[Qeiafib]

you, like me, may be a led zeppelin fan.

one could feel the palpable sense of grief within humanity when jb died; not quite being old enough to remember where i was when jfk died, i remember that day in 1980.

zep re-unites this month for a show in london, and the reason i am making this post is that i am psychically keyed into the awareness of this within the energy body of humanity, increasingly as the month unfolds.

2007! can the zeppelin lumber aloft once again? for decades, i had my doubts.

but check out this link from 1998. toronto, no less..i think i was there..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cujb1...eature=related

[robinthesearchmasterh]

you, like me, may be a led zeppelin fan.

one could feel the palpable sense of grief within humanity when jb died; not quite being old enough to remember where i was when jfk died, i remember that day in 1980.

zep re-unites this month for a show in london, and the reason i am making this post is that i am psychically keyed into the awareness of this within the energy body of humanity, increasingly as the month unfolds.

2007! can the zeppelin lumber aloft once again? for decades, i had my doubts.

but check out this link from 1998. toronto, no less..i think i was there..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cujb1...eature=related

indeed.

i cried when i watched the polar music prize 2006.
http://www.polarmusicprize.com/newsite/2006.shtml

[Scukonaher]

hi!
interestingly, a lot of "hardcore" lyrics promote messages of oneness. however, some might argue that hardcore music contains little to no harmonies and therefore the "music" is nothing more than guitar distortions which are of a lower vibrational frequency than "pure" notes. hmmm, this is very interesting. i would love to hear your ideas about this!

writing music, playing music, painting, etc. are all creative experiences that might bring healing to the creator. everything then, has its place. the most violent, misogynistic rap lyrics seem unharmonious to me, but perhaps are healing to the artist who writes and sings them.

does consistently listening to distorted guitar lower the vibrational frequencies in our physical and etheric bodies? i suspect we are best served by varying the music we listen to. it sounds, flachiefsfan, that you already do this.

first of all, thanks to all who have read this topic and to those who have responded.


great post, iamsaidi! as a musician, there is a certain sound we all look for in regard to vibrational frequencies. that's why so many guitarists stand out from one another, not just in their sounds, but in their style of playing. some of eddie van halens leads give me goose bumps when i hear them! when i put a hard rock lead to "the heart of reiki," it sounded like it was meant to be in there. despite the distortion, the root notes are still the same, even with hardcore metal, which is mainly in the key of e or down-tuned to the key of d.

many rock leads are based on a major pentatonic or minor pentatonic scales, or a variation of scales such as mixolydian dorian, phrygian, onian or one of my favorites, aeolian.

one of my favorite leads is in night ranger's "don't tell me you love me" which is in sharp contrast to what i am practicing spiritually. i still listen to the song and play along with it, because it gives me good vibrations despite the message it sends. in psychology, we call this cognitive dissonance!

my grandfather immigrated to the us from spain in the early 1900's. he played the most beautiful spanish-style guitar i ever heard, and he taught himself how to play guitar! when i was a kid, he bought me my first electric guitar. after he passed on, i wrote a spanish-style song in his memory and played it for my mother, who joyously cried after hearing it. that's what music is all about.

i recently wrote and recorded a hard rock song called "std" which is an awareness song about using protection during sex. i used a drum track and layed down the bass, lead and rhythm guitar, and sang lead and background vocals for the song. if i knew how to play drums, i would have done that too! it's fun playing other people's music, but it brings you into a whole new realm of creativity when you can write your own. an energy flows within you during this process that feeds the development of the song. it's fascinating!

they say the hands are an extension of the heart. in my opinion, music is a gift that has been shared through out the centuries, regardless of genre. the message, however, may be viewed differently. many times, when i listen to the "lyrics", i'm not actually listening to the written lyrics, but to the melody of the lyrics and how they symbiotically enmesh with the instruments. metallica's "master of puppets" is a song about the evils of cocaine, yet it has an amazing guitar riff and a good melody behind the lyrics, while sending a positive message.

i guess that's the trifecta in music?

[robinthesearchmasterh]

when i exercise indoors, the stereo is very loud. the sound itself isolates me from most else. conversely, when i exercise outdoors, i wear no personal audio device, i join with my surroundings - especially in the forest. if in the busy time of the city, i day dream.

i was raised with music in the background frequently... beatles, simon & garfunkel, mamas & the papas, a mix of classical & folk too. i now still listen to them, but often prefer much stronger instrumentation.

i am one who really prefers that the lyrics say something, but non-vocal compositions are just as moving to me. i can not get by poor lyrics. as for "hard rock," the classics are for me: led zeppelin, pink floyd. i have found surprisingly pleasing and strange lyrics from live and almost always excellent lyrics matching superior musicianship from rush. non-pop genesis is great as well. as for non-vocals: tangerine dream. i listened to a bit of old chicago the other night... compositions, not just songs. almost without exception, classical is played in the mornings of the weekend.

obviously just a few bits, and highly subjective. there is so much to choose from... if i am home, music is on.

[bellson]

thanks for bringing up this subject.
there is a song "the road goes on for ever" by robert earl keen or joe ely, that that had me really conflicted.
i hate the subject of the lyrics but i can't help my self, i really like the song.
i finally decided to accept it as just one of those things.
the song is not going to make me a bad person.
understanding the feeling of conflict is one of the things that makes me me.

[Qeiafib]

great thread, everyone!

i've played and taught rock and blues guitar for decades, and also at one point became fairly proficient at old school scottish/celtic fiddle playing at one point in my life.

i'm also a great fan of baroque, classical and romantic era symphonic and chamber music. a good piece of music, regardless of genre, will often cause me to not only cry, but sob uncontrollably!

a 'good' piece of music is, of course, subjective to the listener -- my sons will often exhibit the same emotional response to 'cop killing, ftw and hate all women' style rap music that i do with my music, although i personally find that style of rap repulsive.

many kids are angry with the world they find themselves in, and somehow this resonates. is this music intrinsically evil?

all paths being equal, it seems to me that this music draws out their anger, and perhaps in some way allows some kids to explore the dark depths of their anger and feelings of alienation, perhaps preventing a more dangerous form of self-expression?

i don't know. but i know my kids are all basically loving people, trying to find peace and accomodation with the world, as do many of us. they play their music for me, and laugh at my distaste as they try to scandalize me. when they ask if i think it is evil, i answer, "whatever resonates with you and draws you along your own path of evolution, so be it."

some of the rap they dig (oh, no, i'm really showing my age! ) is surprisingly tender, touching and loving as well.

perhaps they do well to discover, in the world of 'violent' rap music, that they are not alone in the world with their anger and distaste of certain conditions they experience in life. it's not for me to judge anyone else's chosen path in life. sometimes, in order to make spiritual gain in the world, people have to start where they may have left off, so to speak, at whatever tonal level they have been at in prior life experiences.

i often think of those who have died violently in wars after brutal suffering, and after witnessing the worst of human behavior. i imagine that many people in the world today have suffered these experiences in their recent past. who among them wouldn't need to express the horrors of their experiences, or resonate with expressions thereof, to begin the healing?

music is indeed a powerful tool for becoming.

[eduptultyt]

is rock and roll evil? yes. and so is channeling.

:-p

[robinthesearchmasterh]

generals gathered in their masses
just like witches at black masses
evil minds that plot destruction
sorcerers of deaths construction
in the fields the bodies burning
as the war machine keeps turning
death and hatred to mankind
poisoning their brainwashed minds, oh lord yeah!

politicians hide themselves away
they only started the war
why should they go out to fight?
they leave that role to the poor

time will tell on their power minds
making war just for fun
treating people just like pawns in chess
wait till their judgment day comes, yeah!

now in darkness, world stops turning
as the war machine keeps burning
no more war pigs of the power
hand of god has struck the hour
day of judgment, god is calling
on their knees, the war pigs crawling
begging mercy for their sins
satan, laughing, spreads his wings
all right now!


come on, is that not perfectly apropos?

try listening to those words with the music.


war pigscredit black sabbath - paranoid (1971)

[Poreponko]

music. such a broad subject. music is a form of communication that transcends all other forms in that is a universal language that is based on the same mathematics that make the whole of creation. like all other thought forms, it can be used to sow peace and love or hatred and discord.

each piece of music is unique unto itself. it has to be analyzed as to the intent of the composer. rock, in and of itself, is no more or less evil than any other form of music. i was even forced by my own inner self recently, to modify my viewpoint regarding rap. i think one of the greatest pieces of rock ever performed was 'europa' by carlos santana. it is an instrumental piece and i frequently play it at maximum volume in my truck, which has an excellent sound system in it. i think carlos is one of the best musicians of all time in the rock genre.

that being said, there is a science behind music and sound. back in the '50's' it was noticed that rock 'n' roll was having a tremendous effect on the youth of the period. this was not wasted on the dark forces. rock was promoting rebellion within the youth of the period, against the status quo. their newfound freedom of expression was promoting a rebellion against the victorian repression of sexuality. but worse than that... it was breaking down a long standing system of racism that had been carefully crafted throughout history by the dark forces. white children were listening to "nigger music" and enjoying it! please forgive the language.
(chris please don't edit this, the truth sometimes hurts...)

it became a matter of concern for the dark forces, it was becoming a matter of national security. because of the treatment of black musicians who were being more and more invited into traditionally white areas of society, a new cry was being born, one of equality and mutual respect. the civil rights movement was born. as we moved into the '60's', something had to be done to take the nations attention away from this budding new development. people were beginning to wake up and think independently. what was needed was something big. really big.

whatever it was, it had to be something that would lift the white people into a new state of superiority. nasa was born and white people were going to space and the moon. then we were brought to the brink of nuclear war over russian missile sites being constructed in cuba. finally... vietnam.
all the while, rock 'n' roll was steadily moving along. it became the new standard of a new generation. as our government tried to move our attention from the new movement for equality by bombarding us with death and destruction, the youth of america begin resisting through the lyrics of their new found freedom of rock 'n' roll.

something had to be done by the cabal to combat this movement. two things were done. a gigantic smear campaign was started, accusing this new music of being a communist plot to break down american youth, and the weaker elements were introduced to the miracle of drugs, primarily pot and lsd. our cia was behind all of this. this had a totally unexpected result for the dark forces, it facilitated a breaking down of the barriers to enlightenment, and introduced western thought to the influence of eastern religions. a battle ensued between the forces of light and dark, played out through the music of rock 'n' roll.

in the end of this epic battle, rock music prevailed and evolved. the excitement and joy produced by rock music made it a force to be reckoned with. it would not be subdued. by the '80's' the face of rock music had changed considerably. because of the effect of music, the fact that it had dealt such deafening defeat on the dark forces, much more attention was paid to the roll of sound on the human psyche.

by the '90's' the dark had developed a new weapon in their arsenal for promoting racism. much had been learned about the human mind and the effects of sound upon it. a new wmd was developed to further the cause of racism. it was called rap. research into the effects of repetitive sounds used in hypnosis to program the human subconscious mind, developed a new means of attack on the dreaded enemy. it was discovered that low frequency vibration, coupled with repetition and negative subliminal messages, could be used to promote and activate self destructive behavior in human beings. the net effect would be a lowering of spiritual vibration resulting in the devolution of the affected party. this new attack is in full swing.

please recognize that this is all my personal opinion, developed through observation, research, and intuition. substantiating evidence abounds.

so, rock 'n' roll is not evil in itself, indeed it has been instrumental in raising consciousness and promoting enlightenment. just like information from channeled sources, discernment is paramount. what is the underlying spirit of the piece? does it promote peace, love, and unity, or does it promote hatred, prejudice, and division? that is the question to be answered.

yours in the light and love of the infinite creator,

jim stephens

[monologue]

musical guy here too. i pulled away from the sterotypical "negative" stuff for quite awhile (metallica to inubus to gnr to linkin park) and really focused on what the more "positive" bands/sounds were doing for me. it was nice, but i still have that part of me which loves to rock out!

i agree that you come through it and there simply is no longer a negative/positive. it simply becomes what resonates and what doesn't. it's like a preference for sweet over salty. i don't judge one as good or bad, they simply are and i simply am. lol.

actually went out to the bars for a rock show last night (white cowbell oklahoma). was the first time having gone out to the bar outside of my own gigs there! i play with a band called [name]. our old music was very non-genre specific (as you'll see by our recordings on the net). but we are moving into a more rock sound now and i (as a percussionist) am finding it difficult to play with the band, even though i like the sound.

my own musical dilemas i guess!

peace.

[monologue]

...also wanted to say that i just noticed that the band i saw last night hadn't been in town for a number of years. they actually were last here right when i was beginning my (conscious) spiritual journey. i've come a long way since then and it's nice i was able to celebrate coming full circle on the "negative" music by going to see them!

as for rock 'n' roll being evil...one phrase that was shouted out a lot last night was "god hates cowbell". haha.

[IssuessBratte]

i think rock and roll is largely fine but am no fan of upside down pentagrams with goats in them being displayed at these places.

the real question is, when you're at a concert do you pitch your hand to the sign of the devil when everyone else does?

but then, most bands have an awareness and don't do stupid things. slipknot for instance, nine pointed star with main point at the top, not the bottom.

[beatrisio]

wow! supercool thread!

i'm not sure where to start, so first i'll say music is one thing that's helped me not come totally unglued. i'm mostly a rock listener, but i really dig some vivaldi at times, as well as an eclectic mix of other music.

i hadn't considered markm's view on people expressing themselves musically due to traumas of past lives, but now i think that makes a lot of sense. thanks for that insight.

teresamh7, you mentioned a musician you knew said he "channels" while performing. i've been playing the guitar for twenty-some years, not professionally and only with a few public performances. i have noticed that there is that "zone" i can get into, when the playing is almost effortless, dare i say, self-less? perhaps musicians and other performers are being guided by their higher self during these periods. thought i'd throw that out for what it's worth.

thanks to thinkingwolf for posting the lyrics to black sabbath's "war pigs"! the music may seem ominous to some, but to me it is inspiring. i don't play the drums, but when that song plays i find myself air-drumming! the lyrical content does in fact seem as appropriate today as it was in 1971. the first time i really listened to that song was in 1996. i remember thinking that this song had a timeless quality to it. until then i never appreciated heavy metal that much. i too enjoy the music of led zeppelin (though to me they're not heavy metal as black sabbath is labeled). zep has gotten a lot of negative press, reference dark arts, aleister crowley, etc. perhaps i'm naive, but i just don't believe they could have created such great music without having a predominantly positive polarization. i remember reading somewhere that led zeppelin's music is for people who are interested in the future.

looking forward to a great future for us all!

doug

[Scukonaher]

the real question is, when you're at a concert do you pitch your hand to the sign of the devil when everyone else does?

you know what? i do that, but only in jest. i've never interpreted it as doing something that's demonic or in the support of satan. i just do it because it makes me laugh at how silly it is.

the catch phrase of the 2000's is appropriate to how i feel about it: "it is what it is" and to me, it's not deviltry, it's humor.

[beatrisio]

i remember seeing a show about heavy metal where the so-called "sign of the devil" was discussed by ronnie james dio. according to this program mr. dio is given credit for popularizing this hand gesture in the music world. he stated the name for this sign, but i don't recall what he said. he stated it was something his italian grandmother taught him. she said it was a way to counter someone giving you the "evil eye".

i haven't researched this any further, and i myself am still undecided about its real significance. i know in yoga and other eastern traditions certain hand positions are said to channel/activate certain energy pathways in the physical body.

perhaps someone can elaborate further on this.

peace,
doug

[Scukonaher]

i remember seeing a show about heavy metal where the so-called "sign of the devil" was discussed by ronnie james dio. according to this program mr. dio is given credit for popularizing this hand gesture in the music world. he stated the name for this sign, but i don't recall what he said. he stated it was something his italian grandmother taught him. she said it was a way to counter someone giving you the "evil eye".

i haven't researched this any further, and i myself am still undecided about its real significance. i know in yoga and other eastern traditions certain hand positions are said to channel/activate certain energy pathways in the physical body.

perhaps someone can elaborate further on this.

peace,
doug

for what it's worth:

gene simmons claimed to have first introduced the sign to heavy metal, when he was shown extending his little finger and index finger on the cover of kiss' 1977 album love gun, although his claim is disputed. on the other hand, gene simmons has, even before the love gun lp, shown this sign on stage or during photo sessions (for example japan, april 1977). the common cited examples however show simmons making the gesture with the thumb extended, which is rather a different gesture which means "i love you" and had been used well before this. gene claims he was inspired by 60's marvel comics, especially doctor strange and also spider-man who would extend his index and little finger whilst using his middle fingers to trigger his web shooters to shoot a line of webbing.

ronnie james dio in an interview for the movie "metal: a headbanger's journey" also disputed gene simmons' claims saying "...although gene simmons will tell you that he invented it but then again gene invented breathing and shoes and everything you know."

in heavy metal music, ronnie james dio also used this sign, and is known for popularizing its usage in heavy metal. his italian grandmother used it to ward off the evil eye (malocchio). dio began using the sign soon after joining (1979) the metal band black sabbath. the previous singer in the band, ozzy osbourne, was rather well known at using the "peace" sign at concerts, raising the index and middle finger in the form of a v. dio, in an attempt to connect with the fans, wanted to similarly use a hand gesture. however, not wanting to copy osbourne, he chose to use the sign his grandmother always made.

both accounts are predated by the chicago based psychedelic-goth band coven, led by singer jinx dawson who made the gesture on their 1969 album cover for "witchcraft destroys minds and reaps souls". incidentally, the band also wrote a song called "black sabbath," and one of the band members was named oz osborne, not to be confused with ozzy osbourne of black sabbath fame. the horns became famous in metal concerts very soon after black sabbath's first tour with dio.


metal fans displaying the sign at a festival.pre-dating either ronnie james dio, or gene simmons' use of the "devil's hand", on the cover of the beatles' 'yellow submarine' album (dec 1968, uk, jan 1969, usa), john lennon's right hand is making the sign above paul mccartney's head. for many fans, this was one of the many "paul is dead" clues.

also pre-dating dio and simmons, frank zappa was known to use the gesture (as can be seen on the dvd "baby snakes" filmed in 1977).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/corna

[eduptultyt]

nice breakdown, jim.

my instincts have long indicated that music only becomes negative once it comes under corporate control. we need only look as far as what a lifetime of corporate music has done to britney spears for evidence of this. by their fruits ye shall know them and all that hoohah.
:-)

rap, i think, is no more inherently negative or positive than the rest of it. but when you have a situation where money is being pumped into the image machine to popularize artists and songs whose message is (and quite a lot, but not all, of rap today seems to be running this message) "being poor, ignorant, and violent are good things and will make you popular," then i believe we are dealing with what is a very negative influence, and it often scares me that more people don't recognize it as such.

pop, and this is the main reason i couldn't stand the music in the late eighties and early nineties, is no less sinister in that all the songs revolve around second-chakra issues: love and relationships, desire, rejection, fulfillment and betrayal. it keeps listeners focused at a very low level of psycho-energetic development by consistently portraying what the svadhisthana chakra represents as the pinnacle of human interaction.

violent rap moves into third-chakra issues of externalized anger and control, though to tell you the truth, i don't which one is more destructive. at least rap, understood thus, represents energetic progress.

but i do like quite a lot of rap and r&b. you have to be ready to analyze, then pick and choose what you will let into your brain on a regular basis.

[fkisjjdhh]

simply put, evil is the mere negation of light. music that is put forth as a message to encourage negation of light(or the higher centers of being) is idol-worship...putting something in front of the supreme entity is a hindrance to spiritual awareness.but i too enjoy some of guns 'n' roses & an apparent offshoot of that band- velvet revolver.but the lyrics to me are only another instrumental part,as if they were saxophones or trumpets.exposure thereof does not make want to partake in any pagan rituals...(the only thing that impedes my born-again state is my own stupidity) -and if i want meaningful lyrics,there's always mr. bob dylan.

[Eujacwta]

rock and roll isn't evil it's just music. just like guns don't kill people people kill people. but then again people do drugs at concerts and we all know drugs are bad. trying to sound like the dude on southpark there but you get were i'm coming from. that is all individual choice and if listening to music makes you want to do drugs then you have other deeper issues so don't blame the music.

i too love rock some of my favorites are yes, symphony x, dream theater, cacophony, yngwie, rush, elp, genesis, kansas, deep purple, led zeppelin, pink floyd, scorpions, black sabbath, savatage, queen, andy timmons, al di meola, eric johnson, joe satriani, shawn lane, greg howe, gary moore i can go on forever. as a musician i love being onstage and playing music and creating that special moment it's better than any high a drug can give you.

there are plenty of socially responsible bands that offer up positive messages to people. i especially love the music of yes and the work of maestro's wakeman and howe. they take the responsibility of writting uplifting music that you can listen too all day and feel great and have a good attitude without a lot of anger and or doomy feelings to interfere with your vibe.

sure every artist goes through dark periods exploring the feelings they have but most of us grow up and get away from the darker stuff and start to write material that evolves into more than flated 5th's and diminished scales unless your yngwie that is but there is so much to be said within a composition and it can take people into realms of imagination and stimulate you to ponder worlds of escapist fantasy or make you wonder what the artist was feeling at the time they wrote it.

perhaps it's just an exploration of new scalar territory and a pretentious shred fest or it could be a deeply felt passion that an artist is trying to use to convey their feelings of love for someone special or a sadness for someone who has passed. whatever it is they are communicating it is something that is not evil that can touch us all and have a profound effect on how we feel. music should be used to excite and uplift and entertain us all at the same time.

i thank god that i have been blessed with the talent to play guitar and piano and the wonderful musicians that i have had the privilidge to play and record music with. it connects us to a family that we all can belong to.

[Scukonaher]

yngwie

my favorite guitarist!!!