[altosburg]

does the law of one say anything about eating animals? i have been a vegetarian for almost two years now and i am pondering on going back to eating meat. the reason i stopped eating meat was because i wanted to cause the least harm possible. i feel we kill plants too. is it a service to self action to eat animals to live? i want to cause the least harm possible and reach enlightment. i know even jesus fished, buddha ate meat and they are two great examples. but moving into this new dimension of love should we eat meat and kill animals? or should we just eat plants which do not feel pain and do not have a nervous system?

[kuzbaslachek]

to me, eating meat is not a sts action. were doing nothing more eating something like a cheese burger than eating a garden salad. we are just eating to survive. getting what we need in order for our bodies to work properly and not break down on us.

maby the animals need to be killed and eaten in order to progress in 2d.

[U2DnBGFE]

i feel that your intentions speak volumes about any actions you take, even when selecting your foods. the fact that you truly want to cause no harm and that you are only eating for sustainence means that you are on the right path in my opinion.

if you were going out and mutilating, deisrespecting, or just plain not apprecaiting the animal you are consuming, then maybe you'd need to rethink it. but, youre not....

oh and i do believe that a lot of native american and aboriginal tribes were very respectful of the animals they ate. rituals were created to give thanks to that animal for offering itself as food and all parts were used as to make the most of that animals body.

maybe you could study the thanksgiving rituals or prayers and create your own form of thanks before you eat such a meal? it may help you spiritually, it may not. just an idea, though

[SkatrySkith]

david wilcock reported being a meat eater, citing the ineffectiveness of vegetarianism to meet specific nutritional needs. a lot of people do need meat in their diet. if you're one of these people, you may want to consider the possibility that the animals know on some level why they are here, and that they too may have elected to do a service to humanity.

i guess the best thing we can do to honor the animals is eat meat when we need it, and not have two or three sirloin steaks every night to fill some emotional hunger.

[traiffhetl]

just to point out.. did you see my recent topic on visions? and do you know when they started to look like visions? try and guess

yes, after i stopped eating meat! coincidence? i don't think so. i think i really cleansed my astral body by making that move, and believe it or not, it's only a month since i become a vegetarian! it helped my body finally start using its full potential.

so it definetly is not the same.

now, another reason. animals are more spiritualy evolved than plants, therefore, they couse more bad karma! so its like choosing the lesser evil, since we can't be karmicaly uninvolved.

however, there is a theory that plants are meant to be eaten, and therefore like to be eaten, since, believe it or not, it is their lives purpose . grass likes to be walked on, so does apple likes to be eaten, and david mentions that in one of his recent audioblogs.

so, there you have it. hope this helps.

oh another point.. some guy once said:

the animals are my friends, and i don't eat my friends.

[animilius]

hi jadde44,

here are some pertinent quotes from the law of one regarding food.

law of one book i, session 18
questioner: are there any foods that are helpful or harmful that the instrument might eat?

ra: i am ra. this instrument has body complex distortion towards ill health in the distortion direction corrected best by ingestion of the foodstuffs of your grains and your vegetables, as you call them. however, this is extremely unimportant when regarded as an aid with equality to other aids such as attitude which this instrument has in abundance. it, however, aids the vital energies of this instrument, with less distortion towards ill health, to ingest foodstuffs in the above manner with the occasional ingestion of what you call your meats, due to the instrument’s need to lessen the distortion towards low vital energy.

{later in the same session}

questioner: i just have two little questions here at the end. the instrument wanted to ask if there were any other substances, foods, etc. that she should not eat or dring or things that she should not do because she does not wish to have poor contact for any reason.

ra: i am ra. there is no activity which this instrument engages in which affects abilities negatively. there is one activity which affects its abilities positively. this is the sexual activity, as you would call it. there are substances ingested which do not aid the individual in the service it has chosen, this being that which you would call the marijuana. this is due to the distortion towards chemical lapses within the mind complex causing lack of synaptic continuity. this is a chemical reaction of short duration. this instrument, however, has not used this particular substance at any time while performing this service. we believe we have covered the use of such chemical agents as lsd, this being positive to a certain extent due to the energizing or speeding up of the vital forces. however, it is not recommended for this instrument due to the toll it takes upon the vital energies once the substance wears off. this being true of any speeding-up chemical. also:

law of one book ii, session 40
questioner: in dietary matters, what would be the foods that one would include and what would be the foods that one would exclude in a general way for the greatest care of one’s bodily complex?

ra: i am ra. firstly, we underline and emphasize that this information is not to be understood literally but as a link or psychological nudge for the body and the mind and spirit. thus it is the care and respect for the self that is the true thing of importance. in this light we may iterate the basic information given for this instrument’s diet. the vegetables, the fruits, the grains, and to the extent necessary for the individual metabolism, the animal products. these are those substances showing respect for the self. in addition, though this has not been mentioned for this instrument is not in need of purification, those entities in need of purging the self of a poison thought-form or emotion complex do well to take care in following a program of careful fasting until the destructive thought-form has been purged analogously with the by-products of ridding the physical vehicle of excess material. again you see the value not to the body complex but used as a link for the mind and spirit. thus self reveals self to self.
so it would appear that according to the law of one, what is most important is your attitude and supporting environment. it is certainly not considered sts to ingest meat, but it is also suggested to be done in moderation according to the discernment and need of the individual.

hope that helps,

3d sunset

[bubborn]

hi, jadde.

i was a heavy meat eater for all my life, but about... well, about 13 or so years ago i simply lost the desire for it. i'm often asked why? i'm not sure myself. it particularly strikes others when they see me cooking meat, which i do on ocasion and have no problem with it.
i think the real reason is thast i hate when things get stuck in my teeth , which is very true - it drives me crazy.

since then i have read that meat eating is associated with heavier energy, and as long as a person needs this energy - they will crave it. once the cravings or desire is gone - a person doesn't need that type of energy any more.
i know some people vegetarians for 10 year and then they suddenly go back to meat eating. it's what ever energy you need at this particular moment. that, of course, is one view only.

funny thing - recently i lost the desire for bread. not sure whast that means.

love to you and good luck.

[Deribasov]

i think it is an individual choice. i see no harm in eating meat as it is necessary to provide a well balanced diet. there is still so much we don't know about what our bodies need to perform to their maximum capacity.

i've always been drawn to the elements, the air is my friend yet i still breathe it. it comes down to what is comfortable for you.

as far as having visions, i have them also, but i'm not a vegetarian, although i have been in the past.

i think the important point is moderation and to obtain the purest foods we possibly can to aid our bodies to perform to their maximum capacity. jmho

[ChuttyAmult]

david wilcock reported being a meat eater, citing the ineffectiveness of vegetarianism to meet specific nutritional needs.

ok now, this is not completely true! he had to consume meat at one time cos he had some serious work to do at the time, as there was no other way he could get regain the necessary energy.

david moved to louisville, kentucky in february 2003 to join forces with jim and carla, the two surviving members of the law of one contact. he was soon followed by fellow members vara in march and gary in late april. david reliably paid 601 dollars monthly rent, shopped for the group’s food on friday night and cooked the group’s food for the entire week all day saturday (with fellow member vara, who also did all the bookkeeping). david also regularly performed a variety of skilled labor tasks, including a complete remodeling of the basement, creating three new bedrooms and a large laundry room, under the direction and partnership of fellow l/l member bruce, also known as lonebear, who moved in as of december. gary also provided assistance in construction.

this remodeling process proved to be the most grueling physical labor david would ever perform. he literally worked from the time he woke up to the time he went to bed every day, stopping only to take paid clients, cook group food all day saturday and attend group meetings on sunday. he began eating regular animal protein again to support his physical body’s muscular exertion, and discovered that his particular blood type really benefited from it - thus he allowed limited types of organic meat back in after a seven-year stint of severely disciplined vegan dieting. (sorry to our dedicated vegetarians out there… some people can do it and some can’t.)
here's a quote from the archive:

dw: let's not forget that non-organic produce has many pesticides and contaminants that significantly increase the risks to health and decrease any perceived benefits.

overall my diet is quite strict and repetitive (sabrina hates this about me) but it suits me well. of course we start with the no's. no white flour (and now no flour of any kind, due to my sensitive system,) no refined sugar (now i'm actually avoiding all sweeteners, period, except for the occasional glass of rice milk,) no meat except fish, (and especially no red meat,) no dairy whatsoever, (if you must have eggs only do the yolks,) no white rice, (same effect as white flour,) no msg (which is so cleverly hidden with names like "natural flavor" that you basically don't buy anything prepackaged unless it is from an established health food store and is labeled as clean,) no fried foodand no preservatives. now by this point most do not think that there is much left to work with.

what i have every day, based on a constant interchange with the readings, is as follows: two or three huge glasses of water after awakening. wait 45 minutes. cooked millet grains forbreakfast (a complete protein.) wait two and a half hours, drink two or three glasses of water, wait30-45 minutes, thenmixed greens salad with garbanzo beans, shredded carrots, avocado, olives, extra-virgin olive oil, lemon juice and tamari for lunch. wait two and a half hours, drink two or three glasses of water, wait 45 minutes,and steamed dark greens for dinner, again with lemon juice, olive oil and tamari - usually a half onion, cabbage and broccoli included - always organic and never inorganic. if required for energy, i.e. if energy is too low, then baked fish can also be a part of lunch or dinner - although from a digestive standpoint it seems to work much better with cooked greens as opposed to raw salad greens. i do have the occasional unsalted brown rice cakes with almond butter for the in-between periods of water and meals - i.e. after water cycles but before meal cycles, or after meals but before water.

two hours after dinner you can have your in-season fruit, remembering that the really sugary ones do more harm than good, such as the bananas, pineapples, mangoes, et cetera. apples should only be eaten as cooked unless you're on a cleansing diet, oranges and citrus are doable, pears are ok at this time of year, melons of all kinds always good, papaya is fine, but again make sure it is organic. if the fruit is one where it needs to be peeled to eat, there is less danger of buying inorganic if your only other choice is starvation. citrus fruits should only be had by themselves and not with other fruits, and if you are a blood type o you are allergic to strawberries.

food combinations catch a lot of people. if you are going to have fish on this diet, you cannot blend it with carbohydrates (grains) in the same meal. you should never combine fruits and vegetables in the same meal. if for some reason you feel you must have dairy, it should only be had by itself - nothing before or after. also important is the water cycle. minimum of 30 minutes without significant water intake before a meal, minimum of two hours without any significant water intake after a meal. the reason is that it rinses away digestive enzymes and you end up with a lot of undigested debris stuck in your colon, which is not fun or healthy. also, you don't end up digesting the food and your body gets weak. the only exception to the water cycle is that you can drink water only 30 minutes after eating fruit, due to the speedy digestion that ensues (unless it is dried fruit - but that can have molds that again are very bad for you.) using enzyme supplements isextremely highly suggested.

going out to eat? don't do it too often (twice a week is plenty) and stick to either health-food store cafe's if possible, or chinese restaurants, hold the rice and the msg. (many sauces have sugar in them as well.) you can find your way around an indian restaurant fairly well, though many dishes have some form of dairy and / or may be uncomfortably spicy (which is detrimental to the body above a certain point.) should you be forced to go to a more mainstream restaurant, tell them that you have "special needs" and you would like the baked fish entree, without butter, and the lightly steamed vegetables on the side, without butter. ask for water only with your meal and don't drink any of it. then pray to god that you'll make it home without a coronary for your obsessive-compulsive behavior with the waitress, your guests and yourself. it's often better just to stay home.

- david wilcock

[infelconi]

as far as having visions, i have them also, but i'm not a vegetarian, although i have been in the past.

yap, but these are kinda self initiated. until now i never was able to make them happen at will. now, it's like i have the necessary means to make them happen! i'll update my thread later so you will know what i mean.

[wbeachcomber]

i don't see how diet reflects on your polarity much at all, unless you are purposely choosing your food in order to maximize control over other-selves.

and unless you are killing the animals yourself, it shouldn't affect your karma much either, i would think...

its all speculation anyway, though. keep doing whatever you feel is best for you.

[Unhappu]

hmm this is an interesting one because ive noticed many people take what they eat very personally.


one thing i find interesting is the survivial argument against vegetarianism, "you have to eat meat to survive." who can argue with that, its me or the animal right? and most people say its the animal thats going , not me. why not change that, why not be out in the woods, starving, and you come across a juicy fat slow rabbit. easy pickings right?, and instead of killing it and eating it say, "you know what im not doing this" i will go ahead and just die. that is a very selfless act, it might be easier for most people to sacrifice themselves for another person. but those who will do it for an animal? now i admire these people. if you study jainism maybe you already have a good hold on this idea.

2012 is all about change right? when is man ever going let meat go? lets move on and forget about our top "predatory" status. if more and more people put the steak knives down we will adjust! remember the italian lizard study david mantioned, it we be like that!

sorry for the rant

[Falik]

i have a friend who is blackfoot indian. he has participated in the sun dance ceremony and is not a "costume" indian. he is a deeply spiritual being who has described many amazing things to me, some of them direct confirmation of such things as ufo's, underground bases, free and alternative energies. he is a rare being and i am blessed to have any association with him.

along the way, i treated him and his wife to a big home-made tamale feast. as we were sitting down during the meal we got to talking about food, and its health benefits and effects relative to each of us. my friend "bear" told a story of a day he was invited by the buddhist monks from a local monastery (in the colestine valley of northern northern california) to participate in a ceremony up in the mountains with them. he accepted and when the day came they all went up in the mountains and had their ceremony. it lasted all day, and when they were done one of the monks said "phew, i sure am hungry! let's go down into medford (oregon) and get some hamburgers!" and they did. at some funky little greasy burger stand. "bear" said they were absolutely delicious and that everyone was rejuvenated by the food.

of course, they blessed the food well before consumption, and they ate with gratitude, and in that "bear" pointed out that all food was equal then, that it wasn't so much what you ate, but how you ate it.

on the flip side, from me, consider this: everything is made of light, and everything is made of consciousness. at what point, other than, say, rocks being un-chewable, does it matter what we eat? it's all made of the same stuff. what might matter most is how we eat.

then on the way, way, flip side from me, imagine this: one cow, one scream, many people fed. one vegetarian, one mouthful of avocado and sprout sandwich (mind you, sprouts are still alive!!!), many, many, screams!!!
oh, the horror!

so please people! don't eat live things! sprouts are people too!

or perhaps, eat what you eat, preferably that which makes you feel physically vitalized (not emotionally satisfied), but have great gratitude.
love is the very stuff of this universe, but gratitude makes it move!

bless you all and thank you for being! bon apetit!

[Qxsumehj]

what we need to see is this: animals are alive and yes plants alive, but animals feel pain. studies have been conducted on this. according to what i have researched plants do not have a nervous system so they are unable to feel pain. now have you seen the way they kill animals in slaughter houses. [video did not work, please do not insert if it is graphic. thank you, moderator]
i know we do not need to eat meat to survive, because i have done it.
animals were not born to live in cages, in crowded conditions, not meant to be
beaten, and killed. they were meant to live like you and i. if we want to help
mother earth move into a new 4th density world then we must stop the pain
we stop the killing. by you buying your meat, you are supporting slaughter houses. you may not be taking the knife and killing them, but you are paying
someone to do it for you. it goes the same for fish. i have a problem eating
corpses because i sometimes feel the pain the animal felt during slaughter.
sometimes i don't know what to eat because i get hungry very often and
have not yet developed a good vegetarian diet. buddhist monks do not eat meat. i read that they go to pet shops and buy thousands of fish and then free them in the ocean. they are so loving towards creatures. tell what do you guys think about this?

[ziIReIGS]

and in that "bear" pointed out that all food was equal then, that it wasn't so much what you ate, but how you ate it.

or perhaps, eat what you eat, preferably that which makes you feel physically vitalized (not emotionally satisfied), but have great gratitude.
love is the very stuff of this universe, but gratitude makes it move!

thank you for these excerpts. this is what i think it comes down to. there are no rules here. some things may work for one, but not for another. and isnt that beautiful? all of our balances are different in a million ways!!!! do what works for you and dont expect others to be that exact way. they have their own lessons, thier own time, their own physical needs...its not for us to say what will get another to oneness...

all we are here to do is radiate our love to all, not to tell people how to live or how to obtain the oneness with the creator.

love and light to everyone! meat or no meat! problems or no problems! enlightened or not! :d

[tipokotap]

i pulled this from a website (decades of research back it up) pm for name

blood type o should basically stick to a high protein diet (including red meat), low carbs, fruits and vegetables. cut out wheat and most other grains, corn, and avoid dairy products and most nuts. must engage in vigorous physical exercise.

based on davids description he must be type o im apos and low and behold my diet and lifestyle fit niceley into this description (before i even knew about the blood type thing).


blood type a must ideally be vegetarian - high carbohydrate, low fat. basically, stick to fruits and vegetables. this blood type is supposed to have relatively thicker blood, and a sensitive immune system. must not consume dairy products, animal fat and meat. should engage in gentle exercise such as yoga or golf, and meditate to deal with stress.

blood type b can have the most varied diet of all the blood types. should consume a balanced diet of fruits and vegetables, grains, fish, dairy products. chicken is best avoided. should engage in moderate exercise such as swimming or walking.

blood type ab has most of the benefits and limitations of types a and b. should consume a mostly vegetarian diet, and only on rare occasions some fish, meat (no chicken), and dairy products. should engage in calming exercises and relaxation techniques. considered the friendliest immune system of all the blood types.

so basically everyone can go vegan except o's so there you have it.

[hojutok]

so, i am a chef and have been cooking in professional kitchens now for 28 years. i don't think this discussion would be complete if we didn't speak as well about the energy that goes into food during preparation.

currently i am plying my skills as a shaman/chef at a pasta joint. good stuff. we use as many organic and natural ingredients as we can (a proviso about organic, people: organic is only as organic as the air and water that go upon the food - what with pollution and chemtrails i question just how "organic" we can call anything!) but as well serve plenty of meats and cheese. now, as a chef it isn't really for me to decide how or what people eat, past whatever controls i have over the menu itself. it's not to say i don't cringe when i see someone who weighs about 250# super-sizing our fettuccine alfredo. but i have to recognize their free will.

and i have to do my job, as well. i can't begin to tell you the difficulty in sorting out the issues involved in restaurant work: the waste, the flesh, questions about service orientation (yes, it is the "service" industry), like am i doing that large person a positive service by feeding them 3000 calories? i seek to be of service to others, and have found my feet on a path that intimately serves others, regardless of their orientation. but still i've questioned it.

however, i have come to understand what i do much better now as i have come to embrace the shamanistic qualities of working with food. to prepare a meal i am calling forth the principles of earth, water, air, fire, and spirit, and with an alchemical dash of salt and pepper, i transmute the raw materials into the refined. and in that moment i can put forth the intent that the food be healthful for the person it goes to. this higher view of my service is all that gets my aching feet through some redundant days.

it is like a standing order for me now, no matter my mood, be it joyous or pessimistic, playful or pissed. the food and its energy come first. i am not to judge anyone or their choice in meal, i am but to make it as energizing and positive an experience for them as possible.

indeed, the kitchen itself becomes a conditioned space, like an altar, or a meditation space. and in that conditioned space an intent can be set like a standing wave. mine is that the food be metaphysically nourishing.

and the feedback i get from my customers is that the food is delicious, and they appreciate that we do as much natural and organic as we can afford to, but they keep coming back because there is something else there, because the food just "makes them feel good" or makes them feel "whole again". and i cannot deny after all of these years that it is more than ingredients, or a recipe, or my physical skill with the food that produces these effects. it is because i am consciously in service knowing the intimacy of the mixing of my energy and the customer's.

thus am i shaman/chef.

point is, we are all wonderful, magical beings, and in conscious food preparation, aware of the melding of energies therein, that food can be positively charged - regardless of what it is. so along with the gratitude i spoke of earlier, we can also be proactive about the energy of our food. let your kitchen be a sacred space, and set within the intent that your food be magical and soul nourishing.

[CibQueersejer]

you may want to consider the possibility that the animals know on some level why they are here, and that they too may have elected to do a service to humanity. yes, this is a possibility, but we don't know this for a fact. i don't think any animal really wants to die- by instinct we wish to live and to survive.

i can imagine higher planes of existence where death is no more and that beings no longer need to hunt others for sustenance.

having said that, i was vegan for a while but i have lapsed away from this, also from being vegetarian. this is partly because i am slightly intolerant to soya (which contains enzyme inhibitors unless it has been fermented for a long time such as tempeh). and the other reason is through lack of convenience now i live on my own; a veggie/ semi-vegan diet needs a lot of careful planning and the meals need preparing well to make them exciting.

there are plenty of healthy alternatives to meet, quinoa for example (a super grain) is great, spirulina is a fantastic superfood supplement which is a "superfood", contains lots of b12 as well as being great for others things (as does marmite, yeast extract, contain b12). unwashed organic veg can also supply sufficient amounts of b12....lol. hemp is also a great food source. aww, i love those spicy frankfurter style tofu sausages.....lol

and the other thing is that healthy food (including fruit and veg) seems to be so expensive these days, at least it is here in the uk.

i'm waffling....

[Paladin]

one of the main problems for the meat eater is the fact that even if an animal could consider its death its sole purpose in life, it fears, it is bred in fear lives its life in fear and fears its death, that adrenaline of anger fear and aggression is then consumed by you, i have been a vegetarian for many years there are many meat substitute products to give all the protein and needed fats to our diet, the notion that an animal will choose to reincarnate be it knows that humans need food is nonsense, there are no more excuses, we are no longer hunter gatherers, our prey does not roam free with a resonable chance of escape, on another level i do believe in thanking my food and water for its sacrifice and you no what it tastes better, try it.

love and peace

[ambientambien]

or perhaps, eat what you eat, preferably that which makes you feel physically vitalized (not emotionally satisfied), but have great gratitude.

well said my friend! that totally makes sense to me!