[illiniastibly]

As salaam alaykum wa rahmatullahi wa baraktuhu

My ques is qw used to have zikr jehri at end of every month in our mosque after Isha.

Recently one TJ brother also joined us , but due to some reasons he didnt go in jamat coz of zikr jehri and TJ brothers thought we r stopping the guy from going in jamaat . so they asked us to stop all this Zikr Jehri stuff etc...

so our imam of the mosque got a fatwa from Sharanpur that Zikr Jehri is permissible provided it does not disturb anyone's salah or neighbours etc ( which we take care of )

my question is i like Tj brothers and i have many friends of TJ ..
why do we have sometimes such clashes??? can we not love each other and work together ???
whats up with TJ bro ?

i also go in Jamat with them , is there a problem if for few hours for one day one of TJ guys come in our zikr majlis ?

mil julkar muhabbat se bhi toh kaam kiya jaa sakta hai ?

salaam

[InvertPrete]

but due to some reasons he didnt go in jamat coz of zikr jehri

what are the reasons and why he will not got with jamat because he doing zikr jehri?

you both people sit with him and ask for his reasons and problems.

is there a problem if for few hours for one day one of TJ guys come in our zikr majlis ?

Its not about problem, its about wish or needs. IF they wish or feel the need, they will seat.

TJ brothers thought we r stopping the guy from going in jamaat .

Its not first time where i hearing the active TJ workers dont spend/ or spend time at all like they used to do after being active khanqah. People do keep talking at behind. But i think people should approach him directly and get things sorted out.

[Ceakicknunk]

...brother i am not doubting your intentions, but if you look around the forum, it is full of such threads where TJ is pitched against something else like sufism or seeking knowledge, etc,etc....this thread might turn into another war zone...the situation that you have presented, there is little wrong that the TJ guy did there...let me explain....TJ, tassuwuff, Taleem,Jihad, Charities, etc,etc are all part of deen...If a person chooses one line he has GOT to believe (without belittling others) that his line is the best otherwise he wont have the motivation for doing what he is doing and he will lack consistency (yaksooi is the word in URDU)....As all the workers are human beings so sometimes they overreact to a situation and that gives people a chance to say that they are extreme....In the situation that you have explained the other TJ worker was concerned that one of his saathis may get relaxed in jammat work so he took the step...It would have been wrong if he had stopped him form dhikr in a group for no reason at all.....What would the sufis do if one of the regular members of their majlis starting missing it because of TJ work...the lack of "piyaar muhabbat" in these situations is a human error and should be ignored in the greater good of the Ummah....Allah knows best....and I apologize if i offended you in any way.....

[AngelinaTheElf]

What's the reasons?

There's loads of tasawwuf TJers around, including those who do jehri zikr.

[illiniastibly]

walaykum as salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

well the thing is on 28feb we were going to have zikr majlis and due to all this..

it got suspended for the time being and im bit sad..

the reason was simple : Tj guys asked the guy to come in jamat but he said since zikr majlis is only once at end of every month so i wont be able to come , may be this frustrated them and they asked to stop all zikr majlis stuff ..

may be our Tj bro thought this zikr majlis is c oming in their way of dawah.
Allah knows best

but Allah swt knows my intentions are not to create this thread into war zone..

and i pray to Allah swt that my heart is filled with love towards my Tj bro's.

we all have our short comings and may Allah swt forgive us all and unite our hearts.

Lets see when we are going to have zikr majlis again since the imam got fatwa from Saharanpur.

salaam

[HondasMenFox]

What's the reasons?

There's loads of tasawwuf TJers around, including those who do jehri zikr.

I am one of them,

If the saathis stopped the Dhikr majlis for this reason, then it was wrong without doubt.

[InvertPrete]

walaykum as salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

well the thing is on 28feb we were going to have zikr majlis and due to all this..

it got suspended for the time being and im bit sad..

the reason was simple : Tj guys asked the guy to come in jamat but he said since zikr majlis is only once at end of every month so i wont be able to come , may be this frustrated them and they asked to stop all zikr majlis stuff ..

may be our Tj bro thought this zikr majlis is c oming in their way of dawah.
Allah knows best

Talk with them with ulama and elders.

[AngelinaTheElf]

I am one of them,

If the saathis stopped the Dhikr majlis for this reason, then it was wrong without doubt.

May Allah Ta'aala keep respected brother qaaim in both. Since I was small I am used to seeing my father go in khurooj as well as do his jahri zikr.

[HondasMenFox]

May Allah Ta'aala keep respected brother qaaim in both. Since I was small I am used to seeing my father go in khurooj as well as do his jahri zikr.

[Gakeincidoniac]

I guess if the brother himself told the Tablighis with some wisdom and would've just postponed his Khuruj, then this clash could've been avoided easily. Many times these disputes occur because we deal with eachother without any sign of wisdom or forebearance. Or because both (or at least one of the) parties is not sincere and just insists on being correct. Wallahu 'Alam.

[BartRonalds]

Come on lad! man up
Nothing to do with TJ's, just a test from Allah in all angles to see how much people want it.....
*sigh*, were is the commitment, struggle, sacrifice, etc for something worthwhile. Why just complaints wrapped in a thread that yearns 'give me sympathy'.
The brothers in my town were given threats of murder.....
Not to dishearten but read the stories of prophets and if you think Allah will not test you through the ones you love or least expect then read the stories of the battles between the Sahabah and remember the words of Hadrath Ali [May Allah be pleased with him] when he mentioned that Allah was testing whether his loyalty was to Aisha [may Allah be Please with her] or to the truth.

[wpFWNoIt]

walaykum as salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

well the thing is on 28feb we were going to have zikr majlis and due to all this..

it got suspended for the time being and im bit sad..

the reason was simple : Tj guys asked the guy to come in jamat but he said since zikr majlis is only once at end of every month so i wont be able to come , may be this frustrated them and they asked to stop all zikr majlis stuff ..

may be our Tj bro thought this zikr majlis is c oming in their way of dawah.
Allah knows best

but Allah swt knows my intentions are not to create this thread into war zone..

and i pray to Allah swt that my heart is filled with love towards my Tj bro's.

we all have our short comings and may Allah swt forgive us all and unite our hearts.

Lets see when we are going to have zikr majlis again since the imam got fatwa from Saharanpur.

Where do u live ? India ? Which province ? is the fatwa about validity of zikr majlis ?
or , the priority of zikr majlis over Dawah work and vice versa ?

[rozneesitcn]

Assalamu alaykum

the priority of zikr majlis over Dawah work and vice versa ? The practical experience is that many brothers are lost; in the sense they are no where in deen when they are distracted. This I am referring to brothers who have been called from places of fitnah. I have experienced in our masjid, they say "for islah of your nafs we will give a wird". Then why a person has to go for 3 ,40 and 120 days? This hurts, really hurts. Finally the person will be no where.

[Nubtoubrem]

Assalamu alaykum



The practical experience is that many brothers are lost; in the sense they are no where in deen when they are distracted. This I am referring to brothers who have been called from places of fitnah. I have experienced in our masjid, they say "for islah of your nafs we will give a wird". Then why a person has to go for 3 ,40 and 120 days? This hurts, really hurts. Finally the person will be no where.

Islah can be done in several ways --

1. In the framework of Tabligi Jamat ,spending time with pious people , doing Khidmat and doing three tasweeh zikr or other types of zikr regularly

2. spending time in a khanqah under the spiritual radiance of a genuine sufi master, attending zikr majlis. Invoking the prescribed wird in own home individually.

3. Reading books of the saintly people including Sahabah , sufi shaykhs .

The purifying effect of each method is not same. The best and deepest purifying effect happens in
the second method.

For some people , all three methods are accessible . For some , only one method is accessible.

If you have access to all three methods , then you should keep a balance between all three methods
and choose the path which is optimized according to your temperament and economic situation.

If you do like this , then you will not be lost.

If you do like this , then you will not be lost. The following advice from the famous Mufti Ibrahim Desai (DB) from South Africa is higly relevant in this case.

---------------------------------------------------

http://www.islam.tc/cgi-bin/askimam/...=8243&act=view

If someone is involved in tasawwuf, is it ok if he does not do the effort of dawah and tabligh?

Answer

All these efforts are needed and have to be done simultaneously in order to create a better individual and a more religious society. One who is concentrating on Tasawwuf should not neglect the effort of Da?awah and Tabligh but should try and create a balance in his life.

For example, Weekly, if a person attends the mas-ala of a certain Buzurg on a Thursday, then he should participate in the Ghusht and Jawla programmes on Monday and Wednesday. In other words, we need to make some type of adjustments to our daily lives and routines in order to facilitate all these efforts of Deen which are Haqq. We should refrain from becoming totally one sided, biased and neglecting some of these efforts and dotingly only some.

and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Mufti Ebrahim Desai
-------------------------------------------

[rozneesitcn]

Assalamu alaykum

Islah can be done in several ways --

1. In the framework of Tabligi Jamat ,spending time with pious people , doing Khidmat and doing three tasweeh zikr or other types of zikr regularly

2. spending time in a khanqah under the spiritual radiance of a genuine sufi master, attending zikr majlis. Invoking the prescribed wird in own home individually.

3. Reading books of the saintly people including Sahabah , sufi shaykhs .

The purifying effect of each method is not same. The best and deepest purifying effect happens in
the second method.

For some people , all three methods are accessible . For some , only one method is accessible.

If you have access to all three methods , then you should keep a balance between all three methods
and choose the path which is optimized according to your temperament and economic situation.

If you do like this , then you will not be lost.
Assalamu alaykum

Just go and tell a lay person who is far from deen "man your islaah is in this following ways"

Then see the reaction.

Brother why not the other way around how many khalifah and their murideen are spending 4 months every year. You must remember that according to you one option is TJ, then why not this option.

So my advice is to leave the lay persons who are brought to masjid from duniya and khwahishaath (desire worship) under the guidance of the TJ, they have good experience is handling them. Sitting in a masjid or a khankaq you will not get that experience.

shukran

[vipBrooriErok]

Assalamu alaykum

Just go and tell a lay person who is far from deen "man your islaah is in this following ways"

Then see the reaction.

Brother why not the other way around how many khalifah and their murideen are spending 4 months every year. You must remember that according to you one option is TJ, then why not this option.

So my advice is to leave the lay persons who are brought to masjid from duniya and khwahishaath (desire worship) under the guidance of the TJ, they have good experience is handling them. Sitting in a masjid or a khankaq you will not get that experience.

shukran

While TJ is a prime place to be for a layman, why would you think that a Khanqah or a Masjid or sitting by the feet of some muadhin or imam is not sufficient to start gaining islah. Alhamdulillah I can attest from my own experience that my journey had more to do with individual sittings with imam, his good ikhlaq and guidance than it had to do with TJ.

Unfortunately we didnt enjoy the luxury of Sehroza, Gasht, chilla and Fi Sabeelillahs in the remote area we were in. We did contact Nizamuddin, Local markaz etc etc, but we understood that our place was too remote a job for even TJs at that time. It is only recently that TJ work started there, and that too in a shaby way.. but something better than nothing. This is AFTER one student who left and became maulana at IDA (Ml. Saleem Dhorat) .

There are still such places where other modes of islah aside from TJ are terribly required. The some-what inflexibility of TJ style and routine does not offer laypeople in those area a chance to brighten their future as luminous as some brothers of densely desi populous cities in the west cherish.

Any means of Islah is welcome in those areas, even if it is inefficient, awrad ridden, khilwat appealing sufi khanqah

Mufti Yunus db. once told me that Islah is something you get from Allah. You dont need a vessel for it. All you need it one way sincere willingness.

The question we ought to be pondering over is how to instill this fikar of willingness to be a better muslim among the laymen. The answer in my experience is in numerous ways. You dont need to advertise all of them to a layman, rather the one that may click with him.

[evarekataVame]

Assalamu alaykum

Just go and tell a lay person who is far from deen "man your islaah is in this following ways"

Then see the reaction.

Brother why not the other way around how many khalifah and their murideen are spending 4 months every year. You must remember that according to you one option is TJ, then why not this option.

So my advice is to leave the lay persons who are brought to masjid from duniya and khwahishaath (desire worship) under the guidance of the TJ, they have good experience is handling them. Sitting in a masjid or a khankaq you will not get that experience.

shukran

Salaam,

Just because a person is a "lay muslim" it doesn't mean that he is an idiot. I'm sure most people can understand that islah can be reached in various ways. Even a person is far from deen can understand this, they are also not stupid.

[rozneesitcn]

Assalamu alaykum
Just because a person is a "lay muslim" it doesn't mean that he is an idiot. I'm sure most people can understand that islah can be reached in various ways. Even a person is far from deen can understand this, they are also not stupid. When I say a "lay muslim", I mean not a person

who has straight from a casino or a liquor sop entered the masjid and declares brothers I want Islah can you please tell me where I get it.

who doesn't know what is islah is and why should one get islah.

who is busy in getting the wordly targets at the cost of aakhirah.

etc...................

So for this person, the TJ reaches to them, understands them, brings them, takes care of them. When you try to distract them in name of islah a situation will come when he will go back to where he came from. This is not a theory but it is EXPERIENCED.

Secondly other groups will come and brain wash these lay person of a certain period, "brother you have come from negative to zero and them positive, now you have to accelarate, so join our group. When so many people have accelerated in TJ why other means.

[illiniastibly]

Where do u live ? India ? Which province ? is the fatwa about validity of zikr majlis ?
or , the priority of zikr majlis over Dawah work and vice versa ?

Bangalore , Karnataka

India

the fatwa was about validity of Zikr Majlis...


my personal opinion is both Tj work and zikr majlis should go hand in hand as i respect both of them.

Having a balanced approached is always better .

[Nubtoubrem]

Assalamu alaykum


When I say a "lay muslim", I mean not a person

who has straight from a casino or a liquor sop entered the masjid and declares brothers I want Islah can you please tell me where I get it.

who doesn't know what is islah is and why should one get islah.

who is busy in getting the wordly targets at the cost of aakhirah.

etc...................

So for this person, the TJ reaches to them, understands them, brings them, takes care of them. When you try to distract them in name of islah a situation will come when he will go back to where he came from. This is not a theory but it is EXPERIENCED.

Secondly other groups will come and brain wash these lay person of a certain period, "brother you have come from negative to zero and them positive, now you have to accelarate, so join our group. When so many people have accelerated in TJ why other means.

Its true that some pseudo-Islamic groups including some fake Sufi groups , fake Jihadi and political groups try to recruti TJ activists into their own organizations. We need to safeguard our TJ brothers from the lure of those groups. However, this does not mean that our TJ brothers should be kept away from every other true Islamic groups such as genuine Sufi orders.


In the following link , you will find the lecture of a great TJ elder about the true intention of Tabligh Jamat.

-------------------------------------
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...gh-Jamat/page2

He mentioned that the effort of Tabligh is like rain, which reaches every area whether people like it or not. Without asking remuneration from people, it pours over the rivers and oceans just as it falls on
mountains, rocky ground and salt flats.

When the effort of Tabligh takes place, its benefit reaches the average Muslim as well as the
Madrasahs and Khanqah.

Tabligh creates the urge in people, which in turn drives people to become students of
the Madrasahs and murids (disciples) at Khanqahs.

-------------------------------------------------------

When a TJ activist joins a Madarsah part time or full time , he great accelerates in acquiring knowledge of Fiqah.

When a TJ activist joins a Sufi order with proper sincerity , he great accelerates in acquiring
Qurb-e-Elahi ( Divine proximity ) in the spiritual world.