[Maserati]

We love German music - what is the history of Western music without it? What would our musicians be without it?

The music of Germany is so very great and powerful, that it seems to be the ne plus ultra, not just in music, but even in all the arts (hence the development to Wagner). Relatively little of it is merely 'delightful', whether one speaks of Mozart or whoever - it stirs the depths far too strongly for such a word.

Yet what seems joyous, at any rate in general, in Bach and Haydn and Mozart, is utterly changed in Wagner and Strauss. This is part of the greater German tragedy of course. Then the real aesthetic horrors begin.

I have been trying to understand this colossal phenomenon for years, of Romanticism in German culture, of the good and bad in German music. Perhaps there are others in the forum who are interested, and may be able to help me in what I find to be a fascinating but very troubling history.

It means so much, yet we understand it so little.

[8cyVn4RJ]

Btw, Mozart and Haydn were Austrian, unless you believe the "Anschluess" is alive and well today

And what about the the German Tragedy??? Troubling History??? Please, don't be a troll. And please remember that Wagner died many years before Adolf Hitler was born. Wagner's problem was his being a "skirt chaser" but he was a master orchestrator like Richard Strauss - Yes, I adore the HyperUltraSymphonic music of Wagner, Strauss, Bruckner, Mahler, and Korngold.

[HornyMolly]

Hmmm.......... Hitler was Austrian and Beethoven was German, the Austrians have been trying to convince the world that it is the other way round for ever and a day.

[JessicaLin]

I'll see JHC's "Hmmm" and raise him an "Oooooh".
I have some Bavarian tragedy in my life, being offered a $1,000/wk cash gig in a recording polka band.
And that included afternoons at Marineland during Octoberfest, somewhere I pay to visit.
But I said no, because I didn't want to wear black leather short pants.
However, because of festive German attitudes, I did get invited to make the signs for Club Heidehoff,
and highway signs for the development of a German retirement village in St. Catharines.

[Carfanate]

I'll see JHC's "Hmmm" and raise him an "Oooooh".
I have some Bavarian tragedy in my life, being offered a $1,000/wk cash gig in a recording polka band.
And that included afternoons at Marineland during Octoberfest, somewhere I pay to visit.
But I said no, because I didn't want to wear black leather short pants.
However, because of festive German attitudes, I did get invited to make the signs for Club Heidehoff,
and highway signs for the development of a German retirement village in St. Catharines.

Br. JohnWatt - - Thank you for the comic relief........

[GuitarLoverBe]

I too felt the need. I might even start using the "like" function, before long.

[Gideleb]

I too felt the need. I might even start using the "like" function, before long.

I hope the need liked being felt, if u use der lik buton yyu will vanish

[violalmina]

Lik??? What say you, Commisar Colin??? Lik is the Swedish word for "Corpse" or "Cadaver" i.e. using the "Lik" function to obtain dead bodies........

How dreadfully awful

[grizolsemn]

Yo is dead to rights there bro

[Honealals]

Yeah, and Sweden will put Julian Assange on the next flight to a Federal Penitentiary in the US where he will be gassed to death quicker than three shakes of a lamb's tail.

[AcecePesFeacy]

In the United States, being "gassed to death" now means a fatality caused by a hoarding fall of musical instruments,
more than likely to be more Stratocasters with broken tremolo arms and some Epiphones that weren't real Gibsons.
"Getting gas" means having the hots for a guitar you only will buy as an offshore, cheap, small-scale copy.
"Passing gas" means going on and on about how only '50's-'60's guitars are real, as an American university professor.

As for modern food additives creating an explosive gas that's a danger for morticians, that's "lik-gas", in Swedish.

[Obgrfbke]

JohnWatt,

Yep, gases from rotting flesh are always a "quaint fragrance".............

[doolarsva]

We love German music - what is the history of Western music without it? What would our musicians be without it?

The music of Germany is so very great and powerful, that it seems to be the ne plus ultra, not just in music, but even in all the arts (hence the development to Wagner). Relatively little of it is merely 'delightful', whether one speaks of Mozart or whoever - it stirs the depths far too strongly for such a word.

Yet what seems joyous, at any rate in general, in Bach and Haydn and Mozart, is utterly changed in Wagner and Strauss. This is part of the greater German tragedy of course. Then the real aesthetic horrors begin.

I have been trying to understand this colossal phenomenon for years, of Romanticism in German culture, of the good and bad in German music. Perhaps there are others in the forum who are interested, and may be able to help me in what I find to be a fascinating but very troubling history.

It means so much, yet we understand it so little.

If you are really serious about engaging in/reading about such a discusssion and the issues it engenders, hop on over to our sister forum, Talk Classical and check out what's been going on there--for quite some time--with this topic. WK

[Xfxhbcxp]

If you are really serious about engaging in/reading about such a discusssion and the issues it engenders, hop on over to our sister forum, Talk Classical and check out what's been going on there--for quite some time--with this topic. WK

I think he has gone Steve

[BaselBimbooooo]

"Tragedy of German Music" - Well, I'll hop on over to Talk Classical and ease myself into that discussion.

[KlaraNovikoffaZ]

"Tragedy of German Music" - Well, I'll hop on over to Talk Classical and ease myself into that discussion.

Let us know what you think of it and give a link if you would be so kind

[Noilemaillilm]

Let us know what you think of it and give a link if you would be so kind

I can't even find that discussion........Maybe Steve can give me the name of the thread - I don't have a clue...

[Andromino]

I can't even find that discussion........Maybe Steve can give me the name of the thread - I don't have a clue...

@ CD, I just sent you a pm regarding this, as I misspoke lat night in saying this thread was on our sister forum TC. PM me back if there are any further problems re: your finding which site this discussion is in fact on. WK

[euylvaygdq]

@ CD, I just sent you a pm regarding this, as I misspoke last night in saying this thread was on our sister forum TC.

No, you didn't- it's right here

[hansen384cbh]

No, you didn't- it's right here

Chi, Thanks. Since I've taken ill about a month ago, my judgements and perceptions have been somewhat awry. Good looking out!