[Ferrotoral]

i just have this feeling that most of the people in this forum are ignoring the scope of christianity on this planet. you know all those buildings called churches that mushroom our landscape? they exist for a reason. people needing and loving one another. which is the core belief of being a christian. well you know worldwide we have a very large group of people called 'christians' myself included who believe that jesus christ loves us and we love him. i was raised as a christian i don't, nor won't claim to have all the answers. was the person called jesus really that special? anyone please?

[moderator takes this chance to remind everyone to familiarize themselves with forum rules which outline our forum's purpose, located in the announcements section]

[Anakattawl]

hello to all,

im having issues with something and i feel the need to be open about it. please, no one take offense. one problem i have with the law of one is that it stated that the life of jesus was unimportant.

i feel this is denying our nature. i feel jesus was the first to ascend to the highest level of vibration to the father/mother. i feel jesus made atonement and opened the door for the souls that are finally reaching this vibration. its all about the evolution of our souls.

i asked my inner self, higher self, why i have never seen a ufo-the response was because they are deceptions and that i am protected from this deception infer fearing with my soul.

so, to those who are waiting on a trip out of here on a spacecraft, i ask you to consider this. our change will be a 'thrust in a flash of time'. what would you do if a soul group that called themselves ra showed up with a spacecraft and told you they were here to take you to your safe haven from the wrath of earths sol? would you go?

jesus is important! he is a brother to you and to i. he came to show us how to raise our vibration to purify the soul to become holy to join the holy kingdom. its where your soul comes from, its where your soul needs to return. we are not gods....we are a fragment of the god. be careful with the ego thing. we are sons and daughters of god and we are loved more then what we can comprehend. sure, we are of the stars, of the sun, of the earth, of the everything....it takes all of those things to make us.

is worrying about a deceiver wrong because it might bring fear? it will only bring fear if you feel you are not grounded with who created you. otherwise, you are protected.

i am going to finish school and get ordained. i am going to offer a gathering place for faith and spiritual growth. if we are all here after 2012....ide like to invite you all:d

my soul is yet growing again...its affecting me in the same ways it did when i came to this site. i feel the next 3 and half years are going to be full of opportunities to grow and raise vibrations, a time of blossoming with in the soul. then comes a tough time. mabey, some will receive the thrust into the next, mabey some will ride out with the ufos, mabey some will stay here to start anew age. would placing a bet on it be wrong?

ok, so no bets, but i feel strongly about this. i feel everyone should be careful. the door is open, not just for the ones who aid us, but for the ones who want to deceive. all a deceiver needs is just one little tid bit to make you stray from your nature.

just my thoughts,
peace to all,
lynette

[LarryG1978]

hi lynette, the reason tha ra stated this is because "jesus" himself would not want to be adorned per say he would much rather have us concentrate on the message than the messenger. also the fact that he was one of many who tried and just happen to be the one who was at the right place at the right time. instead of refering to his life personaly, maybe we should study the christ consciousness aspect of the whole story and leave the individual in peace, so he can finaly breath a little, see what i mean. christ consciousness is a mode of being, seing, living, loving ect...... and can be studied in great depth without personalising it "jesus" or even worse give it a father figure " a god that is out there " i'm pretty sure that the true story of enlightement never puts god outside of us, that is the ego thing, diminishing ourselves, looking for a father or mother figure to complete us. that is something most people have a hard time with, the ego is expressed when we put ourselves above another but the same thing goes the other way around, that is the root of religion, the feeling of being less than or diminished by a superior father or mother figure is just as much ego than anything else. so i would also say be carefull and to try and recognise when we diminish ourselves.........................sylvain......... .................

[beloveds]

im having issues with something and i feel the need to be open about it. please, no one take offense. one problem i have with the law of one is that it stated that the life of jesus was unimportant.

can you point me to where it says that?

my sense is that ra treats jesus with the utmost respect. here's an example:
questioner: the instrument asked the following question: ra has implied that the instrument is on the path of martyrdom, but since we all die are we not all martyred to something, and when, if ever, does martyrdom partake of wisdom?

ra: i am ra. this is a thoughtful query. let us use as exemplar the one known as jehoshua. this entity incarnated with the plan of martyrdom. there is no wisdom in this plan but rather understanding and compassion extended to its fullest perfection. the one known as jehoshua would have been less than fully understanding of its course had it chosen to follow its will at any space/time during its teachings. several times, as you call this measure, this entity had the possibility of moving towards the martyr’s place which was, for that martyr, jerusalem. yet in meditation this entity stated, time and again, “it is not yet the hour”. the entity could also have, when the hour came, walked another path. its incarnation would then have been prolonged but the path for which it incarnated somewhat confused. thusly, one may observe the greatest amount of understanding, of which this entity was indeed capable, taking place as the entity in meditation felt and knew that the hour had come for that to be fulfilled which was its incarnation. more from ra on jesus/jehoshua at
http://www.lawofone.info/results.php...t_row=60#jesus

[yharmon6614]

i swear that i had a dream where i saw jesus or an ascended master type guy...the overwhelming feeling of acceptance, of my entire self, bad, good, etc, was the most liberating experience in my life. as he held me in his arms, the sheer love of him just made me melt in tears. whether it was jesus or not, that experience has given me the faith to now that such things are possible for everyone to achieve. i've glimpsed the feeling emanating from myself, but afterall, nobody is perfect.
i've also remembered the feeling and imagery of that occasion on times when i felt like i was coming under attack, from 3ders and hyperdimensional dudes. this is not to say that one shouldn't work on inner-knowing and sensing to avoid such confrontations, but it's a given we'll get in over our heads in the early phases. that's expected, and there's alot of beings out there that will assist those who require it, particularly when a polarity-direction is chosen as you start "getting down to business"
"just remember this feeling, whatever happens."

[MightyMasd]

one problem i have with the law of one is that it stated that the life of jesus was unimportant.

i, too would love to hear where it says that, because i do not remember any such statement.

i feel jesus was the first to ascend to the highest level of vibration to the father/mother.

ok, litllady, please indulge me for a moment, and read the following story.

what would you do if a soul group that called themselves ra showed up with a spacecraft and told you they were here to take you to your safe haven from the wrath of earths sol? would you go?

heck no! i would run away as fast as i could!

we are not gods....we are a fragment of the god.

both the old (psalms 82)and the new testament say "you are gods!" (john 10:34)

[kilibry]

i'm litllady, but i've been through the ra material and i haven't seen the part where they say that the life of jesus is unimportant. the material refrains from making jesus into an authority figure, which is what most of us are used to, speaking the name of jesus only reverently and solemnly, and balking at any suggestion that he may have been as human as the rest of us, however perfect a human he was.

could it be that the material simply isn't treating him with the borderline-fearful reverence that you are used to, and that you are simply interpreting this as saying that he was unimportant?

[Anakattawl]

i went back and found what i read, i should of done this before i posted. a little misunderstanding, but still i needed better clarifying, and silvanus, once again, thank you for your clarity....

17.21 questioner: what density is the entity known as jesus in now?

ra: i am ra. this information is harmless though unimportant. this entity studies now the lessons of the wisdom vibration, the fifth-density, also called the light vibration.

ok, so i guess this states that the density that jesus is in is unimportant, not jesus himself. sorry for my abrupt pst....

but how can we be so full of ourselves to think we dont need god....we are nothing without god/logos. are you saying we would still be if god isnt outside as well as within? im really trying to fit things together so they jive with my spirit. if we all just disappeared today, god would still be. where did souls come from? i feel i do have a creator, i feel the creator in me, but also bigger then me. not because what the bible says, or religion. i feel it, it has brought me to my knees before. and, as much as some dont want to think about it, there are rules, rules to live in the flesh so the soul can be changed, evolved, transfused, whatever....

jesus was not full of himself, so very true, and man has warped exactly what jesus did not want them to. i need to stop reading materials, because they just confuse me. silvanus, again, ty, you have always responded with words of wisdom that just make sense. anytime you would like to answer my curiosities, i invite you for tea my friend....

i would like some thoughts on what i felt come to me about these ufos. i feel i am being warned. i feel im being prepared to face something huge...i will continue to follow my feelings, but has anyone not thought about this? surely there are some here who do....

peace to all,
lynette

[Ferrotoral]

what do you mean by 'christ consciousness'? is that like being 'born again'? anyone please answer this?

[Anakattawl]

hi to all,

starwhite, i might not have the same answer as everyone here (actually, most likely mine is the odd ball answer), but ill let you know where i come from in my thoughts since you, a christian, find yourself here at divine cosmos. it can be a odd place for anyone with a pre-impacted belief of any religion.

i have always felt that there was truth in jesus and the oneness of the father of everything that is. the bible gives little justice to the idea about our thoughts being the true infinity of our selves, but yet, before we were what we are, according to the bible, we were a thought of god. so, we have the idea of this-we are all a part of a consiousness of god, before/presently/and in the future. christ to me is a title, a duty that god works through a particular stream of the thought, which materializes into the flesh of the body of jesus. when we meditate on jesus and his life and when we can feel that buckling of our knees to imagine dying for other people, we are humbled at jesus' works and deeds and we are actually opening ourselves to the christ consiousness, the stream of a path to god, the father of all. i have had some amazing experiences when meditating on the deeds of jesus and when i read the term 'christ consciousness' it just felt right to me to help describe to myself where and how the power of the overwhelming feelings and emotions rolled a pone me in that moment.

now, let me say, there are many who do agree with me on this here. so what am i doing here? i still feel there is much understanding to gain here in david wilcocks work to gain the deeper knowledge of how thoughts our the eternal godhead of all if you will. this is probally confussing you all the more on the matter and if it is then just disregard me.

i am a believer that jesus is a path to understanding knowledge of the power we posess within us, which is god theeself. some here say 'we are gods' i choose to say, we are a part of thee god. but, generally, i go where people believe in doing for others and setting examples of how to live in love and peace and positive examples. there is knowledge to gain in many paths. sometimes we walk away with a mixed cocktail because it resonates with us for what ever reason. i do not claim myself as christian because i dont believe the bible is correctly translated and i feel that the old testament and new testament conflict each other too much. yes, there is great history in the bible, and there is truth if you can read between the lines.

you can google christ consciousness and you'll get a variety of ideas that generalize with the same characteristics.

now, with that being said about my ideas, there is the ra material on here that you can read which gives more of a understanding of the united consciousness. this is a bases for the research of david wilcock, but i see many christians who dont dwell too far into this material. is it because they cant brake away from the ideas of the bible? possibly. or is it because it doesn't feel right to them? still possibly. but the ra material will say that is what is stated doesn't resonate with you to not worry yourself with it (or something like that)-you might find deeper understanding in some parts of it and you might find that it is too much for you. whatever brings you peace in your belief is to me the path you should be on. if your mind is asking questions or arising doubts in any pre-impacted beliefs, you might decide to not ignore this feelings or inner voice and you might decide to explore your curiosities.

some here might say that this thread is totally irrelevant here because the idea of davids research mostly focus's on the idea that we dont need a savior to ascend after this life. im not sure how i feel on that...so i stay in between on the matter. i follow the path through christ and it works for me. am i limiting myself to bigger and better things after i ascend? possibly...but i dont feel it is that important to think we are gods that are going to go on and create whatever we want. i feel there is a natural law of the one and that we should be careful in stating rules that we dont know much about through history.

i am a soul of light-of love, a part of the one.

could some of the more knowledgeable ones on the ra material help explain the christ consciousness?

peace to you starwhite,
lynette

[Anakattawl]

starwhite,

ide like to point out something to you about those 'churches' you mention. you dont need a church to be with god. the most sincere times with the most high is all by myself with no others around me. to me, this is a relationship with god that lets god see you are not seeking him to be glorified by others, you are seeking him to be glorified by thee most high. this is the deeper understanding of how to find that path of god within you. i have always had trouble with people labeling faith and saying 'our way is the only way'. in fact, jesus claims these words....the way. its that simple, its a way, a path...not a label. i also believe that both roads...good and evil, have their rightful place. both are paths that have a purpose to thee most high. christians like to label the more evil path as sinners. but how would god be able to determine good without bad? they both serve a purpose to god.

to each their own, for every path is different but they all lead to one in the end.

[Anakattawl]

hi all!

many more wise thoughts from everyone! mark and ewhaz, i think you both made excellent points....

so we see that for thousands of yrs. particular souls have came here that seem to have a deeper knowledge on how to achieve enlightenment or how to provide your soul growth here. jesus is the most recent one to come to us and so many can relate to him, through the consciousness of christ, if you will. so can it be like this....all of these souls, even though there is one consciousness, they have created their own fragment of their selves that connects to this consciousness....by dwelling on their lives, how the lived, what they did, you or we can learn from their lives, actually tap into their thoughts and feelings, so to dwell in the buddha mind or the christ mind can provide growth and lessons, but yet there is still a deeper connection for those who need the more...and its our own consciousness connection to the one.

when jesus says that through him we can be saved, i see this as one of the paths. here is why....a woman or man of good faith, good intentions, good morals and values, trying to always do right, still can die without any savior and still have growth in their vibration. we do have everything we need to grow in vibration without anyone saving us, but, the path of growth through another souls experience is a path that can provide growth as well. so is jesus important? yes, for there are many souls that need this example, they dont feel they have within them all by themselves, what is needed to grow in their soul....so they come to buddha, or christ, and follow the example given, learn through the trials of that individual, and humble themselves through what that person did as a whole for humanity. it is defiantly a path that can provide growth....but some find, after that level of growth, they are ready for the more....and many here at this forum are a part of that more. i dont find it ironic at all, that we are on the cusp between ages, and souls are ready for the more.

there are many paths for growth, and me personally, i keep these souls like jesus, close to me in my living, because they are reminders to me daily, that the purpose of us is bigger then what i can imagine. i grew alot with jesus, his life actually humbled my life in many many ways. i also feel that it is possible, that jesus knew he was at the level of growth where he was going to have his own kingdom in the logos, and he invites everyone and anyone who would like to be a part of it, it like joining a family. or mabey some are predestined to be a part of that family, because some are fragments of that particular soul group.

im starting to ramble and not make sense, ill stop there

peace to all,
lynette

[esconsise]

interesting information from dw's latest blog post.

the following information is applicable to the topic of this thread.

from page 32 of "secrets of the saucers"

"we know your mind is filled with questions. one question in particular troubles you and it concerns the entity the world knows as jesus christ. may we set your mind at rest. in allegorical language christ is indeed the son of god. the star that burned over bethlehem is a cosmic fact. it announced the birth on your planet of an entity not of earth's evolution. he is lord of the flame--an infinite entity of the sun. out of compassion for mankind's suffering he became flesh and blood and entered the hell of ignorance, woe and evil. as the sun spirit who sacrificed himself for the children of woe he has become a part of the oversoul of mankind and the world spirit. in this he differs from all other world teachers."

peace,
(:-deeze

[LarryG1978]

hi djdeeze, i felt compelled to post the very next 2 paragraphs in that book.

"each person upon earth has a spiritual, or unknown, self which transcends the material world and consciousness and dwells eternally out of the time dimension in spiritual perfection within the unity of the oversoul.

"in the illusion of time is written man's choice through free will whereby he set in motion the cause of error which inevitably resulted in effect, in which mankind entered mortal consciousness or the living death of his present existence. thus was he separated from his eternal and perfect self. his one purpose upon earth now is to attain reunion with his immortal consciousness. when this is accomplished he is resurrected from the kingdom of death and becomes his real immortal self made in the image and likeness of god. your teacher has told you, god is love, and in these simple words may be found the secrets of all the mysteries of earth and the worlds beyond.".....................sylvain.....................

[GohJHM9k]

dear deeze and everyone,
in "christ jesus" thread i'd shared a link to the work of australian anthroposophist adriana koulias (appears no longer functional). i did secure another link (please pm) for her many articles, of which this is taken from.
it will provide a greater backdrop for consideration of christian themes. (also related to the other thread started by theodorepong "blood of jesus christ").
short excerpts here only, which will not be fully understood unless you see the entire article - nina

title "the grail-stream and the anti-grail stream:
"the task of the anti-grail stream is:
1. to prevent consciousness of the need for perfecting various bodily sheaths or redeeming the results of the fall, in preparation for a communion with christ - microcosm.
2. to prevent consciousness of the need to perfect the various bodily sheaths of the human being in order to thereby redeem nature and spiritual beings in preparation for its communion with christ - macrocosm.
the anti grail brotherhood and the four anti grail streams
the anti grail stream has four human initiates that guide it who belong to an anti grail brotherhood. these initiates are well hidden. we only see their ‘pawns’ in the world arena today...

western brotherhoods of the left
work against the experience of christ in the etheric body as a healing force -shadow of the loving offertory - hateful withdrawal from spirit.
from the west come the brotherhoods of the left - the freemasons - at least some factions of them, c.f.r (central foreign relations)., round table, the cecil rhodes scholarships, the order of skull and bones, and their associated political and economic instruments - who seek to unite as many human beings as possible in an ‘unconscious’ way with the material life so that in the life between death and rebirth the etheric bodies of those souls does not dissipate but remains surrounding the earth and can be used as instruments for these powerful groups. these etheric bodies become the vehicle by which the anti christ can replace the being of the etheric christ. these western brotherhoods work particularly in the economic life because this is an excellent way of binding humanity to matter....

eastern lodges – brotherhoods of the right – religious fundamentalism, islamic groups/ bolshevism.
work against the experience of christ in the astral body
the shadow of creed – doubt in the spirit
the eastern lodges exploit the forces that come from the region of sagittarius. the forces of sagittarius or archer are the forces of duality the ordinary ego the ego bound to the material body or matter and the higher ego. the human being is depicted mounted on an astral beast. these are the midnight processes. they encourage practises that are unsuitable for modern human beings, practises that use the ‘astral beast’ the retarded sentient soul which will unleash tumultuous human emotions, terrible astral forces of destruction. terrorism is only the tip of the iceberg. conditions are also prepared whereby that aspect of the thinking that is related to the astral body in the intellectual soul affects the etheric body to enable it to become like an empty shell after death so that it can be utilised by the double. this is not an immortality experienced by initiated human beings as in the case of those experienced by members of the western brotherhoods but it is an immortality experienced by the double who should leave the human body at death. scores of human doubles remain attached to the earth in these etheric shells in particular near those areas where these luciferic initiations take place. together they will form a physical etheric and astral body, for the subsuprahuman double into which the ego of ahriman can incarnate in order to avert attention from the etheric christ....
certain areas are known for certain etheric forces. some have especially strong energies due to the geography of the landscape i.e.; proximity to the fault lines or to granites that have been thrust from out of the depths of the earth.
rudolf steiner tells us that america is the location of old atlantis. in american soil is preserved the retarded forces that brought the destruction of atlantis and is especially connected to the forces of the double.
australia once lemuria, has within its soil a preserved memory of the retarded forces that destroyed the lemurian civilization and are especially connected to the forces of the double.
rudolf steiner tells us that these forces are especially related to the human will and so are pacified by a self-less will striving to do good “…when human will is devoid of egoism it is able to appease this fire”
wherever human beings however live a selfish materialistic life this works right down into the earthly ethers and into the ether that surrounds the earth, volcanoes, violent storms and other terrible natural catastrophes are the result.
the anti grail streams utilise the knowledge concerning these fallen ethers and their influence on man and visa versa in order to execute their plan to prevent the down pouring of the consciousness of christ into the individual in order that he or she can at the same time redeem the fallen forces of the earth.
these anti grail impulses were disseminated in the past from centres such as gondi shapur in persia home of harum al rashid and terra labur home of klingsor.
in modern times there are many centres from which comes the work of the brotherhoods of the left or the western brotherhoods and the brotherhoods of the south catholicism, jesuitism and opus dei one such place is rennes le chateau.
rennes le chateau is a small village of less than a hundred people. it came to the attention of the world through a book written by gerard de sede which explored the story of the abbe berenger sauniere, the town priest who despite earning very little was able to spend thousands renovating the town church, building a guest house he called villa bethany and a tour he named after mary magdalene which he called tour magdala. through mary magdalene we have the connection with the chemical ether.
he is said to have tampered with the church in the renovations, placing an altar upside down, reversing known religious symbols such as the alpha and omega that usually belong to christ and john the baptist. templar symbols as well as hermetic symbols abound as well as a water stoup held up by rex mundus the king of the earth – ahriman. there is in fact a striking resemblance between this ahriman and rudolf steiner’s ahriman. the villa bethany – bethany being where lazarus was raised is where his housekeeper found the abbe dying of a stroke, despite the fact that this was only his guest’s quarters and he lived in the priori. also two days before his death he had been in good health, despite this, his servant ordered a coffin to be delivered two days later, the very day that he became ill. he is said to have been involved with a neo templar group that called itself the priori de sion. the priori de sion is only the outer face of the western brotherhoods that, in conjunction with the jesuit order of opus dei, managed to infiltrate anti christian impulses into the world. it also points to the conscious etheric immortality which we discussed earlier, in which the etheric body does not dissipate but hardens and materialises, effectively imprisoning the human being in the earth’s surrounds. this points to the great anti grail mystery of incarnating and excarnating at will through the thirteenth zodiac ophiucus or serpent handler
the story of this abbe was picked up by three journalists who produced a small television series that sparked off a book which explores the connection that existed between the abbe berenger sauniere and the priori de sion and its connections with the templars, cathars, the merovingian dynasty and the supposed blood line of the grail. concluding that the grail was nothing more than a pedigree that could be traced back to christ’s survival of the crucifixion and his subsequent marriage to mary magdalene, a blood-line which continued through the merovingian kings of france and later the royal houses of europe.
this may seem laughable, and far-fetched but it has left an indelible mark on the world today, inspired by the jesuits who seek to turn christ into jesus and the western brotherhoods who seek to undermine the manifestation of the etheric christ.
this small village went on to spawn numerous books that explored this same theme.
there are people who have read these books and have been known to become atheists because of them. certainly it completely pushes aside the mystery of golgotha and replaces the divinity of christ with a human jesus that did not die on the cross. it is interesting to note that of late the hoax perpetrated on the public by the false documents which started everything the documents of the priori de sion has now been discovered and the connection between this ‘made up’ order and the jesuits as well as opus dei have been revealed.
we see how the anti grail streams of the west and south work from this centre inspiring books that promote doubt and hatred of the mystery of golgotha while at the same time the world is brought to a condition where it is racked by war, and terror that promotes fear by the initiates of the anti grail stream of the east and west."

she has another article on "the double" available here:
www.eleggua.com/spirit/the%20double.htm
this is terrific in its educational value, from her intro paragraph:
"human beings have always had a presentiment that they carry within themselves another being. myths and legends tell of the monster that must be conquered if the human being is to progress. the persian saw him as the hairy rough living enkindu companion of gilgamesh, the greeks saw him as the minotaur that had to be overcome by theseus, the grimm brothers portray him as rumplestiltskin the clever little man that eventually drives his leg into the earth and tears himself in two when the girl solves the riddle of his name. once again this being was portrayed by hermann hess in his book stepenwolf and by dostoyevsky in his poem ‘the double’. the enigmatic creature that feeds off the blood of human beings could even be the vampire of old legends. a parasite that hates the light of day and only lives in darkness. the werewolf is another example as is the tale of frankenstein. most recently we see him in the creature gollum of the lord of the rings."

[GohJHM9k]

hello! found new workable link for info shared in last post with excerpts about grail streams by adriana koulias.

http://anthroposophy.org.au
this is an excerpt from her article "faith, hope and love as a counterforce to evil"(shared previously in christ jesus thread,that link no longer works):

"part i: the mystery of evil: doubt, hate and fear. the double and the superdouble and the incarnation of the antichrist.
spiritual science teaches us[1] that the task of evil is to promote the ascent of man. evil we are told resides both in us and in the outside world and is a necessary force in the perfection and liberation of the human being through the overcoming of hindrance and temptation."
she covers much that i do not suffiiciently understand to explain but find it extremely valuable to ponder as i read more of her work!

" what are the fallen ethers?
after the ‘fall’ when adam ate from the fruit of the tree of knowledge or became a conscious being, through the entry of lucifer into his astral body, it was deemed that humanity should only retain knowledge of the warmth and light ethers, the other two; sound and life ethers were protected and guarded in spiritual worlds (tree of life) lest they become the prey of retarded forces. rudolf steiner tells us that we have the physical world, the astral world, lower devachan and higher devachan. there is also what rudolf steiner calls the sub-physical world;[21]
when light ether decays and is thrust down into the sub-material world, a stage deeper than the material world — electricity arises. light therefore finds its reflection in the substratum of the earth in electricity. in man this has its counterpart in thinking.
when chemical ether decays and is driven down beneath the physical plane into the evil devachanic world — magnetism arises. sound finds its reflection in the substratum of the earth as magnetism. in man this has its counterpart in feeling.
if what lives in higher devachan as life ether decays and is thrust down further still, into the province of the asuras, what arises is characterised by rudolf steiner as ‘an even more terrible force — which it will not be possible to keep hidden very much longer’. the realm of the atom. he goes on to say,
‘it can only be hoped that when this force comes to be known — a force we must conceive as being far, far stronger than the most violent electrical discharge — it can only be hoped that before some discoverer gives this force into the hands of humankind, men will no longer have anything immoral left in them.’[22]

life ether has its counterpart, its reflection in the substratum of the earth in a kind of radioactivity. in man this has its counterpart in the human will.
fallen and materialised thoughts - doubt in spirit
fallen materialised feelings - hatred of the spirit
fallen materialised will - fear of the spirit
the above fallen thoughts feelings and will, use and intensify the fallen ethers in the same way that the spiritualised thoughts and feelings and will, use and add to the ‘higher ethers’.
therefore we can say that the fallen forces in man (the double) are especially strengthened by coming into contact with their counterpart in the outer world, and that the degenerated etheric forces in the world are greatly strengthened by coming into contact with their counterpart in man.


why has this fall or degeneration occurred?
as we have seen what was once out in the cosmos can at another time be found in the microcosm and visa versa. this relates directly to what we find on earth as remnants of what was present in the earth’s surroundings during the different evolutionary stages of the earth.

what remains of old saturn forces – life ether is now found in the core of the earth in a degenerated form as the power of the atom ( more powerful than nuclear power).
what remains of old sun forces – sound or chemical ether is found at another inner level of the earth in a degenerated form as the power of magnetism.
what remains of the old moon forces – light ether is found at a higher level again and is the closest to the earth’s surface in a degenerated form as the power of electricity."

her article "meeting the two guardians" adds scope for study about our shadow self and related experiences. i'm overwelmed, but in a good way.
almost posted this for many related threads. nina

[Oberjej]

well, it's important to understand that the only separation between us and god, inside and out is an illusion. this illusion allows us to learn lessons, to feel the separation from god so we continue striving to meet him.. even though eventually that search has to turn inward.

in jesus's case, he's been lifted to a place higher than he might have liked. even when i was still practicing christianity, i understood that the main point of that was to get closer to god. i had to take the step of actualy cutting jesus out of the picture, and seeing that i don't need a 'savior' to unite me with the infinite creator. most of the bible has the strange contradiction. "you are saved by the blood of christ, a saint unblemished in the eyes of god. but don't sin, don't think bad thoughts, don't do bad things cause you know how much god hates sinners." some of it i think was meant to control people, to allow for the felling of shame so that they would be easy to control. "if you want gods favor, do this.. " having been full of shame, people are easier to control. if you think of yourself as less than prefect, your going to gravitate towards those who you perceive as having a greater amount of the perfection your think your missing. don't get caught in that trap!


you are god.. or all that is, you are a part of it. a holographic part, having in you all aspects of all that is. you are perfect just the way you are. step into your peace. "my peace i leave with you." jesus said, he was trying to be a template for us to follow, to find the greater connection to our own higher self and find that peace, love, tolerance, understanding, wisdom, compassion, the list goes on and on.

[GohJHM9k]

dear supermanny and everyone,
i shared a link for this treatise on "faith, hope and love as a counterforce to evil" in gd, christ jesus thread, re-anti-christ figures:this is fr part 2, can see part one from bottom of page also.
http://anthroposophy.org.au.sydney/faith2-lect.htm

"the sun mysteries of the good – the cosmic christ
the mysteries of the good, the mysteries of the cosmic christ have been known since the first cultural epoch of our 5th post atlantean age. the indians saw the redeemer descending to earth, the mighty sun being, as rama or vishvakarman or krishna, the persians saw the redeemer as ormuz, the egypto chaldeans saw him as osiris, the jewish people saw him as jehova, and the greeks as apollo. it was only in the late greco roman times that the human being experienced the physical incarnation of this cosmic god."

also, for fuller coverage, if you go to http://www.bibleandanthroposophy.com and search through smith's works for mithra you will find more:
"that the ancient mysteries were part and parcel of the fabric in which judaism and christianity developed is indicated, for instance, in the relationship between the biblical account of elijah and the ancient mystery of persia known as mithraism. "

bobby matherne has an outstanding reveiw of steiner's "turning points in spiritual history", from which this is an excerpt:
http://www.doyletics.com/arj/turningp.htm
"similarly, steiner revealed to the world that naboth and elijah in parts of the bible were the same human being. smith discussed how this came to be in his essay "widow's son" in his book the burning bush, crediting steiner for describing the nature of the connection between naboth and elijah:

[page xii] the focus of that essay was the personality known in the book of kings as both naboth and elijah, for until steiner it could hardly be known that they were one and the same. naboth was the personality's name prior to his initiation into the mysteries of mithra, elijah the name given to him when initiated as described in the book of kings.

smith's twenty-seven page introduction provides an excellent précis of the many contributions steiner made to furthering our understanding of how zarathustra, hermes, moses, elijah, and buddha each played a crucial role in the life of jesus and his subsequent baptism."

also matherne described,
"with the popularity of the anastasia books in russia, europe, and increasingly in america, one might wonder how a mysterious recluse could dwell in the midst of the siberian taiga and yet exercise such forces of power and intensity as she is reputed to have. steiner observes that great forces often operate in isolation and obscurity, going back to the days of elijah.

[page 173] although these days it is inconceivable that a mysterious personality such as we have portrayed, and known only through rumor, could dwell in our midst in the guise of a simple and homely neighbor without all the facts becoming known, in olden times such a circumstance was undoubtedly possible. we have learned that throughout all human evolution it is precisely those forces that are of greatest power and intensity which operate in an obscure and secret fashion.

elijah's mission is spelled out by steiner, giving as the main reason the sinking of the hebrew people into materialism so far that disaster would soon fall upon them. elijah was to turn the hearts of his people away from materialism and back to the spiritual world."

towards the end of the review he gives more about the "thou shalt not" clauses moses relayed, which i will not duplicate here but please read entire review.
quite central to lynette's title for this thread, matherne includes:
"you, by virtue of reading this review of a set of lectures by rudolf steiner, may be thinking that this is like preaching to the choir — you know much of this already. but there are many people who have lost their way because the external sciences haven been systematically undermining the very basis of christ jesus's divinity. by using methods of history, archaeology, and anthropology they strive to convince people that he was but a human being, if he existed at all, and that his teachings are just one among many great teachings which may benefit gullible believers." nina

[Anakattawl]

i just want to say thank you for responding to my curiosities.

mmongoose-thank you for sharing your experience with me, i wish i knew why we have these visions....

smanny-i find those stories all just as interesting as the one of jesus, i feel that they all could of been the same soul. corse nothing is for sure, any more insight on what you think about this....

quote:
originally posted by litllady view post
what would you do if a soul group that called themselves ra showed up with a spacecraft and told you they were here to take you to your safe haven from the wrath of earths sol? would you go?
heck no! i would run away as fast as i could!

ty for this. this is what i worry about. i worry there could be a massive fleet coming to gain something out of taking humans to a safe place. but, do you realize, how many people would be scared by this and think it was the way out...

john-i have never felt that jesus was related to any fear, i feel he came to remove the fear that was filled in the ot and to show us that peace and love is the answer. i would like to know why my mother saw him under the olive tree though.

ewhaz-you being more light to my wonders...i just cant understand why my family has had so many visions that pertain to this 'jesus'....and if it wasn't jesus, then there is a wondrous light being that has been visiting my family if you will....when my brother dies years ago, this was my mothers first vision...she saw her son walking off with a light being, she claimed it to of been jesus.

why do we have these 3d visions, is it just because i mind still worked in 3d. when we reach 4d will anyone have these visions? will there be any visions? surely we wont know everything in 4d because were still in a dimension of learning.

i feel one thing, but then i read something that i feel is a good source and it might say that what i feel is wrong. this is where i go wrong i guess, by doubting my inner feelings for material that might have distortion. how is it though, we see many different souls that feel different about all of this. how can some be right and wrong. i guess its because no one can be for sure how much of their inner seeking was pre-imprinted from ideas placed in their minds while they are young.

thanks again for responses, its comforting to gain others insights on such confusing matters.

peace to all,
lynette

[LarryG1978]

but how can we be so full of ourselves to think we dont need god....we are nothing without god/logos. are you saying we would still be if god isnt outside as well as within? im really trying to fit things together so they jive with my spirit. if we all just disappeared today, god would still be. where did souls come from? i feel i do have a creator, i feel the creator in me, but also bigger then me. not because what the bible says, or religion. i feel it, it has brought me to my knees before. and, as much as some dont want to think about it, there are rules, rules to live in the flesh so the soul can be changed, evolved, transfused, whatever....
peace to all,
lynette

i feel that it might be the other way around, god is nothing without "us". i will try to explain; the act of observation or the perception of what is would be god seeing through our eyes. that is why we are encouraged to be unique, to offer a different perspective, our own contribution to the akashic records so to speak. that is a permanent impression of our unique set of bleuprints that we offer to the cosmos. the beingness that unites and observes all that there is, is what we call god or the infinite creator, and it would not exist without self-realisation which is "us". we are the lens that give god a clear image of it's creations, without "us" the creator is blind, cannot feel, cannot taste, smell and even be. that is how we come up with the notion that we are all one you see because we are god's love, we are god's light we are the one infinite creator, literaly, from infinite beginings to infinite ends.

the soul is the very essence of life itself, it is a direct manifestation of the stimuly of consciousness. life wanting to live. a seperated fragment of the whole, out on a field trip. or something along those lines. my point is that deep down it's all part of the illusion and a product of seperateness. i like to believe that we are all united as one soul jmho ................sylvain.................