think my level of resistance would depend on the circumstances.

**CowextetleSix** · 07-31-2012, 05:21 AM

They may have bad machines, but considering they can't even beat a bunch of towel heads with 40 year old technology, I don't consider them invincible.

I don't look forward this scenario, but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them.

Nominated for Post of The Month

**idobestbuyonlinepp** · 07-31-2012, 05:35 AM

get a couple of stolen firearms

This is very good idea.

Excellent idea, Freespirit.

Oh yeah, stealing guns, buying guns from a gun thief, or buying guns from someone* who indicates the gun(s) they're selling is (are) stolen is an excellent idea! /sarc

*gun thieves (frequently tweakers) and those who knowingly support them deserve a bullet between the eyes

**spineeupsenry** · 07-31-2012, 05:38 AM

I am inclined to agree with the titular thesis (despite my distaste for the generic 'you'.) White people generally conflate speaking about something to solving the problem at hand through actions, and thus are incapable of the former. The chest-beating, including that exhibited in this thread, is likely a façade, or perhaps even a form of sympathetic magic, that hints at insecurity.

**abouthotels** · 07-31-2012, 05:45 AM

I am inclined to agree with the titular thesis. White people generally conflate speaking about something to solving the problem at hand through actions, and thus are incapable of the former. The chest-beating, including that exhibited in this thread, is likely a façade, or perhaps even a form of sympathetic magic, that hints at insecurity.

Well, I think you and midnight rambler are a couple of pussies.

Nobody is advocating anything unlawful, or violent. We are just trying to defend our rights to own guns.

Midnight, freespirit's idea isn't meant to be interpreted as committing a crime to acquire a firearm that's "not in the system". There's some gray area there. I am not publicly saying that's the right thing to do...but each individual circumstance is different. There is an open interpretation of that. Nothing is black and white.

**spineeupsenry** · 07-31-2012, 05:53 AM

Well, I think you and midnight rambler are a couple of pussies.

If it is because I do not appear to be a chest-beating fool, in diametric opposition to fools to whom I may or may not have replied, then I should think it a compliment.

From the 48 Laws of Power:

An overt trait often conceals its opposite. People who thump their chests are often big cowards; a prudish exterior may hide a lascivious soul; the uptight are often screaming for adventure; the shy are dying for attention. By probing beyond appearances, you will often find people's weaknesses in the opposite of the qualities they reveal to you.

**abouthotels** · 07-31-2012, 05:57 AM

If it is because I do not appear to be a chest-beating fool, in diametric opposition to fools to whom I may or may not have replied, then I should think it a compliment.

From the 48 Laws of Power:

You appear to be arrogant, and think you are better than others. That's annoying. Speak straight up for once, go toe to toe.

I could care less about the 48 laws of power. This is the internet.

07-31-2012, 02:42 AM	#1
Mowselelew Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 444 Senior Member	When They Come For Your Guns . . . You Will Turn Them Over "When they come for my gun, they will have to pry it out of my cold, dead hands," is a common refrain I often hear from the Neo-Cons when there is a threat, credible or otherwise, that the US government is going to take their firearms. And, when I hear this crazy talk, I agree with them openly. "You are right. They will pry your gun from your cold dead hands," which I often follow with the question, "And where will that leave you except face down in a pool of your own blood the middle of the street, just another dead fool resisting the State?" This is not a question they are comfortable with, if only because the intent of their saber-rattling was to imply they would fight to keep their weapons, and win. Nice fantasy. It’s not happening. If the federal government decides to disarm the public, and one of these (see photo below) rolls down your street after a not-so-subtle request that you kindly turn over your firearms and ammunition "for the common good," it will be nothing less than suicide by cop to do anything other than what you are told. "Want to take this on?" The militarization of US police forces is ongoing and escalating. Many cities and towns now own tanks, armed personnel carriers, even attack helicopters, and almost all are outfitted with military weapons not available to the general public. And, it is not just your hometown cops who are getting new boy-toys. The military itself is buying up weaponry not just for use in the current or next scheduled war, but to deal with the likes of you, citizens who don't seem to understand that the Bill of Rights has been overruled, and that specifically includes, but is not limited to, the right to protest and engage in civil disobedience. Also ignored (as if it didn't even exist) is the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 which generally bars the military from law enforcement activities within the United States. According to Public Intelligence: "...for the last two years, the President’s Budget Submissions for the Department of Defense have included purchases of a significant amount of combat equipment, including armored vehicles, helicopters and even artillery, under an obscure section of the FY2008 National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) for the purposes of “homeland defense missions, domestic emergency responses, and providing military support to civil authorities.” Items purchased under the section include combat vehicles, tanks, helicopters, artillery, mortar systems, missiles, small arms and communications equipment. Justifications for the budget items indicate that many of the purchases are part of routine resupply and maintenance, yet in each case the procurement is cited as being “necessary for use by the active and reserve components of the Armed Forces for homeland defense missions, domestic emergency responses, and providing military support to civil authorities” under section 1815 of the FY 2008 NDAA." (Emphasis supplied.) And, they are not just arming cops and weekend warriors for domestic purposes. Active duty Marines are now being trained for law enforcement operations all over the world (of which the US remains a part) specifically to deal with civil uprisings, and the US government knows that civil uprisings are coming to a town near you just as soon as the fantasy of a healing economy is shattered, the US dollar fails, and unemployment goes to 30%+ in real numbers. And, to you tough-talking Neo-Cons with your AR-15 rifles and a few thousand rounds of ammo, here is reality: they will take your guns, and no, all your Second Amendment bluster aside, you are not going to do anything about it. You are not going to take on a platoon of Marines with state of the art automatic weapons and the best body armor you cannot buy protected by armed personnel carriers and attack helicopters unless you choose to die that day -- for nothing. You will either be in the country or out, and if you are in, you will stay in and you will comply. That is your choice . . . for the moment. http://www.dollarvigilante.com/blog/...them-over.html Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
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07-31-2012, 02:50 AM	#2
Lt_Apple Join Date Dec 2008 Posts 4,489 Senior Member	I'm not afraid of dying and I won't be bullied. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
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07-31-2012, 02:59 AM	#3
DuesTyr Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 566 Senior Member	They would have to do it all in one massive roll out which is impossible. Once the word starts spreading of mass confiscation everything becomes twilight zone. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 03:03 AM	#4
idobestbuyonlinepp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 589 Senior Member	Three problems: Many retired military and peace officers take their (lifetime) oath very seriously Many current military and peace officers take their oath very seriously Those who don't won't want to be anywhere except with their families if sugar turns to shit after the first 'surge' This isn't the sandbox. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 03:18 AM	#5
Lebybynctisee Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 587 Senior Member	FEMA camp < death Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
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07-31-2012, 03:42 AM	#6
ranndomderr Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 460 Senior Member	A simple road flare can remove those nasty tanks from the chessboard, fuel trucks burn easily and are much softer targets. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:02 AM	#7
goatteatromiag Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 447 Senior Member	They may have bad machines, but considering they can't even beat a bunch of towel heads with 40 year old technology, I don't consider them invincible. I don't look forward this scenario, but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:16 AM	#8
CowextetleSix Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 473 Senior Member	City folk in the Major Metros are going to have a hard time because that is where they can hit hard and quick....... Hopefully I will be gone before it happens .......... but if the hammer falls and im in town. I got some hard descions to make. My Firearms are the last line of defense for those who i care the most about in this world............ I take that sh!t very seriously So Its not going to be a good day for my self and at least several of them. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:21 AM	#9
abouthotels Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 541 Senior Member	but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them. That's very well said. I'm not turning in my guns. I'll try to avoid a fight if I can, but I ain't about to be bullied, and I'm not afraid to die either. I've been a hair trigger to being in a gunfight in the past. I've pointed a gun a lot of folks too, in the past. At the time, you do what you need to do. You can think about it afterwards. For each thread that is posted, about taking guns away, I smile because I know it's not going to happen. Even if they try it. There's too many folks here, in our nation, that would not let it happen. That, I believe in. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:23 AM	#10
plantBanceper Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 375 Senior Member	get a couple of stolen firearms, then promptly bury them w/several cases of ammo...that way, an unregistered piece is safely off the streets and if/when tshtf (and the current rules no longer apply) and they've confiscated all your legal stuff, you can still bug out and be able to protect yourself. in a shtf scenario, i won't care if the gun i'm carrying is registered or not. all that matters is whether it fires or not. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:27 AM	#11
NudiJuicervich Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 570 Senior Member	For those of you who have lots of guns, wouldn't you keep them stashed in different places, and if they come after you, just surrender some of them to make it look like you are complying? How would they know how many you have? Edit: I see that freespirit has just brought this up as an option! Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:28 AM	#12
abouthotels Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 541 Senior Member	get a couple of stolen firearms, then promptly bury them w/several cases of ammo...that way, an unregistered piece is safely off the streets and if/when tshtf (and the current rules no longer apply) and they've confiscated all your legal stuff, you can still bug out and be able to protect yourself. in a shtf scenario, i won't care if the gun i'm carrying is registered or not. all that matters is whether it fires or not. This is very good idea. I like this idea! I would never recommend acquiring stolen guns, or unregistered guns, or guns with #'s filed off, etc. That is a felony. But, if you bury them in a smart place, with ammo, it actually would get a gun off the street and could be used for lawful purposes in the future, in a collapse scenario. Excellent idea, Freespirit. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 04:32 AM	#13
abouthotels Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 541 Senior Member	For those of you who have lots of guns, wouldn't you keep them stashed in different places, and if they come after you, just surrender some of them to make it look like you are complying? How would they know how many you have? Sparky, every gun, that's legally registered, they know that we have it. A simple click of a mouse button, they could bring up every gun you own, your mother owns, etc. We are all profiled. It's all in the system. They need a reason to come take our guns. And we need the courage to not let them. That's the bottom line. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 05:13 AM	#14
NudiJuicervich Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 570 Senior Member	Sparky, every gun, that's legally registered, they know that we have it. A simple click of a mouse button, they could bring up every gun you own, your mother owns, etc. We are all profiled. It's all in the system. They need a reason to come take our guns. And we need the courage to not let them. That's the bottom line. I know that's true here in Massachusetts where our guns laws are strict, but I didn't know that was true everywhere. Is all the ownership paperwork kept up-to-date and reported for transactions that take place at gun shows? Believe me, I fully respect everyone's passion for resisting a gun confiscation, and support their rights to do so. I don't expect I'd hand mine over very readily, but I think my level of resistance would depend on the circumstances. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 05:21 AM	#15
CowextetleSix Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 473 Senior Member	They may have bad machines, but considering they can't even beat a bunch of towel heads with 40 year old technology, I don't consider them invincible. I don't look forward this scenario, but what has to be at the forefront of your mind if/when this happens is, if you turn over your guns you are not only sacrificing yourself, but your family and generations unborn, to tyrants. It is unfair for you to make that decision for them. Nominated for Post of The Month Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
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Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 20 (0 members and 20 guests)

07-31-2012, 05:35 AM	#16
idobestbuyonlinepp Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 589 Senior Member	get a couple of stolen firearms This is very good idea. Excellent idea, Freespirit. Oh yeah, stealing guns, buying guns from a gun thief, or buying guns from someone* who indicates the gun(s) they're selling is (are) stolen is an excellent idea! /sarc *gun thieves (frequently tweakers) and those who knowingly support them deserve a bullet between the eyes Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
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07-31-2012, 05:38 AM	#17
spineeupsenry Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 453 Senior Member	I am inclined to agree with the titular thesis (despite my distaste for the generic 'you'.) White people generally conflate speaking about something to solving the problem at hand through actions, and thus are incapable of the former. The chest-beating, including that exhibited in this thread, is likely a façade, or perhaps even a form of sympathetic magic, that hints at insecurity. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 05:45 AM	#18
abouthotels Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 541 Senior Member	I am inclined to agree with the titular thesis. White people generally conflate speaking about something to solving the problem at hand through actions, and thus are incapable of the former. The chest-beating, including that exhibited in this thread, is likely a façade, or perhaps even a form of sympathetic magic, that hints at insecurity. Well, I think you and midnight rambler are a couple of pussies. Nobody is advocating anything unlawful, or violent. We are just trying to defend our rights to own guns. Midnight, freespirit's idea isn't meant to be interpreted as committing a crime to acquire a firearm that's "not in the system". There's some gray area there. I am not publicly saying that's the right thing to do...but each individual circumstance is different. There is an open interpretation of that. Nothing is black and white. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 05:53 AM	#19
spineeupsenry Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 453 Senior Member	Well, I think you and midnight rambler are a couple of pussies. If it is because I do not appear to be a chest-beating fool, in diametric opposition to fools to whom I may or may not have replied, then I should think it a compliment. From the 48 Laws of Power: An overt trait often conceals its opposite. People who thump their chests are often big cowards; a prudish exterior may hide a lascivious soul; the uptight are often screaming for adventure; the shy are dying for attention. By probing beyond appearances, you will often find people's weaknesses in the opposite of the qualities they reveal to you. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote

07-31-2012, 05:57 AM	#20
abouthotels Join Date Nov 2005 Posts 541 Senior Member	If it is because I do not appear to be a chest-beating fool, in diametric opposition to fools to whom I may or may not have replied, then I should think it a compliment. From the 48 Laws of Power: You appear to be arrogant, and think you are better than others. That's annoying. Speak straight up for once, go toe to toe. I could care less about the 48 laws of power. This is the internet. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter
	Quote