[bobibnoxx]

Does anyone know of any living ascetics? I remember in a lecture Shaykh Hamza Yusuf saying he knows someone who subsists on nothing but milk. Also, please include where/how I could contact them.

[peemovvie]

hmmmm apologies if im speaking out of term but how is living of Milk supposed to bring you closer to Allah, what benefit comes from it? is this a practice from the sunnah?

[bobibnoxx]

hmmmm apologies if im speaking out of term but how is living of Milk supposed to bring you closer to Allah, what benefit comes from it? is this a practice from the sunnah?

It is extreme sister Aram but so was Rabi’ah Al ‘adawiyyah’s lifestyle. And who knows..maybe the Prophet would have subsisted on just one type of food but feared Allah SWT would make it wajib on us so, for our sake, decided not to? It's possible..

Wallahu a’lam but I think depriving ourselves of the lawful is a great means of drawing near to Allah SWT which is why fasting is one of the superior forms of ibadah. Thanks.

[peemovvie]

hmmm but isnt it the same as those who would deprive themselves from marriage, like they went to xtrems and rasoolAllah dissapproved of it?

[TessUnsonia]

By living on just milk, how would one compensate vitamins/minerals you get from other sources?

[excholza]

أعوذ بالله من الشيطان الرجيم
بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم


A`ūdhu billāhi min ash-shaitāni r-rajīm
b-ismi-llāhi r-raḥmāni r-raḥīm



Sister Aram, I was thinking the same thing.

Sister HH, please seek a shaykh.

We're advised against optional fasting during certain days, like Friday. We are told not to do anything that harms our bodies (intentionally). If we are to follow the sunnah of the Prophet , then eating modestly, sharing your food, eating 2 meals and not over-eating would seem to be the most desirable in seeking the pleasure of Allah (SWT). Even before he was given prophethood, our beloved Muhammad would take food with him whenever he went to the cave. What about eating dates? What about the practice of putting a little bit of chewed date (chewed by a pious person) on the lips of a newborn baby? What about the keeping of animals like camels, goats and sheep? What about the sacrifice of an animal during Eid al-Adha, consuming 1/3 and sharing the rest?

Sister HH, I don't know much about these things but alarm bells are ringing in my head... sorry... please sister, please seek a shaykh in case such practices lead to an imbalance. Follow our beloved Muhammad without assuming what he would have done.

May Allah (SWT) forgive me if I have erred here.

[GoblinGaga]

Does anyone know of any living ascetics? I remember in a lecture Shaykh Hamza Yusuf saying he knows someone who subsists on nothing but milk. Also, please include where/how I could contact them.

Did he say he considers that person to be an ascetic? If he did then we should ask the shaykh to give his definition of what asceticism is and match it to sunnah to see if this is correct or not. If this is his definition of asceticism then I have to disagree totally with it and say that this definition of asceticism has added to the bad image people have about tasawwuf.

[GoblinGaga]

hmmmm apologies if im speaking out of term but how is living of Milk supposed to bring you closer to Allah, what benefit comes from it? is this a practice from the sunnah?

Its reference to durveshi.

[Eujacwta]

Are you sure he meant just milk, rather than mostly on milk? We have to remember that our bodies have rights - if we treat them badly they can complain to Allah on Yaum al Qiyamah.


There are still many Muslim ascetics around, but they will be the last people to reveal themselves and you may be surprised by some of the people who live very very simply although they could live in modern comfort.


I like the saying attributed to Imam Ali (raa) where he says something to the effect of - true zuhd is not that you don't own things - its that things don't own you.


The poet Saadi often talked about asceticism. I like this quote....


O brother,

the world remains with no one.


Bind the heart to the Creator,

it is enough.


Rely not upon possessions

and this world


Because it has cherished

many like thee


and then slain them


When the soul is about to depart

What cares it if one dies

on a throne or on the ground?


(Saadi)

(source http://abodeofmercy.wordpress.com/ca...terial-wealth/)


For anyone interested in the early Muslim zahids Attar's Memorial of the Awlia is a fascinating read for those who have not already read it and there is an abridged translation on scribd. http://www.scribd.com/doc/7811782/muslim-saints-mystics

[niemamczasu]

People like that we could probably count them with our fingers if we knew who there were. The way the current world and societies are its truly rare to find someone who has high elevation in deen.

[GoblinGaga]

Huzoor salallahu alayhi wa sallam had many wives - is anyone going to dare say he is not ascetic? He would be with his wives but as soon as the azan was sounded Hazrat Aisha (ra) says, "Marra ka alam ya'rifuna", - he went as if he did not know us. This was the perfect level of zuhd, asceticism, that he had.

The issue here is the heart. As long as the heart is not bound to the worldly things you're good. This is why shaikh e kaamil is necessary.

[jhfkgkfdvjk]

Does anyone know of any living ascetics? I remember in a lecture Shaykh Hamza Yusuf saying he knows someone who subsists on nothing but milk. Also, please include where/how I could contact them.

the criterian is adherence to sunnah
not extra ordinary feats or achievements

I believe you want to contact a shaykh of tasawwuf..?

[Draftcasino.com]

Does anyone know of any living ascetics? I remember in a lecture Shaykh Hamza Yusuf saying he knows someone who subsists on nothing but milk. Also, please include where/how I could contact them.

If you're talking about Murabit al Hajj, he didn't live off of milk alone. (Sorry, if this is not who you are talking about, but when I read your post he immediately is who came to mind.)
After the sun rose and reached the level of a spear above the horizon, he would pray the sunrise rak’ahs and then return to his tent where he would have some milk brought fresh from a cow. He would always pray four rakahs before and after the midday prayer and then return to his tent where he would teach until afternoon. He would usually have a small amount of rice and yogurt drink that is common in West Africa. http://sheikhhamza.com/biography/#_Toc309220673
edit: more info here: http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...-in-Mauritania

[Ccddfergt]

Living of milk is not a problem if it does not harm his body. The friends of Allah are not like you and me laymen that you compare them with a laymens living standards, spiritual or bodily needs. Allah would provide them them provisions that you don't necessarily see. The prophet did live of dates at many times therefore even the sunnah of it is established by this.

[peemovvie]

Living of milk is not a problem if it does not harm his body. The friends of Allah are not like you and me laymen that you compare them with a laymens living standards, spiritual or bodily needs. Allah would provide them them provisions that you don't necessarily see. The prophet did live of dates at many times therefore even the sunnah of it is established by this.

was that due to their not being other food available to Him rather than a form of abstinence ?

[mxzjxluwst]

was that due to their not being other food available to Him rather than a form of abstinence ?

The scholars mention that the poverty that the Messenger of Allah salla Llahu 'alayhi wa alihi wa sallam endured was totally as a result of his choice; had he wanted, he could have enjoyed all the riches he liked. This is typically mentioned in attempts to reconcile the Messenger's abstinence and and his duas against poverty (faqr).

Guys, yes, a balance would probably be most suitable to the vast majority of us. Don't make sweeping judgements, though. The Messenger would go days without food - had he wanted, he could have spent his share on booty, at the very least, on food. Alhamduli Llah, he chose not to.

If you guys have a chance to read Minhaj al-'Abidin, you'd see how the author (who most consider to be al-Ghazali) stresses on leaving seeking provision, and on tawakkul (trust in Allah). At first, I - like many of you - found this concept troubling; this, in part, is due to the very materialistic environment we've been brought up in. The reality is that Allah has promised to sustain us, and for people with firm faith and trust, their sustenance may not even be physical. Just because you are not at this stage does not mean you have to downplay it (as I once did, even if subconciously). We know that during the fight with Dajjal, at certain points the sustenance (qoot) of the belivers will be dhikr!

As for the people who went to extremes, and were subsequently censured by the Beloved salawatu Llah wa salamuh 'alayh, it is less straight forward than some may be led to thinking. According to some of these ahadith, we are prohibitted from fasting the siyam ad-dahr (constant fasting appart from the prohibitted days). Hence, the Hanafis declared it Makruh. On the other hand, an-Nawawi ash-Shaf'i declares it mustahabb for certain groups of people. In fact, the companion, Ibn 'Umar declared that he would consider those who did so from the best of the best! (saabiqin). Clearly, it's more subtle. It depends on the state of the person. The three men who came to the Beloved (one who decided to never marry, the other who decided to fast constantly etc) were doing so in a state of challenging the Beloved. The Beloved thus stated: "Whoever turns away from my sunnah, is not from me". This was the purpose of that hadith - that our will should be submitted to the Messenger's will at all times, for he is our door to Allah. Salla Llahu 'alayhi wa alihi wa sallam. Which people are most qualified to determine a person's state when doing such actions? Which group are most qualified to determine one's desire to follow the Sunnah? Clearly it's the awliya'. If we disagree with them regarding these 'extreme' feats of worship, the least we can do is keep our mouths shut.

[bobibnoxx]

Huzoor salallahu alayhi wa sallam had many wives - is anyone going to dare say he is not ascetic? He would be with his wives but as soon as the azan was sounded Hazrat Aisha (ra) says, "Marra ka alam ya'rifuna", - he went as if he did not know us. This was the perfect level of zuhd, asceticism, that he had.

The issue here is the heart. As long as the heart is not bound to the worldly things you're good. This is why shaikh e kaamil is necessary.

Thanks a lot Shaykh Fusus.

But I'd like to ask you something:
How do we reconcile that with the actions of Saints ,like Malek ibn Dinar (ra), who deliberately chose celibacy over marriage though it was against the sunnah of the Prophet SAW? Can we say they were sinful in doing so?

[bobibnoxx]

hmmm but isnt it the same as those who would deprive themselves from marriage, like they went to xtrems and rasoolAllah dissapproved of it?

That’s true but then what about the awliyaa like the ones cited in the book posted by brother Abdul who led lives more austere than the Prophet SAW or his companions (RA)? If what they were doing was wrong, then surely they wouldn’t have reached such great spiritual heights and stations. Wallahu a'lam.

[bobibnoxx]

By living on just milk, how would one compensate vitamins/minerals you get from other sources?

I think sister hayya others have answered the valid point you’ve raised but I’d also like to add that Allah SWT does not need means to achieve His SWT ends; He SWT can nourish us from thin air if He SWT so wills. Wallahu a'alam.

[bobibnoxx]

أعوذ بالله من الشيطان الرجيم
بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم


A`ūdhu billāhi min ash-shaitāni r-rajīm
b-ismi-llāhi r-raḥmāni r-raḥīm



Sister Aram, I was thinking the same thing.

Sister HH, please seek a shaykh.

We're advised against optional fasting during certain days, like Friday. We are told not to do anything that harms our bodies (intentionally). If we are to follow the sunnah of the Prophet , then eating modestly, sharing your food, eating 2 meals and not over-eating would seem to be the most desirable in seeking the pleasure of Allah (SWT). Even before he was given prophethood, our beloved Muhammad would take food with him whenever he went to the cave. What about eating dates? What about the practice of putting a little bit of chewed date (chewed by a pious person) on the lips of a newborn baby? What about the keeping of animals like camels, goats and sheep? What about the sacrifice of an animal during Eid al-Adha, consuming 1/3 and sharing the rest?

Sister HH, I don't know much about these things but alarm bells are ringing in my head... sorry... please sister, please seek a shaykh in case such practices lead to an imbalance. Follow our beloved Muhammad without assuming what he would have done.

May Allah (SWT) forgive me if I have erred here.

Thank you sister Acacia . And I agree that balance is important. One of the Salaf (I believe it was) said something to the effect of balance being concern for dunya and aakhira in proportion to the time spent in each of them relatively. So, in other words, the 'balance' is struck when the 'scale' is tipped infinitely in favor of the aakhira. Considering things from this perspective, it’s clear and makes sense why some Muslims would chose to live a life completely divorced from the dunya. Wallahu a’lam.