[Meerenuch]

hi geron33,

i also spend a lot of time thinking on what it will mean for us to have increased awareness and how that will effect emotional state.

to me this is the most exciting aspect of the whole process. and i think you are right when you say that a change from space/time to time/space would definitely change our awareness as well.

the method i have found to help me in this regard is to try and make comparisons with the level of awareness that i have now with those things that are known to me. that is all that is available to us for now.

our minds can only operate in the “known” realm and that is why we can say that it is logical by design.

obviously we cannot imagine what it will be like because our memory does not contain information on 4d awareness. it is only possible for us to get an idea of how it will feel, but by no means a clear idea.

for instance try to imagine the difference between your level of awareness and that of an atom, or a much higher being as in an animal.

most animals have no self awareness. they do not have foresight and cannot fathom the vastness of expansion we have experienced from 2d to 3d.

look at all the things we have accomplished that an animal has no comprehension of, things like math, study of history, architecture, electronics, airplanes, cars, philosophy, relationships, and on and on and on.

the difference between the things we are aware of and those concepts that an animal can comprehend staggers the mind.

now when we consider how much we have progressed from 2d to 3d that is probably how much more awareness we will have in 4d.

or maybe even more. with this increased level of awareness will also come unimaginable abilities that today would be considered superhuman.

all the experience you have gained as an individual in your past lives will be revealed to you. who knows how vast this treasure chest of knowledge is.

this expansion will be experienced by all on earth that remain and will be used harmoniously to help each other instead of to dominate and control others.

at the time our abilities are fully developed people that today we consider geniuses, like albert einstein, will be considered equivalent to worse than a mentally retarded individual.

we will be capable of building societies that are one hundred times more harmonious than what we currently experience.

this will be mean advances in science and technology that we can only dream of today. it will also mean no crime, no need to fear each other; trust will be universal because all thoughts will be known.

and since it will be nothing like what we are currently experiencing we don’t need to ask irrelevant questions like “will i be able to go shopping?” or will i be able to take this or that along.

trust me when i say that we won’t even care about any of those kinds of things. they will be as relevant to you as a piece of dust on the carpet.

the orgasmic experience of love and joy that we will be experiencing at that time will know no want, only fulfillment and contentment.

a person in such a state of bliss does not worry about frivolous details. they are to busy being happy and helping others.

[Longwow]

friend eagleye paints a rather startling, dramatic/romantic concept of life in the fourth dimension...in fact, it is a rather extremely utopian view of the fourth dimension.

such may be unrealistic.

i would suggest that harvesting to the fourth is just one meaningful little step up, rather than one gigantic leap-frog jump to the top of a whole staircase worth of enlightenments. a harvesting to the fourth may mean nothing more than barely getting past the doorjam entrance -- certainly not springing open the door to a luxurious penthouse located top the spiritual skyscraper.

now i'm overdoing it

anyway, each of the discrete octaves that ra talks about are sub-divided into an infinity of graduated levels of great complexity. each individual picks the level they are comfortable with at a proper moment.

of course needed lessons will still continue.

it makes sense that we don't become super people right off the bat merely for signing up in basic octave 101.4. the basic point i'm trying to get across is that entering ox4 is not entering some absolute heaven of delight and bliss. (to whit, warfare does take place between negative and positive 4ths.)

a complexity not to be overlooked concerns the role of the inner 3-d-like astral planes ...which is where most of earth's population will shortly gravitate back to... but that is another subject for another time....

love, billybobbutterball...always striving to reach for elusive truths just beyond his feeble grasp, groan.

[Qeiafib]

you know, i'm thinking that both views hold merit - true, we enter in on the ground floor, and there are infinite gradations of sub (sub,sub,sub, etc.) densities, yet there is the concept of a giant leap to the next density, just as one platonic shape resists jumping into the next platonic shape throughout the little sub density increases, until the great metamorphosis at the critical threshold.

a dog may be a dog for a thousand lifetimes, steadily increasing in whatever way a dog does, until he reaches that critical threshold of awareness of self - at which time his next incarnation is a huge leap to humanity. that new human may still live with a pack mentality of kill or be killed, not having learned better, yet he is still a man - with fully human faculties of reason, intellect and vocalization skills. (or so i would surmise)

yet, i would not assume that 4d will be a place of no responsibilities, devoid of the necessity of committment, duty and discipline building. we may not have the same worries of being carpet bombed or indiscriminately beaten, terrorized, traumatized or tortured, but we will not be unchallenged, imo. we will have our vocational training, and have the 4d equivalent of hauling a$$ out of bed at 6:00 am every morning, and there will be much effort and challenge in further developing the 'mature' qualities we have begun to develop here.

i suspect that although our souls are in many respects unchanging, where we may notice a big change is in the new mind with which we interface with our 4d world. the mind is a tool, not our identity - although many new faculties of operation may be apparent, we still rest on the accumulated learning the true self/soul has earned thus far - although being out from under the veil of forgetting, we may have the untrammeled benefit of all our experience thus far.

we may find that a vastly new and improved mind awaits us, and it may take an age or two to figure out how to operate it to any where near its full capacity of ability!

mark, wishing for a new lear jet to replace his tired old pontiac.

[Unrersvar]

i don't have the answer, but i really want to know!
it doesn't seem fair that our amazing friends should be left out in the cold.

so the people that really dont see this coming will be in for a mighty shock?

[Meerenuch]

hi,

billybobbutterball my comments were describing only “true color” 4d for those that make the choice to be there.

the question most people ask is, “will it be a “gradual” change or a “quantum leap?”

lucky for us there is no need to guess at the matter because ra was unmistakably clear on what we can expect.

david said it better than i ever could in one of his articles. this was written in response to a forum post on this very issue. here is the link:

http://divinecosmos.com/index.php?op...=332&itemid=30

in it he proved with undeniable evidence from the law of one that shows it will be a sudden dramatic leap that which will leave anyone experiencing it awestruck and ecstatic.

this will be a truly joyous occasion and will result in major changes in our awareness and abilities. how long it will take us to fully develop these abilities and come to a full level of the green ray activation is another matter entirely.

my comments were describing not only the beginning of 4th density life but the entire period. obviously most of the abilities we will be capable of will need to be developed and some will come faster than others.

even today though many of us display what would be considered by some to be superhuman abilities.

the title of this thread was not entitled “living in the beginning of 4th density” so i did not see any need to confine my words to just that period.

regardless of how long it takes us to develop our abilities, the sudden switch in density will result in a complete transformation of even our entire body. ra called it a light body.

i liked markm’s description of the dog. it summed it up perfectly showing how the “leap” from 2nd to 3rd produced dramatic physical and mental changes for the animal.

i don’t see why we would expect the change to forth to be any less pronounced.

also another question many wonder about concerns the problems we currently experience which rob us of our joy. will these same problems exist in the next density?

ra made a statement saying that 4th density will be 100 times more harmonious than what we currently experience.
many others have quoted from this but has anyone really sat down and thought about what this will mean?

that one statement reveals some major changes that are going to take place.

i can’t think of one problem that we currently experience in our society that does not come from disharmony of some kind or another.

crime in its various forms comes from inequality. weather it is distribution of wealth, lack of opportunity, or even abuse and family problems. all of these problems come from inequality = disharmony.

depression is disharmony of the mind. arguments come from disharmony between individuals. poverty is disharmony in the distribution of wealth.

you could write a book about this but it is very easy to see the point with just a few examples.

when you eliminate the sources of disharmony you restore those things that bring joy and contentment. it is cause and effect. i don’t see how anyone can question that.

can hard work be a source of joy and contentment? of course it can. many people automatically assume that work = boring slavery.

this is only the case if you are forced to do something you do not want to do just to survive or to get rich. the scenario comes from the disharmony we currently experience.

once that is removed you are free to pursue meaningful satisfying occupations. no one will force you or enslave you.

you will be truly free to explore your hearts desire without the constraints of a money system.

when i said we would experience fulfillment and contentment i meant this would come from the satisfying work we do and the lack of problems that come from disharmony, not from sitting around all day doing nothing like you’re high on drugs and can’t move.

our work will be that of assisting and supporting one another in love. the feeling of love from the green ray chakra is a most joyous one. through this work we will learn the lessons we need to learn for that vibration.

why we should assume that learning a lesson needs to be compared to a lack of joy.

why do we need to assume that challenging demanding work is a burden that is done grudgingly and without joy? i don’t think this is the case.

for anyone that has done work that they love, the challenge is something to look forward to and it brings great satisfaction and a feeling of accomplishment. i can tell you from personal experience that this is true.

[Longwow]

lame apology

eagleye has a point in that i missed the point of his essay. occasionally i do such seemingly dumb things merely to test my spiritual growth level by measuring my ego's pain level from the resulting humiliation. i apologize to eagleye for using him in such an underhanded and deviate manner....may those reading this please take warning and think twice before falling into the same trap.

that's my ego story and i'm sticking to it!

let me try again!

i've been worried about questions raised concerning harvesting and ascension. too often there seems to be a twinge of confusion that leans toward something much like the christian doctrine of the rapture...where the helpless, but faithful believer is divinely hoisted out of the sinful world and taken bodily to a heavenly abode overflowing with delightful distractions.

however, it doesn't work that way -- no outside force is going to do the job for you... ascension is a product of each individual's personal responsibility.

here is one view of it:

"the graduation to fourth density does not automatically create any improvement whatsoever in the evolutionary status of the soul. just as a person who has graduated from third grade goes to school the first day for fourth grade knowing nothing more than he knew at the end of third grade, so the beginning student of fourth density has only the harvest of third-density knowledge, awareness and insight as he approaches the lessons of fourth density." ...on top of that you have to take the school bus all by yourself.

in the 4th, channels are opened up...a fourth-level individual has available past life experiences, and can also access dimensional realities up to the 7th or 8th. but the choice most often made is to voluntarily block most of the inflow of information in order that the individual can concentrate on perceived jobs at hand.

on the downside is the earth's astral planes adding to the confusion and distraction in that there are on-going, third-dimensional-like battles between negative and positive loyalists.....a unique situation singular to earth. there is no draft, but young patriots do get sucked in.

a story that sticks with me is the question poised to the ra about the 4th negative, inquiring about those of earth who made the cut. this gets me: the great genkis kahn, feared, ruthless, mongolian conqueror of most of the world -- some thousand or so years ago -- was recruited into the orion 4th... his job? genkis is a shipping clerk who oversees supplying needed items for the negative orion empire crusaders. now if the infamous genkis is at that point on the totem poll just who in the heck is on the top? scary.

as for myself i'm not all that thrilled by the scope of the fourth, i prefer to look waaaay forward to the 5th.... where we find a balance of love/knowledge. heck, in the fourth, some individuals get so darn pre-occupied and busy pursuing loving-others-missions they forget to take in nourishment; they have to be forcibly sat down and fed by more grounded souls ...those having their heads screwed on straight.

okay... i'm just rambling on and getting nowhere. i think the real reason i'm writing this is that it well serves as my 200th posting on this 'new' site!

hurray! i made it!...

love, etc. bill gieskieng aka bbbb

[Fertassa]

not so fast folks. whats the big hurry? stop and kick your shoes off, relax. have a cocktail. or 2... it's nice and dark in the basement.... ....

it'll be here before ya know it... :-)

[Fertassa]

can anyone go into more details on the 4d negative/positive. differences, whom would go negative and whom would go positive? is there a seperatness!

just relax and be yourself. you can't push these things, and ya can't fake it, so just enjoy the moment called the present. it's all we really ever have. oh and try not to hurt anybody. that'll do ya fine.

it'll be here as soon as the mods grant permission, not a centron before!

[PeterPatrickJohn]

hmm...well, you tend to associate yourself with people of like-mindedness.
"those who, finishing a cycle of experience, demonstrate grades of distortion of that understanding of thought and action will be separated by their own choice into the vibratory distortion most comfortable to their mind/body/spirit complexes. this process is guarded or watched by those nurturing beings who, being very close to the law of one in their distortions, nevertheless, move towards active service."
so there could be several shifts that would "group" certain people together for different experiences. i think 2012 will be an area when the earth will become pretty polarized, with the "old guard" (hidden nwo) and the "new guard" (overt nwo cast in a false-spirituality) standing in an orchestrated juxtaposition to eachother. throw in some alien interference and you've got yourself a party

but the nature of the transition means that change happens extremely quickly. spiritual evolution and the capability to really become "custodians of power" will be enormous, and the positive, negative balance could remain stable (this is just a guess/hypothesis) by individuals becoming more positive to offset a negative environment. once people begin to realize that they're "setting the tone" of their reality/experiences via their emotional state will lead them into accessing hyper-dimensional energies and realities. i see that being more of the blastoff point as completely divergent hyper-d energies (sto/sts) begin infusing the graduates depending on their essences.

2012 will be kind of like the "energetic buffet" where all kinds of "food"/experiences/lessons will be available. you could fill your plate with piles and piles of food or go give some to the hobo outside... the choices will become pretty pronounced and through how you navigate and feel about them, will "lock" you into a resonant timeline.
i see this happening over an extended period.

i'll share this dream i had on another occassion but 2032 seems to be the culmination of these hyper-dimensional shiftings that really start to become apparent in 2012. the 2012 destruction/ascension dichotomy doesn't seem to apply to the timeline we're in now...that we made a positive deviation from that timeline. we've been given a larger and hence, more gradual and less cataclysmic, window of opportunity to blend with the earth's 4d energies.

we'll just have to see. 4d will probably seem vaguely familiar and really "cool"...like a super intricate, sophisticated, and surealistic lucid dream but shared in a mutual reality with those you really "vibrate" with it'll be a pretty awesome environment :d

[joe-salton]

i think we have 3d experience as ra said we will review our previous lives. about more data. do you believe your brain can take it?

[EbrsaRynleot]

when we convert to 4th density, do we still have a memory or the memory of 3th density?

is there a time/moment that we can remember our 2nd and 1st density experiences? or maybe see the whole universe forming and the entire creation of earth and its beings?

cheers

i'm not sure about that but i believe i was once in a wolf body, because i really feel connected to them when i see them, think about them, or dream about them. and i can actually describe myself in wolves.

it's nothing i can really remember but it's more an intuition and a feeling i have. and based on my love to them too, i think i was once with them.

[remember that since this is the loo thread, answers from the books should be offered here ]

[Flieteewell]

i am well aware of infinity. and when i say well-aware i mean that i truly understand that i cannot die, i cannot stop to exist. i am me, and i will always be me. then who is this me? me is what i call information, a name, a place where i was born and etc. i am not human, im just a collection of information, a divine matrix living in this time right here right know sharing this wonderful world via my 5 external senses in a human body following different laws from the micro to the makro.

if my brain could handle levitation and similiar i would have been able to do that. but from my brains logical view i don't know how it is possible. altough in my dreams i can do it without any problem and its an amazing feeling to fly and teleport to different areas.

with that said, we all know what a weekday here is like, and its not the same for all of us - we all live different lifes.. but what will a day be like in the 4th density? i have been contemplating this alot and i feel that this place right now is not somewhere we want to be, but its necessary for us to learn and foremost become what we are i.e. form a personality.

for me the life in 4th density will still mean that i will dream (sleep) and i can choice do study the universe, or have fun, and do various recreational things. we will also have a science that is truly amazing with time travel, and be able to simulate universes (with ourselves withtin).

the whole universe is a giant construction of code stemming from 1 and 0. its not really possible to describe with human language, but there is no end nor no beginning to anything - all is eternal.

one great insight i got was that the infinte creator was alone and wanted company, hence we all got created within' a universal divine matrix. and i find it very fascinating to understand this one infinte creator that accepts all and is all (have all information).

we have just started our journey towards the goal of the one infinte creator, but it doens't mean that we have to study, study and study, life is a beautiful gift and it comes with great joy and great love.

to fully be able to live within' eternity and in close connection to your higher-self and the infinite mind we need to truly understand love and truly accept all, even the most evil minded entites that exist. so dividing the postive from the negative is a very good thing so the negative can continue its ways of manipulation and the positive can live in peace. but the negative way must become full of love sooner or later, since the singular mind cannot hate itself. especially since its eternal and exist outside of time and space. we will have time and space in 4th density aswell, and it will be divided in spacetime and timespace because its necessary within' the duality.

i've tried to find a better answer, but to me the place we live and exist in now -this moment - is the perfect moment and the best of best worlds. we live on a planet with great diversity, and many choices to choose from and many ways to evolve and grow. for me diversity and manyness is a good thing, since from all this we keep the eternity growing and there are no end to what we can do. still from the perspective of the one infinite mind all has been done. and as the one infinite mind we can't really be aware of a world like this, cause we live in duality. we have a conscious and a sub-consious and the sub-conscious is closer to the infinity/our higher self, and from our effort we can connect to this and it can help us, much like david has connected to his higher self: ra.

since the creation we live in is very complex with infinte dimensions and infinite parallell universes everything is quite complex to understand from our current view and alot of ideas/philosphies are right. but we must also know that anything we think, say, do or fantasize about is reality somewhere. everything is information and everything is created. so all ideas are correct in a sense, but still the most logical and simple way will always be the best one, like ra's view of the 8th densities. which are mathematically beautiful, simple and what we see is a world of harmony based on mathematics.

we are aware now because we are about to create something extraordinary and live our lifes beyond our wildest dreams. and it all will follow the laws of free will and love.

the external life we have is based on logic and what's most likely. for me its not (yet) likely that i can levitate, but if i did put my mind to it and meditated for alot of years, then i could be able to do it. but why meditate when 2012 comes and takes me to a better planet full of love, peace, joy, harmony and positive understanding minds (human beings).

so, my days in the 4th density is similiar to the days here but with alot more harmony and joy. i will be able to create, experience and do things beyond imagination and all will be based on logic and the principles of the universe.

to finish, think about eternity. and think about what you would do. you would be you. you are the perfect being. you need to eat in the 4th density because of patience. we need to know patience since a mind of patience is needed when all can be experienced because of eternity. all is perfect, and all is based on free will so we can create the many individuals that we are!

please tell me a little about how you think you will experience the 4th density (and maybe beyond) based on what i've just said. we should never forget that we are all one, hence all people around you from rock stars to homeless are a different experience of yourself. when we live in 4th density we will be able to jump into different experiences most likely through movies, video games and the like, maybe also dreams.

which reminds me of a comedy dream i had this night, it reminded alot about a movie and i was acting it through the body of a different person.

what do we prefer in eternity? i would like to say that's its joy, love and understanding and the sharing of experiences.

- enivid