[peakyesno]

bring it on lol

last time i was ameer of a jamaat i ended up beating a very troublesome guy up.

I see you have a long way to go

[n2Oddw8P]

correct.

If i was given elaan responsibility in TJ (i.e, the annoucement thats given after jamaat salah in the masjid by TJs that such and such a talk will take place) i'll say it as this:

"Our success in this world and the world hereafter lays in following the commands of Allah through the way shown by Nabi (saw). To get this into our lives requires effort, regarding one of these efforts and one of the ways in practicing one of these efforts, inshalllah an important talk will take place after the remaining salah/duas. All brothers are requested to participant, inshallah it'll be very beneficial"

Rather than the one thats always said:

"Our success in this world and the world hereafter lays in following the commands of Allah through the way shown by Nabi (saw). To get this into our lives requires effort, regarding this effort, inshalllah an important talk will take place after the remaining salah/duas. All brothers are requested to participant, inshallah it'll be very beneficial"

There is actually a better way to make the announcement, which ensures that it does not highlight the work as the only work, and at the same time, it does not come across as significantly different from the common announcement:

"Our success in this world and the world hereafter lays in following the commands of Allah through the way shown by Nabi (saw).
To get this into our lives requires effort,
regarding this, inshaAllah an important talk will take place after the remaining salah/duas.
All brothers are requested to participant,
inshaAllah it'll be very beneficial"


Wallaahu A'lam.

[neerewed]

I feel ashamed that people mock and refute the work of tabligh.

My purpose of making thread was not this, but to clarify a confusion. If people who refute or mock the work of tabligh then read what great personalites like these said :

Hakimul Ummah Hazrat Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi r.alayhi : "Molvi Ilyas has changed 'yas' (despondency) into 'as' (hope)" "This is the original effort."

Sheikhul Islam Hazrat Maulana Husain Ahmad Madani r.alayhi :"Dear brothers! This is a tablighi gathering and this tabligh was originally the practice of Rasulullah s.a.w. The work you are doing is therefore not insignificant. I give you the glad tidings that Allah has granted you the opportunity to carry out a great service."

Hazrat Maulana Qari Muhammad Tayyib r.alayhi: "There are four ways of attaining self reformation and by good chance, they all happen to be found in the tablighi jama'at. It includes sitting in the company of the pious, it includes dzikr and fikr, it includes brotherhood for the pleasure of Allah, it includes taking lessons from enemies and also taking account of oneself. The tablighi jama'at is a conglomeration of the four. For an average person there can be no way better than this for attaining self-reformation.

Hazrat Mufti Mahmud Hassan Gangohi r.alayhi: "The tablighi jama'at gave Darul Ulum (Deoband) a Mufti. The Darul Ulum needed a Mufti, so they requested the tablighi jama'at who gave them a Mufti as I am first a tablighi then a Mufti."

Hazrat Maulana Yusuf Binori r.alayhi :"The work of da'wah is the greater jihad."

People who support the work of tabligh :
Haji Abdul Wahab (db) [ khalifa of moulana ahmed ali lahori (ra), and moulana raipuri (ra)]
Moualana saad (db)
Shaykh ul hadith moulana zakariya (ra)
Moulana Ilyas ghouman (db)
Mufti Taqi Usmani (db)
Mufti Rafi Usmani (db)
Moulana Tariq Jameel (db)
How can I forget the great scholar of this time who is Moulana makki al hijazi (db)
....Soooo many more, I can keep going on and on...

But one thing to point, when these great 'ulama who have spent their life studying hadith and quran are saying that this work is authentic and is the greatest work of today's time, then should I listen to those who are layman and mock/refute this work?

One more thing to notice, my local Imam is from Al-Azhar University (in egypt) and is a great scholar, visits there every year. He himself has praised moulana ilyas (ra), and said that this work of tabligh is authentic. And the Al-Azhar University has put a stamp that this work is authentic.

I feel ashamed, we follow our desires and our opinions. Do you want me to leave a rolls royce and take the mini cooper (actually even mini cooper is nice) but lets say something cheaper then that? simple a person who is mentally crazy will pick rolls royce, and they are great ulama who have supported this work and spent their time in this work.

May Allah guide us
I don't know why some Ulema say this Tabligh work is not Fardh???
Even great great Ulema said like my brother you mentioned names above.........
But some of today's Ulema don't behave like other ulema behaved ......... it is very sad to here this

But Afterall I will say we should respect all Ulema ( Who support Tabligh or who don't Support) because this we learnt from our elders...
May Allah forgive me if i said anything wrong

[BrianGoldsmith]

I see you have a long way to go

a VERRRRRRY long way to go hazrat.

[giturbewan]

Al hamdullillah Mufti Ebrahim Desai Saheb (Damat Barakatuhum) has cleared the confusion which I had and other people had.

In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.

As-salāmu `alaykum wa-rahmatullāhi wa-barakātuh.

Muhtaram,

Tabligh is an Arabic word literally meaning “to convey”.

Contextually it refers to conveying the message of Islam. The word Tableegh is commonly used to refer to the Tableegh Jamaat movement in which people spend 3 days or 40 days or 4 months or 1 year in Tableegh.

Alhamdulillah, the Tabligh effort has been proven to be beneficial in conscientising people about their religious duties and reforming the lives of many people.

I fully support the noble effort of Tableegh.

However, it is important to note that the specific form and way of the Tabligh effort is not specifically mentioned in the Shariah. It is recommended. The actual mission of Rasullullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) was Da’wah with Ta’leem (educating) and Tazkiyah (purification of the soul). The present form of Tableegh is one form of Da’wah. It is not the only way of Da’wah. To confine the obligation of Da’wah to the Tableegh movement is erroneous.

There are innumerable ways of Da’wah and all forms of Da’wah practiced within the confines of Shariah should be supported and complimented. It is therefore incorrect for some ardent supporters of Tabligh to claim an absolute right of Da’wah through Tabligh. Such an attitude is a great injustice to the broader concept of Da’wah and is an extremist attitude.

It is even worse to claim that Tabligh is more important than Tazkiyah. Tazkiyah is Fardh. The specific form and way of Tabligh is not Fardh. It is merely recommended. How can a recommended form of Da’wah be preferred over a Fardh act?

To reform oneself and cleanse oneself from the evil instincts within ourselves is Fardh.

It is also very unfortunate that we hear of reports from some elders of Tabligh Jamaat referring to Tazkiyah as a secondary issue, not so important, e.t.c.

How can a Fardh act not be of any importance at all? Such statements are incorrect and misleading. It is expected of the Ulama engaged in Tabligh and Tazkiyah to encourage people to do both, Tazkiyah and Tabligh.

If one does not go out for 3 days, 40 days or 4 months in Jamaat, he is not sinful and will not be answerable in the court of Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta’ala). However, if one does not reform himself from pride, jealousy, ostentation, e.t.c, he will be sinful and answerable to Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta’ala).

People actively engaged in Tabligh should realize this and adjust accordingly. One can never attain the Maqam (position) of Ihsaan by merely going out in Tabligh without reforming oneself. The singular approach of Tabligh whilst sidestepping the importance of Tazkiyah is an incorrect view and erroneous. It is misleading.

Tazkiyah is Fardh. The specific form of Tabligh is not Fardh. It is recommended. It is an effort we too support.

And Allah knows best.

Mufti Ebrahim Desai

Dar al- Mahmood

Source : http://tasawwuf.daralmahmood.org/muf...tabligh-jamaat

excellent,
alhamdulillah

[Snweyuag]

Salaam

If it was permissible (or even appropriate), I would have said "high five" to Mufti Saheb. A very important clarification indeed!

Unfortunately, I have come across instances where brothers had the "My way (i.e. tabligh) or the highway" attitude. Allahu a'lam.

[offemyJuccete]

Assalamualaikum brother...i visited the link give in your post...!
i guess you should ask the same question to elders of tabligh(like Maulana Saad Sb DB or Haji Abdul Wahab SB DB) and also forward them the answer given by Esteemed Mufti Ehrahim Desai Sb DB...!
Brother you can write a letter to Maulana Saad Sb DB or you can visit Nizamudin Markaz regarding any confusion about tabligh...i guess it is better to ask issues regarding masail to ulemas not old workers of tabligh...similarly ask issues regarding tabligh to elders of tabligh not other ulemas ...!
Brother it would be great if you listen to following bayan ....!
http://www.islamibayanaat.com/Hydera...d%20Ijtema.mp3
The rough translation of 1st part is written in quotes in the following link...hope you know urdu...because certain things cant be understood without knowing urdu...!
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...l=1#post776245
See the last of bayan(1st part) ...there it is written as "ye hai hamare dilon mein is ka yaqin ho ke ye kaam tarbiyat aur tazkiye ke liye kafi hai"

Walaikum musalam.

I can not do this. This lowly person is very shy to go infront of moulana saad (db) or haji abdul wahab (db).

Guys who are confused, understand something. I asked the question merely to differentiate between tazkiya and tabligh. Nothing more. What issues which people have who are posting should be asked to Mufti Ebrahim Desai (db), with that stated that tabligh itself consist of tazkiya.

[golozhopik]

I know it may not feel good to many but can some scholar see and comment on this book?

http://www.mediafire.com/file/1a6jpr...iz_Guftugo.pdf

PS: Lets us not jump on judging intentions of others.If MODs feel it is inappropriate to post the link, kindly remove it.

[paypaltoegold1]

However, it is important to note that the specific form and way of the Tabligh effort is not specifically mentioned in the Shariah. It is recommended. The actual mission of Rasullullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) was Da’wah with Ta’leem (educating) and Tazkiyah (purification of the soul). The present form of Tableegh is one form of Da’wah. It is not the only way of Da’wah. To confine the obligation of Da’wah to the Tableegh movement is erroneous.

There are innumerable ways of Da’wah and all forms of Da’wah practiced within the confines of Shariah should be supported and complimented. It is therefore incorrect for some ardent supporters of Tabligh to claim an absolute right of Da’wah through Tabligh. Such an attitude is a great injustice to the broader concept of Da’wah and is an extremist attitude.

It is even worse to claim that Tabligh is more important than Tazkiyah. Tazkiyah is Fardh. The specific form and way of Tabligh is not Fardh. It is merely recommended. How can a recommended form of Da’wah be preferred over a Fardh act?

To reform oneself and cleanse oneself from the evil instincts within ourselves is Fardh.

It is also very unfortunate that we hear of reports from some elders of Tabligh Jamaat referring to Tazkiyah as a secondary issue, not so important, e.t.c.

How can a Fardh act not be of any importance at all? Such statements are incorrect and misleading. It is expected of the Ulama engaged in Tabligh and Tazkiyah to encourage people to do both, Tazkiyah and Tabligh.

If one does not go out for 3 days, 40 days or 4 months in Jamaat, he is not sinful and will not be answerable in the court of Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta’ala). However, if one does not reform himself from pride, jealousy, ostentation, e.t.c, he will be sinful and answerable to Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta’ala).

People actively engaged in Tabligh should realize this and adjust accordingly. One can never attain the Maqam (position) of Ihsaan by merely going out in Tabligh without reforming oneself. The singular approach of Tabligh whilst sidestepping the importance of Tazkiyah is an incorrect view and erroneous. It is misleading.

Tazkiyah is Fardh. The specific form of Tabligh is not Fardh. It is recommended. It is an effort we too support.

And Allah knows best.

Mufti Ebrahim Desai

Dar al- Mahmood

Source : http://tasawwuf.daralmahmood.org/muf...tabligh-jamaat

Two points which come to my mind.

1. There are many Mashaykh within Tableeghi Jamaat who do Tazkiyah within the framework of Tableegh
2. The present day methodology of Islah adopted by many Mashaykh is also just a form (of Islam) e.g. this method recommended by our dear noble and respected Shaykh (Maulana) Saleem Dhorat is “A METHOD OF TAZKIYAH” is just a FORM.

So the methods adopted by our Mashaykh (Naqshabndi-Mujaddidi, Chishti etc) are FORMS while Tableegh is also a FORM and there are other FORMS e.g. Jihad, studying and accompanying Ulama/Mashaykh etc.

Tazkiyah is FARD but its forms DIFFER based on Ijtehaad of Ulama-e-Kiraam and a person can pick and choose or combine as he/she sees of benefit.

And off course some Ulama/Mashaykh can prefer one FORM over another but that's also down to their personal choice and Ijtehaad.

[giturbewan]

Two points which come to my mind.

1. There are many Mashaykh within Tableeghi Jamaat who do Tazkiyah within the framework of Tableegh
2. The present day methodology of Islah adopted by many Mashaykh is also just a form (of Islam) e.g. this method recommended by our dear noble and respected Shaykh (Maulana) Saleem Dhorat is “A METHOD OF TAZKIYAH” is just a FORM.

So the methods adopted by our Mashaykh (Naqshabndi-Mujaddidi, Chishti etc) are FORMS while Tableegh is also a FORM and there are other FORMS e.g. Jihad, studying and accompanying Ulama/Mashaykh etc.

Tazkiyah is FARD but its forms DIFFER based on Ijtehaad of Ulama-e-Kiraam and a person can pick and choose or combine as he/she sees of benefit.

And off course some Ulama/Mashaykh can prefer one FORM over another but that's also down to their personal choice and Ijtehaad.

excellently explained

as molana mohammed muslim said
there are paths you choose
and paths allah chooses for you

some people go on the standard tarteebs..chosen mujahidah
others are thrown into the maelstrom of haalaat..unexpected extreme mujahidah

which if understood is not a path but highway

allahs pull

[giturbewan]

excellently explained

as molana mohammed muslim said
there are paths you choose
and paths allah chooses for you

some people go on the standard tarteebs..chosen mujahidah
others are thrown into the maelstrom of haalaat..unexpected extreme mujahidah

which if understood is not a path but highway

allahs pull

the benefits of the tarteeb of tabligh and tazkiyah done correctly are there for all im sure

[golozhopik]

Two points which come to my mind.

1. There are many Mashaykh within Tableeghi Jamaat who do Tazkiyah within the framework of Tableegh
2. The present day methodology of Islah adopted by many Mashaykh is also just a form (of Islam) e.g. this method recommended by our dear noble and respected Shaykh (Maulana) Saleem Dhorat is “A METHOD OF TAZKIYAH” is just a FORM.

So the methods adopted by our Mashaykh (Naqshabndi-Mujaddidi, Chishti etc) are FORMS while Tableegh is also a FORM and there are other FORMS e.g. Jihad, studying and accompanying Ulama/Mashaykh etc.

Tazkiyah is FARD but its forms DIFFER based on Ijtehaad of Ulama-e-Kiraam and a person can pick and choose or combine as he/she sees of benefit.

And off course some Ulama/Mashaykh can prefer one FORM over another but that's also down to their personal choice and Ijtehaad.

Very well explained.

Just to add that JIHAD is one of the foremost and effective method of tazkiyah and eeman

الَّذِينَ قَالَ لَهُمُ النَّاسُ إِنَّ النَّاسَ قَدْ جَمَعُواْ لَكُمْ فَاخْشَوْهُمْ فَزَادَهُمْ إِيمَاناً وَقَالُواْ حَسْبُنَا اللّهُ وَنِعْمَ الْوَكِيلُ

Allatheena qala lahumu alnnasu inna alnnasa qad jamaAAoo lakum faikhshawhum fazadahum eemanan waqaloo hasbuna Allahu waniAAma alwakeelu
3:173 Men said to them: "A great army is gathering against you": And frightened them: But it (only) increased their Faith: They said: "For us Allah sufficeth, and He is the best disposer of affairs."

and

وَلَمَّا رَأَى الْمُؤْمِنُونَ الْأَحْزَابَ قَالُوا هَذَا مَا وَعَدَنَا اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَصَدَقَ اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَمَا زَادَهُمْ إِلَّا إِيمَانًا وَتَسْلِيمًا

Walamma raa almuminoona alahzaba qaloo hatha ma waAAadana Allahu warasooluhu wasadaqa Allahu warasooluhu wama zadahum illa eemanan watasleeman
33:22 When the Believers saw the Confederate forces, they said: "This is what Allah and his Messenger had promised us, and Allah and His Messenger told us what was true." And it only added to their faith and their zeal in obedience

هُوَ الَّذِي أَنزَلَ السَّكِينَةَ فِي قُلُوبِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ لِيَزْدَادُوا إِيمَانًا مَّعَ إِيمَانِهِمْ وَلِلَّهِ جُنُودُ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَكَانَ اللَّهُ عَلِيمًا حَكِيمًا

Huwa allathee anzala alssakeenata fee quloobi almumineena liyazdadoo eemanan maAAa eemanihim walillahi junoodu alssamawati waalardi wakana Allahu AAaleeman hakeeman
48:4 It is He Who sent down tranquillity into the hearts of the Believers, that they may add faith to their faith;- for to Allah belong the Forces of the heavens and the earth; and Allah is Full of Knowledge and Wisdom;-


Please correct me if i am wrong.

[paypaltoegold1]

Very well explained.

Just to add that JIHAD is one of the foremost and effective method of tazkiyah and eeman

الَّذِينَ قَالَ لَهُمُ النَّاسُ إِنَّ النَّاسَ قَدْ جَمَعُواْ لَكُمْ فَاخْشَوْهُمْ فَزَادَهُمْ إِيمَاناً وَقَالُواْ حَسْبُنَا اللّهُ وَنِعْمَ الْوَكِيلُ

Allatheena qala lahumu alnnasu inna alnnasa qad jamaAAoo lakum faikhshawhum fazadahum eemanan waqaloo hasbuna Allahu waniAAma alwakeelu
3:173 Men said to them: "A great army is gathering against you": And frightened them: But it (only) increased their Faith: They said: "For us Allah sufficeth, and He is the best disposer of affairs."

and

وَلَمَّا رَأَى الْمُؤْمِنُونَ الْأَحْزَابَ قَالُوا هَذَا مَا وَعَدَنَا اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَصَدَقَ اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَمَا زَادَهُمْ إِلَّا إِيمَانًا وَتَسْلِيمًا

Walamma raa almuminoona alahzaba qaloo hatha ma waAAadana Allahu warasooluhu wasadaqa Allahu warasooluhu wama zadahum illa eemanan watasleeman
33:22 When the Believers saw the Confederate forces, they said: "This is what Allah and his Messenger had promised us, and Allah and His Messenger told us what was true." And it only added to their faith and their zeal in obedience

هُوَ الَّذِي أَنزَلَ السَّكِينَةَ فِي قُلُوبِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ لِيَزْدَادُوا إِيمَانًا مَّعَ إِيمَانِهِمْ وَلِلَّهِ جُنُودُ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَكَانَ اللَّهُ عَلِيمًا حَكِيمًا

Huwa allathee anzala alssakeenata fee quloobi almumineena liyazdadoo eemanan maAAa eemanihim walillahi junoodu alssamawati waalardi wakana Allahu AAaleeman hakeeman
48:4 It is He Who sent down tranquillity into the hearts of the Believers, that they may add faith to their faith;- for to Allah belong the Forces of the heavens and the earth; and Allah is Full of Knowledge and Wisdom;-


Please correct me if i am wrong.

Absolutely agreed.


Whether you read the life stories of Ulamah like earlier Scholars such as Sayydina Abdullah ibn Mubarak (RA) or later ones like Shah Ismael Shaheed (RA) it becomes very clear what is Tazkiyah meant to be and what is the most effective method for it.

Today, we just discuss various forms which are prevalent in our time and try to prefer our method over another.

[offemyJuccete]

I believe this matter should go to moulana saad (db) to clarify it.

If someone is close by moulana saad (db) or is planing to visit then please do pass this so that he may clarify it.

[paypaltoegold1]

I believe this matter should go to moulana saad (db) to clarify it.

If someone is close by moulana saad (db) or is planing to visit then please do pass this so that he may clarify it.

Brother,

How about a having a balanced view of both?

1. Shaykh (Maulana) Saad Saheb (HA) believes that Tableegh is a superior method for Tazkiyah
2. Shaykh (Mufti) Ebraheem Desai (HA) believes that Tassawuff is a superior method for Tazkiyah

We as laymen shouldn't fight and benefit from both or choose whichever is suitable to our goals. No point in having a argument eitherway.

otherwise we will be refuting either one of them and get tangled up for no reason.

[AdobebePhoto]

Brother,

How about a having a balanced view of both?

1. Shaykh (Maulana) Saad Saheb (HA) believes that Tableegh is a superior method for Tazkiyah
2. Shaykh (Mufti) Ebraheem Desai (HA) believes that Tassawuff is a superior method for Tazkiyah

We as laymen shouldn't fight and benefit from both or choose whichever is suitable to our goals. No point in having a argument eitherway.

otherwise we will be refuting either one of them and get tangled up for no reason.

Assalamu alaykum

Hazrath gusthakhi maaf.

Can we re-write that us
[*] Shaykh (Mufti) Ebraheem Desai (HA) believes that Tassawuff is one method for Tazkiyah

And
[*] Shaykh (Maulana) Saad Saheb (HA) believes that Tableegh is another method for Tazkiyah

[paypaltoegold1]

Assalamu alaykum

Hazrath gusthakhi maaf.

Can we re-write that us
[*] Shaykh (Mufti) Ebraheem Desai (HA) believes that Tassawuff is one method for Tazkiyah

And
[*] Shaykh (Maulana) Saad Saheb (HA) believes that Tableegh is another method for Tazkiyah

Brother,

I thought about it but don't they think that one method is superior to the other? As they practise and propagate it?

[offemyJuccete]

Brother,

How about a having a balanced view of both?

1. Shaykh (Maulana) Saad Saheb (HA) believes that Tableegh is a superior method for Tazkiyah
2. Shaykh (Mufti) Ebraheem Desai (HA) believes that Tassawuff is a superior method for Tazkiyah

We as laymen shouldn't fight and benefit from both or choose whichever is suitable to our goals. No point in having a argument eitherway.

otherwise we will be refuting either one of them and get tangled up for no reason.

walaikum musalam,

Hadhrat,

I think I will agree with what you are saying. Since you are more experienced and more intelligent. Akhir bahro ke baat main be hikmat hoti hay.

I will conclude that, tabligh be haq hay, or tazkiya be haq hay. (both of them are the true path)

I have heard many bayans of moulana saad (db), he wants to tackle the difference(I do not mean the difference in opinion, in knowledge e.t.c) in this ummah. Such as people call salafi, deobandi, brelvi .e.tc the difference will be tackled by everyone coming to one work, which is the work of sahabah (ra), when all of the ummah of prophet (saw) will come to this work then there will be no such problems.

The best thing is that, you do tabligh with tazkiya also.

[AdobebePhoto]

Assalamu alaykum

I have heard hidaayah of Moulana Saad Sahib DB. He is not using the word superior. He is presenting dalael for "tableeg mein bhi tazkiyah hai"

[offemyJuccete]

Assalamu alaykum

I have heard hidaayah of Moulana Saad Sahib DB. He is not using the word superior. He is presenting dalael for "tableeg mein bhi tazkiyah hai"

this is the reason why I requested someone to clarify this by moulana saad (db). But nevermind, I do not see a point in this.

Is there benefit if we say that tabligh is superior to tazkiya? or tazkiya is superior to tabligh?

in the end do tabligh with tazkiya. thats it.