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06-11-2012, 02:44 AM
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#21 |
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Salaam. The Jews say: Allah's hand is fettered. Their hands are fettered and they are accursed for saying so. Nay, but both His hands are spread out wide in bounty. He bestoweth as He will. [Ma'edah : 64] He said: O Iblis! What hindereth thee from falling prostrate before that which I have created with both My hands? Art thou too proud or art thou of the high exalted? [Sad : 75] So as usual him and those who follow his opinion declare that they prove what Allah proves and deny what Allah denies. So when Allah says this does he mean physical hands? This is how they understand it I guess. |
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06-11-2012, 02:44 AM
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#22 |
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Salaam. Is it true the wife of your 12th Imam ( runner) mehdi would be doing mutah 
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06-11-2012, 02:46 AM
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#23 |
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I have a question for you ? |
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06-11-2012, 02:50 AM
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#24 |
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Please do not mock! What's there to mock ? They get rewarded . A famous shia scholar said when someone does mutah and takes shower. the number of water drops that well from his body Allah swt will record that number of good deeds for him.. So im not mocking okay.... Why would the wife of their Mehdi ( The Naked Cave Man ) be deprived out of this |
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06-11-2012, 02:53 AM
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#25 |
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May be this will shed some light... يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا إِن جَاءَكُمْ فَاسِقٌ بِنَبَإٍ فَتَبَيَّنُوا أَن تُصِيبُوا قَوْمًا بِجَهَالَةٍ فَتُصْبِحُوا عَلَىٰ مَا فَعَلْتُمْ نَادِمِينَ O you who have believed, if there comes to you a disobedient one with information, investigate, lest you harm a people out of ignorance and become, over what you have done, regretful. [49:06] |
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06-11-2012, 02:58 AM
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#26 |
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I don't know much about Sheikh Ibn Tayymiya but I can't trust your post since you copied it from a Shia website. (relying on Shia information to attack Muslim scholars??) I never said that's the view of ibn taymiya.. I just posted this on sunniforum.com so thats others can read and tell me how much truth is in it.... Since this is a Deobandi Dominated forum i would like to know the views of Ibn Taymiya regarding ahle-bayt posted in the link . HOw much truth is in it ? Shaykh Abd al-Aziz al-Dehlawi (Allah have mercy on him), after studying Ibn Taymiyya�s Minhaj al-Sunnah, was immensely distressed by his undermining of the Ahl al-Bayt (members of the Prophet's family) and the Sufis. |
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06-11-2012, 03:42 AM
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#27 |
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Argument 8
One of the harshest opponents of the Shias was Shaykh al-Islam Imam Ibn Taymiyyah(rah), who was one of the greatest scholars of Ahlesunnah and because of this some of his opponents have slandered him by claiming that he was a Nasibi (i.e. hater of Ahlel Bayt). Shiawesbsite[********************] refers to him as “Imam of the Nasibis, Ibn Taymiyya”. And yet, Ibn Taymiyyah was a lover of Ahlel Bayt; not only did he love the Ahlel Bayt, but he publically declared the necessity of loving the Ahlel Bayt as a part of the creed of the Ahlus Sunnah wal Jama’ah. So here we would like to refute the commonly used arguments by Shias, which they use inorder to accuse Imam Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) for being a Nasibi. Before we begin, we would like to make of readers aware regarding the accusations of Shias, that most of the time the Shias misquote Ibn taymiyyah’s statements and misinterpret them. Here is what another esteemed scholar of Ahlesunnah have said regarding these accusations against Imam Ibn Taymiyyah. With regard to accusation of Nasibism on Imam Ibn Taymiyah, Shah Waliyullah said: “and it was said that he (Ibn Taymiyyah) showed bad manner while talking about Sayyiduna Ali, may Allah be pleased with him. And I read his statements, so I found some of his statements were actually said in refutation of shia in their insult of the three caliphs for the things which they (the shia) thought to be bad. So this Shaykh (Ibn Taymiyyah) stands for mentioning things like that which existed in Ali (RA). As though he is saying, these things are not actually shortcomings as you have assumed it to be. Because these same things are proven from Sayyidna Ali, and he, may Allah be pleased with him, is well accepted by both shia and sunnis. So the answer you give in defense of Ali (ra) is our answer with regards to the three caliphs. And this was from his (Ibn Taymiyyah’s) great knowledge and powerful ability of debate and his acceptance of the virtues of Sayyidna Ali.” [Taken from Shaykh Muhammad Basheer Siyalkoti’s biography of Shah Waliyullah (pg. 54-59) referring it to "Maktubat Shah Waliyullah" (pg. 18-23)] Refutation of the accusations of Shiawebsite[********************] against Imam Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) Accusation 1 While comparing Abu Bakar with Ali bin Abi Talib [as], Ibn Taimiyah states in Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 7 page 331: وان ولايته الأمة خير من ولاية علي وان منفعته للمسلمين في دينهم ودنياهم اعظم من منفعة علي “His reign is better than Ali’s reign and his benefit to Muslims in their religion and life is greater than Ali’s” We don’t know how this is an insult towards Ali [ra]. Ibn Taymiyyah said that Abu Bakr’s reign was better than Ali, not that Ali’s reign was bad. If a sunni says that Abu Bakr was higher in status than Ali, it doesn’t mean Ali’s status was low. Similarly, just before the above qoute Imam Ibn Taymiyya states: وانه كان اكمل عقلا ودينا وسياسة من الثلاثة “and he (Abu Bakr) was better in intelligence, religion & politics than the three (Umar, Uthman & Ali).” Does this mean he was insulting the three caliphs?? Truthseekers can analyze that how pathetic and silly arguments shias create inorder to insult and accuse the reviver of Islam Ibn Taymiyyah(rah). Accusation 2 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 8 page 230: وعلي يقاتل ليطاع ويتصرف في النفوس والأموال فكيف يجعل هذا قتالا على الدين “Ali fought to secure obedience and rule the people and money, so how can that be deemed as fighting for sake of religion?” This is a Half quote by Shiawebsite[********************] inorder to fool the ignorant Shias, because they know very well that any lie or false accusation against Ibn Taymiyyah can easily be pushed among the ignorant Shias. Here is what Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) said: وعلي يقاتل ليطاع ويتصرف في النفوس والأموال فكيف يجعل هذا قتالا على الدين وأبو بكر يقاتل من ارتد عن الإسلام ومن ترك ما فرض الله ليطيع الله ورسوله فقط ولا يكون هذا قتالا على الدين “Ali fought to save leadership and to took control over people and property, so how come this is considered the fight for the cause of religion and Abu Bakr fighting apostates and those who stopped giving what was compulsory on them is not the fighting in the cause of religion.” Explanation: Ibn Taymiyyah’s argument was, if Abu Bakr’s Jihad was not for the sake of religion than Ali’s Jihad was also not for better cause than Abu Bakr. To understand the answer of Ibn taymiyyah we should see the context when he said these words. And when we check that then we will find thatIbn Taymiyyah was actually answering the argument of Shia scholar Al-Hilee, who said that Abu Bakr fought against Banu Hanifa by falsely labelling them as apostates. Ibn Taymiyya did not say that Ali’s Jihad was not for the sake of religion. He said in his Fatawa… قال رحمه الله عند الكلام على حديث ( ويح عمار تقتله الفئة الباغية ، يدعوهم إلى الجنة ويدعونه إلى النار ) . حديث صحيح متفق عليه و اللفظ للبخاري . قال : و هذا أيضاً يدل على صحة إمامة علي و وجوب طاعته مجموع الفتاوى (4/437 The hadeeth (Oh Ammar will kill him the transgressing group, he calls them to heaven and they call him to hell) is a Sahih hadeeth and agreed upon and this text is Bukharis’s. Ibn Taymiyyah said: and this is proof of the correctness of the leadership of Ali and obeying him. Accusation 3 We read in Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 8 page 205: وأما إسلام علي فهل يكون مخرجا له من الكفر على قولين There are two opinions as to whether Ali’s conversion to Islam released him from kufr or not” Again even this statement should be analyzed in the context in which it was said, because Ibn Taymiyyah was answering Al-Hilee’s argument that first three caliph were idol-worshippers before their conversion and Ali was Muwahhid from his childhood. Ibn Taymiyyah just applied two fiqh opinions on Ali’s conversion for the sake of answering Shias scholar(al hilli), not necessarily it was his own opinion. Accusation 4 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 4 page 137: وعلي رضي الله عنه كان قصده أن يتزوج عليها فله في أذاها غرض “Ali intended to marry so as to hurt her (Fatima) on purpose.” Again Ibn taymiyyah was answering the Shia scholar(al hilli) and this response can easily be understood by those who have common sense. When Abu Bakr was the reason of Fatima’s [ra] anger, then Abu Bakr did not had any intention to do something for his own sake. All he was doing is to save the money for poor and needy. But when Ali was the reason for Fatima’s anger then Ali had his own requirement or need. He was not marrying for someone else, wal ‘iyadh bilAllah, unlike Abu Bakr who was doing that for the sake of poor and needy and was just following Prophet’s [SAW]‘s command. Now the argument was…. If if if Abu Bakr became Kaffir by hurting Prophet’s daughter (hence hurt Prohet{saw}), then what about the fact that Ali also hurt her, having the fact that Abu Bakr’s intention was to take care of poor and to implement Prophet’s command, on the other hand Ali’s intention was to marry so as to fulfill his own need. Note that, We are concluding all this in our own words because the discussion in Mihaj As-Sunnah is long. One can just check the book, with the references given by Shiawebsite, to get the whole picture. We’re just representing the scenario of his statements in short. Accusation 5 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 7 page 172: وقد أنزل الله تعالى في على يا أيها الذين آمنوا لا تقربوا الصلاة وأنتم سكارى حتى تعلموا ما تقولون لما صلى فقرا وخلطوا “Allah had revealed for Ali {O ye who believe! Draw not near unto prayer when ye are drunken, till ye know that which ye utter,} when he prayed and recited and then got mixed up.” It was about when the wine was NOT prohibited. This incident took place when consummation of wine was permissible, hence no insult for any companions. It’s just a hadeeth which Ibn Taymiyyah qouted in his book. This hadeeth was also qouted by Tahawi, Tabri, Qurtubi, Ibn Kathir, Tirmidhi, Abu Dawud and loads of other scholars. We know that offering Salah(prayers) in direction other than Kaba is not lawful, yet we will find that Sahaba(ra) including Ali(ra) offered Salah in direction of Bait ul Muqaddas for a particular period of time. Now will the Shias accuse Ali(ra) and Sahaba(ra) for offering Salah in an incorrect direction? No, not at all, because at that time Bayt ul Muqaddas was made as Qibla of muslims and it was lawful to offer prayers in that direction. So similarly when Ali(ra) or other Sahaba(ra) consumed wine then at that time drinking of wine had not been made unlawful, it was permissible to consume wine at that time. So Ali(ra) didn’t do anything against Shariah, neither Ibn Taymiyyah claimed so, then how could this silly argument be used to denote that Ibn taymiyyah(ra) was Nasibi? Accusation 6 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 3 page 53: فإنه لما أمرهم بقيام الليل فاعتل علي رضي الله عنه بالقدر وأنه لو شاء الله لأيقظنا علم النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم أن هذا ليس فيه إلا مجرد الجدل الذي ليس بحق فقال وكان الإنسان أكثر شيء جدلا. “When he (the Prophet) ordered them to offer the night prayer, Ali [ra] came up with the prepared excuse that ‘if Allah wants he will wake us up’, the prophet realized that this was merely an argument that was not right, therefore he recited {but man is more than anything contentious}”. Firstly the Shias have inserted a particular word in the translation inorder to portray Ibn taymiyyah in a negative manner. Here is more correct translation: Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 3 page 53: فإنه لما أمرهم بقيام الليل فاعتل علي رضي الله عنه بالقدر وأنه لو شاء الله لأيقظنا علم النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم أن هذا ليس فيه إلا مجرد الجدل الذي ليس بحق فقال وكان الإنسان أكثر شيء جدلا ” When he (the Prophet) ordered them to offer the night prayer, ‘Ali (ra) used the excuse of Qadar, that if Allah wills He will wake us up …… Note:We don’t find any word such as “prepared” before the word “excuse” in the text. Secondly, this was merely an explanation of an authentic narration by Ibn Taymiyyah. Ibn taymiyyah didn’t invent anything from his own, and we must keep in mind that Ali(ra) was not infallible, he used to make humanly errors. This is in contradiction to the Shiism not with Islam. That is why the Shias try to make a big fuss out of it. But as far as Ahlesunnah is concerned then they don’t believe that any of the companion of Prophet(saw) was infallible. On the contrary they have several examples in their authentic books regarding fallible nature of some high ranking Sahaba(ra)[exclusing Ali(ra)]. So this argument by Shias, has not got any solid base. Accusation 7 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 8 page 161: وعلي قد اختلف فيه هل حفظ القرآن كله أم لا “Ali, there is disagreement about him as to whether he had memorized the whole Quran or not.” How is this, a kind of insult? There were many great companions who were not Huffaz(memorizers of Quran). Neither is it compulsory to memorize the whole Quran. Secondly the statement of Ibn Taymiyyah just implies that there isn’t a definite proof to declare that Ali(ra) had memorized the whole Quran. And anyone who is unbiased will surely say this is in no way an insult towards Ali(ra). Accusation 8 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 6 page 67: ولم يحصل بقتلهم مصلحة للمسلمين لا في دينهم ولا في دنياهم بل نقص الخير عما كان وزاد الشر “Their fighting served no benefit for the Muslims in their religion nor in their life, on the contrary the good had been decreased and the evil had been increased.” Again this is a half quote by shiawebsite. Ibn Taymiyya was replying to the Shia scholar’s argument that Umar used his own Ra’y (opinion) in matter of Talaq(divorce) etc. To this Ibn Taimiya replied that there is nothing bad in using Ra’iy and most of the Sahaba also used their own logic and view, including Ali [ra]. Ibn Taymiyah was trying to refute Shia scholar by arguing that, If one can excuse some selected people(like Ali, etc) for having opinions which in future caused bloodshed among Muslims and did not give any benefit to muslim, then why can’t Umar be excused for having his opinions on small matters. Do we need to state that the fightings among companions was of no benefit to this Ummah. Thats why we call it ‘Fitna among Sahaba’. This is what Ibn Taymiyyah was saying. Ibn Taymiyya’s statement: ومعلوم أن الرأي إن لم يكن مذموما فلا لوم على من قال به وإن كان مذموما فلا رأى أعظم ذما من رأي أريق به دم ألوف مؤلفة من المسلمين ولم يحصل بقتلهم مصلحة للمسلمين لا في دينهم ولا في دنياهم بل نقص الخير عما كان وزاد الشر على ما كان فإذا كان مثل هذا الرأي لا يعاب به فرأى عمر وغيره في مسائل الفرائض والطلاق أولى أن لا يعاب مع أن عليا شركهم في هذا الرأي وامتاز برأيه في الدماء Translation: and it is known that if the opinion is not blameworthy then there is no blame on the one who argued it and if it were blame worthy then there is no blame greater than an opinion that lead to spilling of blood of thousands and thousands of Muslims when no good to the benefit of the muslims happened by their killing, not in their religion and not in their lives. Instead the good became less than it was and the bad became more than it was. So, if such an opinion does not make it’s holder blameworthy, then the opinion of Umar and others in the issues of Faraid and divorce are more worthy not to make him blameworthy. This is in addition that Ali agreed with them in this opinion but was alone in his opinion related to blood. Accusation 9 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 4 page 20: قوله في على إنه كان يصلي الف ركعة فإن هذا لا فضيلة فيه “His (Allamah Heli’s) statement that Ali would pray one thousand raka, surely there is no virtue in it” This is true, because it’s against Prophet’s[saw] sunnah. However at the same time Ibn Taymiyya said that it’s unproven from Ali. So the whole accusation of Shias is baseless. Accusation 10 It is interesting that Ibn al Hashimi had argued that Ibn Taimiyah loved the Ahl’ul bayt (as). But the reality was comments like the above that we cited that were so outrageous that we read in Lisan al-Mizan, by ibn Hajar, Volume 6, page 320: وكم من مبالغة لتوهين كلام الرافضي أدته أحيانا إلى تنقيص علي رضي الله عنه “The exaggeration in refuting the Rafidhi text has sometimes taken him to towards belittling Ali [ra]“ This was personal view of Imam Ibn Hajar(rah). A scholar’s opinion is not hujjah against another scholar. Besides we have just seen that Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) never belittled Ali [ra]. In fact that was his own style of refuting the opponents through using opponent’s logic against them. And some times people failed to understand this style of refuting the opponents, which led them to criticize Ibn taymiyyah(rah). So let us quote before our readers the clarification and explanation for this style of Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) , by another esteemed scholar of Ahlesunnah: With regard to accusation of Nasibism on Imam Ibn Taymiyah, Shah Waliyullah said: “and it was said that he (Ibn Taymiyyah) showed bad manner while talking about Sayyiduna Ali, may Allah be pleased with him. And I read his statements, so I found some of his statements were actually said in refutation of shia in their insult of the three caliphs for the things which they (the shia) thought to be bad. So this Shaykh (Ibn Taymiyyah) stands for mentioning things like that which existed in Ali (RA). As though he is saying, these things are not actually shortcomings as you have assumed it to be. Because these same things are proven from Sayyidna Ali, and he, may Allah be pleased with him, is well accepted by both shia and sunnis. So the answer you give in defense of Ali (ra) is our answer with regards to the three caliphs. And this was from his (Ibn Taymiyyah’s) great knowledge and powerful ability of debate and his acceptance of the virtues of Sayyidna Ali.” [Taken from Shaykh Muhammad Basheer Siyalkoti’s biography of Shah Waliyullah (pg. 54-59) referring it to "Maktubat Shah Waliyullah" (pg. 18-23)] And if this doesn’t seem to be a satisfactory response to shias then let us place a mirror before them, which will surely shut their mouths. In the introduction to “Man la Yahduruhu al-Faqih” the Shia scholar al-’Allamah al-Sheikh Muhammad Jawad al-Faqih writes: مقدمة كتاب من لايحضره الفقيه – ج 1 – ص 709/ جواز السهو على النبي (ص) وسماه اسهاء من الله تعالى تبع في رايه ذلك شيخه محمد بن الحسن بن الوليد وتبعه على رأيه ذلك الشيخ الطبرسي في مجمع البيان كما نقل عنه التنكانبي في قصص العلماء والسيد الجزائري في الانوار النعمانية وفخر الدين الطريحي في مجمع البيان مادة (بدا) والمحقق الفيض الكاشاني في الوافي على مايظهر من كلامه ونقل عن الشيخ البهائي رحمه الله انه قال : ( الحمد لله الذي قطع عمره ولم يوفقه لكتابة مثل ذلك ) ونقل عن الشيخ أحمد الاحسائي انه قال : ( الصدوق في هذه المسألة كذوب ) ولايخلو قولهما من سوء ادب نربأ بامثالهما عن ذلك ونسأل الله العصمة والتوفيق . . . أ.هـ (9) The permissibility of Sahu (forgetfulness) for the Prophet SAWS: From those who saw this are Muhammad bin al-Hassan bin al-Walid and from those who followed him in his opinion are Sheikh al-Tabrasi in Majma’a al-Bayan as reported from him by Sheikh al-Tinkanbi in Qasas al-’Ulemaa, also al-Sayyed al-Jazaeri in al-Anwar al-Nu’umaniyyah, also Fakhr al-Deen al-Tarihi in Majma’a al-Bayan and al-Muhaqqiq al-Faydh al-Kashani in al-Wafi from what is apparent. It is reported by al-Sheikh al-Bahaee (rah) that he said (About al-Saduq): “Praise be to Allah who cut his life and did not allow him to write what he intended.” and Sheikh Ahmad al-Ahissaee said (About al-Saduq): “In this matter al-Saduq is a liar.” both of them have displayed poor Adab by saying this and we did not expect this from people such as them…( introduction of Man la Yahduruhu al-Faqih vol.1 pg.70) From this example we find that a shia scholar called another esteemed Shia scholar “al sadooq” as a liar, So will the shias now consider sheikh Al sadooq as liar, just because another Shia scholar called him so? Accusation 10 Ibn Taimiyah’s views of Sayyida Fatima Zahra (as) Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 5 page 522: فإن أبا بكر إمام لا يتصرف لنفسه بل للمسلمين ، والمال لم يأخذه لنفسه بل للمسلمين ، وفاطمة تطلب لنفسها Verily Abu Bakr is an Imam who did not act for himself but for the Muslims and as for the money, he did not take it for himself but for the Muslims whilst Fatima was demanding it for herself. Again an argument, whih implies that if according to Shias Abu Bakr(ra) has to be cursed for not giving fadak then according to this logic Fatima(ra) should also be, because Abu Bakr(ra) was not giving Fadak so as to save it for poor, and Fatima(ra) was asking for herself. So why Abu Bakr is to be cursed and not Fatima, may Allah be please with both of them. That is called ‘Ilzami Jawab’ in urdu(something similar to counter attack). This isn’t an insult on any of these great personalities(Fatima and Abubakr), but its using the logic of opponents against them. This is the full statement of Ibn Taymiyyah… وليس تبرئة الإنسان لفاطمة من الظن والهوى بأولى من تبرئة أبي بكر فإن أبا بكر إمام لا يتصرف لنفسه بل للمسلمين والمال لم يأخذه لنفسه بل للمسلمين وفاطمة تطلب لنفسها Translation: It is more worthy to declare that Abu Bakr is free from suspicion and desires than to declare this for Fatima, because Abu Bakr is an Imam who acts for the Muslims and not for himself, he did not take the money for himself but gave it to the Muslims while Fatima asked for this money for herself. Accusation 11 Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 4 page 132: أو ليس الله قد ذم المنافقين الذين قال فيهم ومنهم من يلمزك في الصدقات فإن أعطوا منها ورضا وإن لم يعطوا منها إذا هم يسخطون ولو نهم رضوا ما اتاهم الله ورسوله وقالوا حسبنا الله سيوتينا الله من فضله ورسوله إنا إلى الله راغبون فذكر الله قوما رضوا إن اعطوا وغضبوا إن لم يعطوا فذمهم بذلك Hasn’t Allah (swt) condemned the hypocrites those who said about them {And of them is he who defameth thee in the matter of the alms. If they are given thereof they are content, and if they are not given thereof, behold! they are enraged. If only they had been content with what Allah and His Messenger gave them, and had said, “Sufficient unto us is Allah! Allah and His Messenger will soon give us of His bounty to Allah do we turn our hopes} Allah mentioned people that if they are given they will be pleased, but if they are not given they get angry, and Allah condemned them. Ibn taymiyyah was refuting the shia scholar who made the anger of Fatima [ra] as something praiseworthy. Ibn taymiiyah refutes the argument of shia scholar( al hilli) by saying that how could it be praiseworthy when Allah condemn this in Qu’ran. So this doesn’t mean that Ibn taymiyyah(rah) was calling Fatima [ra] a hypocrite.(Mazallah). How could it be when Ibn taymiyyah himself, after two three line, called Fatima(ra) “the leader of women of paradise”.? It’s just the sickness in the brains of Shias, which stops them from understanding the statements of taymiyyah. Accusation 12 Ibn Taimiyah then proceeds to widen his attacks further to encompass Imam Ali bin Muhammad al-Hadi (as) and Imam Hassan Askari (as) whom he referred to as ‘Askaris’: “Verily al-Zuhari is more knowledgeable about the Prophetic hadiths, statements and actions than Abu Jafar Muhammad bin Ali and the scholars agreed on that, and (al-Zuhari) was a contemporary of the Prophet (s). However regarding Musa bin Jafar, Ali bin Musa and Muhammad bin Ali, no one among those who possess knowledge doubt that Malik bin Anas, Hamaad bin Zaid, Hamaad bin Salama, al-Laith bin Saad, al-Awzaei, Yahya bin Saeed, W’akei bin al-Jarah, Abdullah bin al-Mubarak, al-Shafiyee, Ahmad bin Hanbal, Ishaq bin Rahwei and others were more knowledgeable about the Prophetetic hadith than them”Minhaj al Sunnah, Volume 2 page 460-462 How could these views of Imam Ibn Taymiyyah be considered as hatred for Ahlebayt? Ofcourse from the glasses of Rafidism this may appear so, but not according to the mainstream muslims because it isn’t impossible that Non-Ahlebayt could be more knowledgeable than some members from Ahlebayt. This isn’t a correct belief that no one could be more knowledgable than Ahlebayt, and infact there are solid proofs which shows us that this is just the myth of Shias. Secondly, even this view of Ibn taymiyyah could never be counted as signs of hatred for Ahlebayt, because Ibn Taymiyyah(ra), didn’t say that those Imams DIDN’T have any knowledge at all. He just said some other scholars were more knowledgeable than them. Likewise if one says that honey is sweeter than sugar, then does this mean that sugar is not sweet? Or if any shia says that classical shia scholar sheikh sadooq was more knowledgeable than supreme leader of Iran Khomeini then does it mean that Shia possesses a kind of hatred for Khomeini? What sort of foolishness is this by the Shias? Thirdly if indeed Ibn taymiyyah(rah) wanted to insult Ahlebayt or that he possessed hatred for them, then he would have said the same thing for ALL the Imams from Ahlebayt. Not just a few later ones. Let us cite before you that what Ibn taymiyyah said regarding some other Imams: Ali ibn Abi Taalib, al-Hasan and al-Husayn (may Allaah be pleased with them). They are noble Sahaabah and no one doubts their virtue and leadership, but many others shared with them the virtue of being companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and among the Sahaabah there are others who were more virtuous than them, based on saheeh (authentic) evidence from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). (Where as) Ali ibn al-Husayn(4th shia Imam), Muhammad ibn ‘Ali al-Baaqir(5th), Ja’far ibn Muhammad al-Saadiq(6th) and Moosa ibn Ja’far.(7th) They are among the trustworthy and reliable scholars. [Minhaaj al-Sunnah (2/243, 244)] Thus we leave the case to unbiased people with sense and wisdom, to judge how stupid and silly the Shia arguments are, inorder to attack the great scholar of Ahlesunnah. Love of Ibn taymiyyah for Ahlebayt: Lastly to clear before our readers that Ibn taymiyyah(rah) was a true lover of Ahlebayt and all the allegations against him were based on misinterpretations , misquotations and misunderstanding. We would like to present before our readers some of the views of Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) regarding Ahlebayt. 1. Sheikhul-islam Taqiad-deen Abul Abbas Ahmad ibn Abdulhaleem ibn Taymiya said: وأما من قتل ” الحسين ” أو أعان على قتله أو رضي بذلك فعليه لعنة الله والملائكة والناس أجمعين “As for killers of Hussein, or those who helped to kill him, or those who were glad with his murder, may curse of Allah, angels and all human be upon them”. He further said: من أبغضهم فعليه لعنة الله والملائكة والناس أجمعين “May curse of Allah, angels and all human be upon the one who would hate them (ahlel-bayt)”.[See “Majmua Fatawa” 1/392]. 2. Ibn Taymiyyah said: “The best men of this Ummah after its Prophet are: Abu Bakr; then Umar; third: Uthman; and fourth: Ali Ibn Abi Talib (may Allah be pleased with them all).” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah, Chapter 4) 3. Ibn Taymiyyah said: وأما علي رضي الله عنه فلا ريب أنه ممن يحب الله ويحبه الله “And Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, without any doubt is from people who loved Allah, and who were beloved by Allah”.[See: Minhaj us sunna 7 / 218] 4. Ibn taymiyyah said: وأما كون عليّ وغيره مولى كل مؤمن ، فهو وصف ثابت لعليّ في حياة النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم وبعد مماته، وبعد ممات عليّ، فعلي اليوم مولى كل مؤمن “And Ali and others were mawla of all believers. That’s a description established for Ali during the life of prophet (sallalahu alayhi wa ala alihi wa salam), and after his death, and after the death of Ali (himself). And Ali today is a mawla(friend) of all believers”.[See: Minhaj us sunna 7 / 325] 5. Ibn taymiyyah said: لا ريب أن موالاة علي واجبة على كل مؤمن، كما يجب على كل مؤمن موالاة أمثاله من المؤمنين “No doubt that mawlat (friendship) of Ali is obligatory for all believers, as it obligatory on all believers mawlat of believers like him”. [See: Minhaj us sunna 7 / 27] 6. Ibn taymiyyah said: لا ريب أن علياً رضي الله عنه كان من شجعان الصحابة، وممن نصر الله الإسلام بجهاده، ومن كبار السابقين الأوَّلين من المهاجرين والأنصار، ومن سادات من آمن بالله واليوم الآخر وجاهد في سبيل الله، وممن قاتل بسيفه عدداً من الكفار “No doubt that Ali is from the bravest companions, and from those by whose jihad Allah granted victory to islam, and from the greatest who “first to lead the way, of the Muhajirin and the Ansar”.[See: Minhaj us sunna 8 / 76] 7. Ibn Taymiyyah said: “The Ahlus Sunnah should love the Prophet’s family, give them support, and honor the Prophet’s will in regards to them, as he said at Ghadir Khumm: ‘I ask you by Allah to take care of my family; I ask you by Allah to take care of my family.’” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah, Chapter 4) 8. Ibn taymiyyah said: “They (Ahlus Sunnah) love the people of the household of the Messenger of Allah; they regard them with love and loyalty, and they heed the command of the Messenger of Allah concerning them…but they reject the way of the (Shia) Rafidhis who hate the Sahabah and slander them, and they reject the way of the Nasibis who insult Ahlel Bayt in words and deed.” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Majmoo al-Fatawa, 3/154) Thus the accusation that Ibn Taymiyyah was Nasibi is one of the most absurd myth, that is always propagated by Shiawebsite amongst ignorant Shias. As we can see, that Ibn Taymiyyah always encouraged in Loving Ahlebayt, and calling it the way of Ahlesunnah. And Ibn taymiyyah himself condemned the creed of Nasibis. Taken from http://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress....ma%E2%80%99ah/ |
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06-11-2012, 03:46 AM
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#28 |
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Sheikhul-islam Taqiad-deen Abul Abbas Ahmad ibn Abdulhaleem ibn Taymiyah
Explaining the Sunni creed, Shaykh al-Islam said:“They (Ahlus Sunnah) love the people of the household of the Messenger of Allah; they regard them with love and loyalty, and they heed the command of the Messenger of Allah concerning them…but they reject the way of the (Shia) Rafidhis who hate the Sahabah and slander them, and they reject the way of the Nasibis who insult Ahlel Bayt in words and deed.” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Majmoo al-Fatawa, 3/154) 6. In regards to the Prophetic Household, Ibn Taymiyyah said: “The Ahlus Sunnah should love the Prophet’s family, give them support, and honor the Prophet’s will in regards to them, as he said at Ghadir Khumm: ‘I ask you by Allah to take care of my family; I ask you by Allah to take care of my family.’” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah, Chapter 4) 7. Ibn Taymiyyah(rah) said: وأما من قتل ” الحسين ” أو أعان على قتله أو رضي بذلك فعليه لعنة الله والملائكة والناس أجمعين “As for killers of Hussein, or those who helped to kill him, or those who were glad with his murder, may curse of Allah, angels and all human be upon them”. And he also said: من أبغضهم فعليه لعنة الله والملائكة والناس أجمعين “May curse of Allah, angels and all human be upon the one who would hate them (ahlel-bayt)”.[See “Fatawa” 1/392]. And he said: وأما علي رضي الله عنه فلا ريب أنه ممن يحب الله ويحبه الله “And Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, without any doubt from people who loved Allah, and who were beloved by Allah”. [See: Minhaj us sunna 7 / 218] It show's Ibn Taymiya ra didnt slander the sahaba & ahlel bayt. So the shia's & barelwi's are spreading lies about Ibn Taymiya ra ????? |
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06-11-2012, 03:55 AM
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#29 |
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So the shia's & barelwi's are spreading lies about Ibn Taymiya ra ????? (95% of what is quoted against Ibn Tayymiyah is quoted OUT OF CONTEXT) |
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06-11-2012, 04:30 PM
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#30 |
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Salaam Aleikum
Even if this is true then who said the Shi'ah represent the Ahlul Bayt? Wow funny logic. ? We are mere lovers of the ahlul bayt who try to obey the prophet command of following the quran and ahlul bayt after him.... Its in sahih muslim aswell, so how can it not be true to your own standards? So as usual him and those who follow his opinion declare that they prove what Allah proves and deny what Allah denies. So when Allah says this does he mean physical hands? I think you just summarised the way of thinking of the salafie school of thought with regards to: -The literal reading of the quran - and the attributes of allah swt. This is the danger when a layperson interprets the quran without guidance from the ahlul bayt. Please do not mock! A famous hadith from one of our imams says for us not to mock sunni beliefs. THe reason for this the same reason we schouldnt mock other religions. Because if we mock them they in return may mock one of our religious leaders or even Allah Swt. If i have offended anyone directly please forgive me. Naturally some people may be upset with me just being a shia , but thats something that i cant controle. Or they may be upset with a discussion. In the end we both need to have respect for another and discuss a topic without silly lines such as your leader is this or your leader would be doing this. Its unislamic for an islamic forum. Explaining the Sunni creed, Shaykh al-Islam said:“They (Ahlus Sunnah) love the people of the household of the Messenger of Allah; they regard them with love and loyalty, and they heed the command of the Messenger of Allah concerning them…but they reject the way of the (Shia) Rafidhis who hate the Sahabah and slander them, and they reject the way of the Nasibis who insult Ahlel Bayt in words and deed.” (Ibn Taymiyyah, Majmoo al-Fatawa, 3/154) Than whats your opinion of the destruction of the shrine in jannatul baqi? Your answer here obviously will show the enmity some have towards ahlul bayt. No matter how you will try to justify it. I rather think education is far better then destroying islamic history. Also to have that view that shias slander and hate sahaba is outrageous and again only fueling lies and division in the islamic ummah, and this is coming from the top of the salafie school of thought. Actions speak louder than words. You only have to look at Jannatul Baqi, and the answer lies, who the real haters are. Salaam |
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06-11-2012, 04:41 PM
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#31 |
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Salaam Aleikum 32. Like Ahlesunnah even Imam Ali(ra), Imam Baqir(ra), Imam Jafar(ra)[1st , 5th , 6th shia Imams] believed that graves should be leveled and that no building should be made over them. A. Sahi muslim Bk 4, Number 2115: Abu’l−Hayyaj al−Asadi told that ‘Ali (b. Abu Talib) said to him: Should I not send you on the same mission as Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) sent me? Do not leave an image without obliterating it, or a high grave without leveling It. B. From Shia book, Wasa’il ash-Shi’a: [6614] 7 ـ وعنهم ، عن سهل ، عن جعفر بن محمد الأشعري ، عن ابن القداح ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : بعثني رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) في هدم القبور وكسر الصور. ورواه البرقي في ( المحاسن ) عن جعفر بن محمد الأشعري ، مثله. 7 – And from them from Sahl from Ja`far b. Muhammad al-Ash`ari from Ibn al-Qaddah (?) from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام. He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: The Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله sent me to tear down the graves and break the images. C. 6615] 8 ـ وعن علي بن إبراهيم ، عن أبيه ، عن النوفلي ، عن السكوني ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : بعثني رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) إلى المدينة فقال : لا تدع صورة إلا محوتها ، ولا قبراً إلا سويته ، ولا كلباً إلا قتلته. ورواه البرقي في ( المحاسن ) عن النوفلي ، مثله. 8 – And from `Ali b. Ibrahim from his father from an-Nawfali from as-Sakuni from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام. He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: The Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله sent me to Madina, and said: Do not leave an image but that you have effaced it, nor a grave but that you have leveled it, nor a dog but that you have killed it. D. And al-Barqi narrated it in Shia book, al-Mahasin from an-Nawfali likewise. [6616] 9 ـ محمد بن الحسن بإسناده عن الحسين بن سعيد ، عن النضر بن سويد ، عن القاسم بن سليمان ، عن جراح المدائني ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : لا تبنوا على القبور ولا تصوروا سقوف البيوت فإن رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) كره ذلك. أحمد بن محمد البرقي في ( المحاسن ) عن أبيه ، عن النضر بن سويد ، مثله. وعن يوسف بن عقيل ، عن محمد بن قيس ، عن أبي جعفر ( عليه السلام ) ، مثله. 9 – Muhammad b. al-Hasan by his isnad from al-Husayn b. Sa`id from an-Nadr b. Suwayd from al-Qasim b. Sulayman from Jarrah al-Mada’ini from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام. He said: Do not build upon the graves and do not make images on the roofs of the houses, for verily the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله disliked that. E. Ahmad b. Muhammad al-Barqi in al-Mahasin from his father from an-Nadr b. Suwayd likewise. F. And from Yusuf b. `Aqil from Muhammad b. Qays from Abu Ja`far عليه السلام likewise. G. [6617] 10 ـ وعن أبيه ، عن ابن سنان ، عن أبي الجارود ، عن الأصبغ بن نباتة ، عن أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) قال : من جدد قبراً أو مثل مثالاً فقد خرج من الإسلام. ورواه الشيخ والصدوق كما مر. 10 And from his father from Ibn Sinan from Abu ‘l-Jarud from al-Asbagh b. Nabata from Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام. He said: Whoever renovates a grave or fashions an image has gone out of Islam. H. قال النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم لا تتخذوا قبري قبلة ولا مسجداً؛ فإن الله عز وجل لعن اليهود حين اتخذوا قبور أنبيائهم مساجد “The prophet (sallalahu alayhi wa ala alihi wa salam) said: “Don’t take my grave like place of worship or “Qibla”, Allah cursed jews which build Mosques over graves of their prophets”. Source: Sheih Saduk “Man la yahduruhul fagih” vol 1, p 178, hadis# 532; Allama Majlisi “Biharul Anwar” vol 79, p 20; Allama Majlisi “Biharul anwar” vol 80, p 313. I. Sheikh Saduq narrated in Shia book “Man La Yahdaruhu ‘l-Faqih” (1/178) وسأله سماعة بن مهران ” عن زيارة القبور وبناء المساجد فيها، فقال: أما زيارة القبور فلا بأس بها، ولا ينبى عندها مساجد “. And Sama`a b. Mihran asked him about visiting the graves and constructing masajid (pl. of masjid) in them. So he said: As to visiting the graves then there is no harm with it, but one does not construct masajid on them. Hadith authenticated by Muhammad Baqir al-Bahbudi, he included it in “Sahih Man La Yahdaruhu ‘l-Faqih”. J. عَلِيُّ بْنُ الْحُسَيْنِ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ الْحُسَيْنِ بْنِ أَبِي الْخَطَّابِ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ أَسْبَاطٍ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ جَعْفَرٍ قَالَ سَأَلْتُ أَبَا الْحَسَنِ مُوسَى ع عَنِ الْبِنَاءِ عَلَى الْقَبْرِ وَ الْجُلُوسِ عَلَيْهِ هَلْ يَصْلُحُ قَالَ لَا يَصْلُحُ الْبِنَاءُ عَلَيْهِ وَ لَا الْجُلُوسُ وَ لَا تَجْصِيصُهُ وَ لَا تَطْيِينُهُ ‘Alee bin Ja’far asked 7th Shia Imaam about building upon graves and sitting (by them). He said: One cannot build upon it, and sit, and plaster, and “clay” it over Source: Al-Toosi, Tahdheeb Al-aHkaam, vol. 1, ch. 23, pg. 461, hadeeth # 148 Al-Toosi, Al-IstibSaar, vol. 1, ch. 128, pg. 217, hadeeth # 1 Al-Aamilee, Wasaa’il Al-Shee’ah, vol. 3, ch. 44, pg. 210, hadeeth # 3426 Al-Majlisi, Bihaar Al-Anwaar, vol. 3, ch. 12, pg. 79 ‘Alee ibn Ja’far (brother of 7th Imaam ), Masaa-il ‘Alee ibn Ja’far, pg. 212, hadeeth # 460 Grading: Al-Majlisi said this hadeeth is Muwaththaq KalSaHeeH (Reliable (taken as a) SaHeeH (hadeeth)) –> Milaadh Al-Akhyaar, vol. 3, pg. 298 The reason why it is considered Muwaththaq (Reliable) is mainly because of ‘Alee ibn AsbaaT, he is 100% thiqah, but people have differed on his madhhab. However, Al-Khoei said that ‘Alee ibn AsbaaT is a Shee’ah Imaamee and his madhhab is good. (See: Al-Khoei, Mu’jam Rijaal Al-Hadeeth, vol. 11, pg. 260, under person # 7923). So this hadeeth is actually graded as purely SaHeeH Comment: So not plastering graves, not building structures over them AND LEVELING graves if found in such conditions are from the teachings and the sunnah of Prophet(Saw), Ali(ra) and other Shia Imams. This is also the belief of Ahlesunnah and they strictly follow these teachings. But on the other hand shias go against the teachings of their Imams by plastering graves and building structures over them, but on the contrary they accuse the true followers of Ali(ra)[Ahlesunnah], when they follow these commands of Ali(ra), by leveling the high or plastered graves or when they dismantle the structures built over graves. Here are few examples to show how shias have violated these commands of their Imams. [Example 1:Tomb of khomeini over his grave] [Example 2: Plastered Grave of Shia Ayatulah sayyed hussain bourjedi] 33. Like Ahlesunnah even the Imam Abu Abdullah(ra) and Imam Baqir(ra)[6th and 5th Imam] believed that the height of grave could be raised by four fingers. وعن علي بن إبراهيم، عن أبيه، عن ابن أبي عمير، عن حماد بن عثمان، عن أبي عبد الله (عليه السلام) قال: إن أبي قال لي ذات يوم في مرضه: إذ أنا مت فغسلني وكفني، وارفع قبري أربع أصابع، ورشه بالماء، الحديث And from Ali b. Ibrahim, from his father, from ibn Abi Umayr, from Hammad b. Uthman, from Abi Abdullah(as) said: My father(as) said to me on a day of his illness: “When I die bathe me and shroud me, and raise my grave by four fingers, and sprinkle it with water.” [shia book, Wasail al shia] Comment : from this report we find that the teaching of Imam regarding height of grave from ground should be about four fingers. This is also the view of Ahlesunnah, but unfortunately when shias make a grave of their saints then the size given to that grave is multiple times more than the size prescribed by their Imam. [Example 1: Was the height of grave of Shia scholar khomeini, near this size adviced by Imams?] Taken from http://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress....ma%E2%80%99ah/ |
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06-11-2012, 04:55 PM
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#32 |
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Salaam. |
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06-11-2012, 05:05 PM
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#33 |
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Salaam Aleikum |
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06-11-2012, 05:15 PM
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#34 |
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I think you just summarised the way of thinking of the salafie school of thought with regards to: A. Narrated Kulayni in his “al-Kafi” 1/100-101: محمد بن أبي عبد الله عن محمد بن إسماعيل عن الحسين بن الحسن عن بكر بن صالح عن الحسن بن سعيد عن إبراهيم بن محمد الخزاز ومحمد بن الحسين قالا: دخلنا على أبي الحسن الرضا ع فحكينا له أن محمد صلى الله عليه وآله رأى ربه في صورة الشاب الموفق في سن أبناء ثلاثين سنة وقلنا: إن هشام بن سالم وصاحب الطاق و الميثمي يقولون: إنه أجوف إلى السرة والبقية صمد؟ فخر ساجدا لله ثم قال: سبحانك ما عرفوك ولا وحدوك فمن أجل ذلك وصفوك سبحانك لو عرفوك لوصفوك بما وصفت به نفسك سبحانك كيف طاوعتهم أنفسهم أن يشبهوك بغيرك اللهم لا أصفك إلا بما وصفت به نفسك ولا أشبهك بخلقك أنت أهل لكل خير فلا تجعلني من القوم الظالمين ثم التفت إلينا فقال: ما توهمتم من شيء فتوهموا الله غيره ثم قال: نحن آل محمد النمط الأوسط الذي لا يدركنا الغالي ولا يسبقنا التالي يا محمد إن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله حين نظر إلى عظمة ربه كان في هيئة الشاب الموفق وسن أبناء ثلاثين سنة يا محمد عظم ربي عز وجل أن يكون في صفة المخلوقين قال قلت: جعلت فداك من كانت رجلاه في خضرة؟ قال: ذاك محمد كان إذا نظر إلى ربه بقلبه جعله في نور مثل نور الحجب حتى يستبين له ما في الحجب إن نور الله منه أخضر ومنه أحمر ومنه أبيض ومنه غير ذلك يا محمد ما شهد له الكتاب والسنة فنحن القائلون به . Muhammad ibn abu ‘Abdallah has narrated from Muhammad ibn Isma‘il from al-Husayn ibn al-Hassan from Bakr ibn Salih from al-Hassan ibn Sa‘id from Ibrahim ibn Muhammad al-Khazzaz and Muhammad ibn al-Husayn they both have said the following, “We met Imam abu abu al-Hassan al-Rida (a.s.) and stated to him that Prophet Muhammad (s.a.) saw His Lord in the fashion of a full grown young man of thirty years and added that Hisham ibn Salim and Sahib al-Taq and al-Maythami say that He is hallow down to His navel and the rest is solid. The Imam bowed down to a prostrating position and then said, ‘(O Lord), Glory belongs to you they have not recognized You nor have they acknowledged Your Oneness thus, they attribute to You such things. (O Lord, Glory belongs to You, had they recognized You they would have attributed to You what you yourself have attributed to Yourself and they would not have considered You similar to things other than You. O Lord, I do not attribute to You anything other than what You have attributed to Yourself and do not consider You similar to Your creatures. To You belongs all good. Do not place me among the unjust ones.’ The Imam (a.s.) then turned to us saying, “Whatever you may imagine (make Wahm of) consider Allah some thing other than it.” He continued, ‘We, people of the family of the Prophet (s.a.), are the middle type and the criteria. Those who exceed can not catch up with us and those who follow can not go ahead of us. O Muhammad, when the messenger of Allah looked at the greatness of his Lord he was of the type of people as fully grown up as thirty years old people. O Muhammad, my Lord, the Majestic, the Glorious, is far greater than to be of the qualities of the creatures.” The narrator has said that I said, “May the Lord take my soul for your service, who was the one with his feet in the green?” The Imam said, “He was Prophet Muhammad (s.a.) when looked at his Lord with his heart He placed him in the light like that of the Hujub so he can see what is inside the Hujub. Of the light of Allah some are green, red, white and others. O Muhammad whatever has confirmation in the book and the Sunnah “we affirm it”.”[ This hadith is graded muwaththaq(reliable) by al-Majlisi in his book Mirat ul uqool: (1st hadith) (الحديث الأول) (2): موثق. Same report was transmitted by Saduq in Tawhid p 113 via his own chain: 13 - حدثنا علي بن أحمد بن محمد بن عمران الدقاق رضي الله عنه، قال: حدثنا محمد بن أبي عبد الله الكوفي، عن محمد بن إسماعيل البرمكي، عن الحسين ابن الحسن، عن بكر بن صالح، عن الحسين بن سعيد (2) عن إبراهيم بن محمد الخزاز، ومحمد بن الحسين، قالا: دخلنا على أبي الحسن الرضا عليه السلام فحكينا له ما روي أن محمدا صلى الله عليه وآله رأى ربه في هيئة الشاب الموفق في سن ابناء ثلاثين سنة رجلاه في خضرة Comment: Like Ahlesunnah even Shia Imam preached the same beliefs of affirming the attributes of Allah which Allah himself have affirmed for him in his book and sunnah. Without consider that those attributes are similar to the creation, this is the creed of people on middle course i.e Ahlesunnah wal Jama’ah, unlike that of Shias. B. Ibn Babaweyh al-Qummi narrated in his book “At-Tawhid” (p 100-101): حدثنا محمد بن الحسن بن أحمد بن الوليد قال: حدثنا محمد بن يحيى العطار قال: حدثنا محمد بن أحمد قال: حدثنا محمد بن عيسى عن هشام بن إبراهيم قال: قال العباسي قلت له يعني أبا الحسن ع: جعلت فداك أمرني بعض مواليك أن أسألك عن مسألة قال: ومن هو؟ قلت: الحسن بن سهل قال: في أي شئ المسألة؟ قال: قلت في التوحيد قال: وأي شئ من التوحيد؟ قال: يسألك عن الله جسم أو لا جسم ؟ قال : فقال لي: إن للناس في التوحيد ثلاثة مذاهب مذهب إثبات بتشبيه و مذهب النفي ومذهب إثبات بلا تشبيه. فمذهب الاثبات بتشبيه لا يجوز ومذهب النفي لا يجوز والطريق في المذهب الثالث إثبات بلا تشبيه (Chain) Abbasi said: “I said to him – it’s mean to Abul Hasan (alaihi salam) : “May I be your ransom, some of your mawaliya ordered me to ask your about issue”. He asked: “And who is that?”. I said: “al-Hasan ibn Sahl”. He said: “And what is issue about?”. I said: “About Tawhid”. He asked: “And what about tawhid?” I said: “Question you about Allah, is He jism or not jism?”. And he (imam) said to me: “People in question of tawhid divided in 3 mazahib. (1) Mazhab isbat bi tashbih (accept and likening), (2) mazhab nafyi (rejection) and (3) mazhab isbat bila tashbih (accept without likening) . And mazhab isbat bi tashbih isn’t permitted, and mazhab an-nafyi isn’t permitted, the (correct) way in the 3-d mazhab isbat bila tashbih(accept without likening)”. See also “Biharul anwar” 3/304. Comment: There is no doubt that it’s disbelief to accept sifaat(attributes) of Allah, and say that they are similar to the sifaat of His creation. That’s first mazhab in this hadith. Also it’s prohibited to reject any sifaat of Allah, that came to us in Quran or saheeh sunnah. This is second mazhab in this hadith which rejects the attributes, we can see modern shias upon this way. They reject such sifaat of Allah, like hand, face, eyes and etc. But all these sifaats are present in Holy Quran.[Shakir 38:75] He said: O Iblis! what prevented you that you should do obeisance to him whom I created with My two hands? Are you proud or are you of the exalted ones? [Shakir 54:13] And We bore him on that which was made of planks and nails [Shakir 54:14] Sailing, before Our eyes, a reward for him who was denied. And third and acceptable mazhab in this hadith, that was described like “way” by imam, is mazhab that ahlesunnah wal jamaat is upon. We accept all sifaat from Quran and sahih sunnah, and we doesn’t liken them to any sifaat of creation. 9. Like Ahlesunnah even Imams of Shias affirmed the Sifaat(attributes) of Allah, as reported in SHIA HADEETH. A. Kafi by Kulayni. vol 1, p 209: 5 – عدة من أصحابنا، عن أحمد بن محمد بن عيسى، عن الحسين بن سعيد، عن فضالة بن أيوب: عن أبي المغرا، عن محمد بن سالم، عن أبان بن تغلب قال: سمعت أبا عبدالله (عليه السلام) يقول: قال رسول الله (صلى الله عليه وآله): من أراد أن يحيى حياتي، ويموت ميتتي ويدخل جنة عدن التي غرسها الله ربي بيده، فليتول علي بن أبي طالب وليتول وليه، وليعاد عدوه، وليسلم للاوصياء من بعده، فإنهم عترتي من لحمي ودمي، أعطاهم الله فهمي وعلمي، إلى الله أشكو [أمر] امتي، المنكرين لفضلهم، القاطعين فيهم صلتي، وأيم الله ليقتلن ابني لا أنالهم الله شفاعتي. A number of our people have narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad ibn ‘Isa from al-Husayn ibn Said from Fudala ibn Ayyub from abu a1-Maghra from Muhammad ibn Salim from Aban ibn Taghlib from abu Abdallah (a.s.) who has said the following: “The Messenger of Allah has said, Whoever would want to live like my living, die like I will die and enter the garden of Eden that my Lord has planted with His own hands, he must love (acknowledge the Divine authority of) Ali (a.s.) ibn abu Talib. He must love (acknowledge the Divine authority of his successor) those who love him, be the enemy of his enemies and submit in obedience to his successors after him because they are of my family and my flesh and blood. Allah has given them my understanding and knowledge. I appeal to Allah and complain to Him about the case of my peoples dealings, their denying the virtue and excellence of the Imams from my family. I complain to Allah for their disregard of my relation with them. By Allah, they will murder my son (al-Husayn (a.s.). May Allah deprive them of my intercession. B. Al-Qummi in “Qurub al-Isnaad” p 61: 193 – وعنه عن صفوان الجمال عن أبي عبد الله ع قال : ” قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله : عن يمين الله – وكلتا يديه يمين – عن يمين العرش قوم على وجوههم نور لباسهم من نور على كراسي من نور فقال له علي : يا رسول الله من هؤلاء ؟ فقال له : شيعتنا وأنت إمامهم “ From Abu Abdullah (alaihi salam): “Messenger of Allah (sallalahu alaihi wa alihi) said: “From the right of Allah – AND HIS BOTH HANDS ARE RIGHT – at the right side of Arsh in the doomsday would be group, their faces would be shine, their clothes would be (from) light, (they would be) upon the chairs from light”. And Ali said to him: Who are they O messenger of Allah? He said: Your shias and you are their imam”. C. Narrated by Kulayni in “Kafi” 1/126: 4 – علي بن محمد، عن سهل بن زياد، عن محمد بن عيسى قال: كتبت إلى أبي الحسن علي بن محمد (عليهما السلام): جعلني الله فداك يا سيدي قد روي لنا: أن الله في موضع دون موضع على العرش استوى، وأنه ينزل كل ليلة في النصف الاخير من الليل إلى السماء الدنيا، وروي: أنه ينزل عشية عرفة ثم يرجع إلى موضعه، فقال بعض مواليك في ذلك: إذا كان في موضع دون موضع، فقد يلاقيه الهواء ويتكنف عليه والهواء جسم رقيق يتكنف على كل شئ بقدره، فكيف يتكنف عليه جل ثناؤه على هذا المثال؟ فوقع (عليه السلام): علم ذلك عنده (2) وهو المقدر له بما هو أحسن تقديرا واعلم أنه إذا كان في السماء الدنيا فهو كما هو على العرش، والاشياء كلها له سواء علما وقدرة وملكا وإحاطة. وعنه، عن محمد بن جعفر الكوفي، عن محمد بن عيسى مثله. Ali ibn Muhammad has narrated from Sahl ibn Ziyad from Muhammad ibn Isa who has said the following. “I wrote to Imam abu al-Hassan, Ali ibn Muhammad (a.s.) to clarify a question. May Allah take my soul in your service, O my master, it is narrated to us that Allah is in one place and not in another place on Arsh, (the Throne) resting. He comes down to the sky above the earth every night during the last half of the night. It is narrated that He comes down at the ninth evening of the month of Dhul Hajj and then He returns back to His place. Certain individuals among your friends have said that if He would be found in certain places and not in other places the air must have come in contact with Him and would surround Him because air is a thin form of body that surrounds everything proportionate to its size. How then the air would surround Allah, the Most Holy and the Most High, According to this assumption? The Imam replied in writing, “He has the knowledge of this. He is the best One in having the true measurements of all things. You must, However, note that His being in the sky over the earth is just as He on the Throne. All things to Him are the same in the matters of His knowledge and power, domination and control.” Muhammad ibn Jafar al-Kufi has narrated from Muhammad ibn Isa a similar Hadith Majlese said weak about first chain, and said sahih ala thahir about second way of transmission. D. Kulayni in “Kafi” 1/126-127, and authenticated by Majlese in “Mirat” 1/67. 5 – عنه، عدة من أصحابنا، عن أحمد بن محمد بن خالد، عن يعقوب بن يزيد عن ابن أبي عمير، عن ابن اذينة، عن أبي عبدالله (عليه السلام) في قوله تعالى: ” ما يكون من نجوى ثلاثة إلا هو رابعهم ولا خمسة إلا هو سادسهم ” فقال، هو واحد واحدي الذات، بائن من خلقه، وبذاك وصف نفسه، ” وهو بكل شئ محيط ” بالاشراف والاحاطة والقدرة ” لا يعزب عنه مثقال ذرة في السماوات ولا في الارض ولا أصغر من ذلك ولا أكبر ” بالاحاطة والعلم لا بالذات لان الاماكن محدودة تحويها حدود أربعة فإذا كان بالذات لزمها الحواية. It is narrated from him (the narrator of the above Haddith) from a group of our people from Ahmad ibn Muhammad ibn Khalid from Yaqub ibn yazid from ibn abu Umayr from ibn Udhaynah from Imam abu Abdallah (a.s.) who has said the following: It is about the words of Allah “There is not a single place wherein any secret counsel can take place between any three people without God being the fourth, nor five people without His being the sixth. . .” (58:7). “He is One, the One only in His Own-self. He is different from His creatures and as such He has said about His Own-Self. He has control over all things through His presence, control and power. Nothing as small as an atom in the heavens or earth is absent from Him, not even things smaller or bigger. It is all through His control and knowledge not by His-self. It is because the places are limited by the four boundaries. If it would be by His-self it would limit Him. Comment: We have seen many people who use those verses to proof that Allah is bizatehe(with his ownself) everywhere (authubillah). Alhamdulillah imam explained it exactly as Ahlesunnah understand that verse that Allah is everywhere by His control and knowledge and not by His-self. 10. Like Ahlesunnah even Imams of Shias believed in Uluw of Allah A. Shia shaykh Abu Jafar al-Barqi (d 274), in his book “al-Mahasin” (1/231-231) narrated from Abu Basir, which reported from one of Imams: لا تكذبوا الحديث إذا أتاكم به مرجئ ولا قدري ولا حروري ينسبه إلينا ، فإنكم لا تدرون لعله شئ من الحق فيكذب الله فوق عرشه Don’t reject hadith which ascribed to us, if it come to you from muriji, or qadari, or haruri. Because you don’t know, perhaps things from the truth (in those reports)AND (BY REJECTING IT) YOU WOULD LIE UPON ALLAH (WHO IS) BEYOND THE ARSH. B. و روى الصدوق في العلل بإسناده الصحيح عن أبي بصير عن أحدهما عليهما السلام قال: لا تكذبوا بحديث أتاكم به مرجىء و لا قدري و لا خارجي نسبه إلينا، فإنكم لا تدرون لعله شيء من الحق فتكذبوا الله عز و جل فوق عرشه And narrated al Sadooq(ra) in al Illal (Illul ul sharai) with sahih (authentic) sanad (chain of narration) from Abi Baseer from one of the 2 Imams(as) said: Don’t reject hadith which has come to you people through murj’i, qadari and kharji attributed to us, for verily you people don’t know for it is something from the truth AND (BY REJECTING IT) YOU WOULD LIE UPON ALLAH (WHO IS) BEYOND THE ARSH. Comment: So like Ahlesunnah even shia Imams believed in Uluw of Allah, unlike the shias who reject it. http://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress....ma%E2%80%99ah/ |
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06-11-2012, 05:25 PM
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#35 |
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Salam `Aleykum,
I like how the deviants like to go off-topic, turned the thread from "Books on Ahlul-Bayt" into "Nature of God" and "Destruction of tombs". |
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