[EvaQWmrm]

hey people! how are things? =)

i really have a hard time to express my self, so here goes a nothin'.. =)

im 20 years old, capricorn. im born in a catholic family, and raised to beleve in god and jesus, and i do.
and more and more i start to se that there is much more to life then just the bible and all these traditions which i cant understand sometimes.. im not saying i reject the religion, but im saying im trying to get more of the "positive" in my life, and as less negative as possible.. there allways is a bigger meaning. by beeing here at divinecosmos, its a really positive thing for me, feels good =)

all my life ive been feeling rejected, im born in croatia, moved to sweden and there i am today. i could say ive experienced more then the "average" person. ive allways beleved that there is something more to life, and i allways get these ideas and i just speak freely about everything, at school and at work, and sometimes that annoys people, i dont like limits, or rather i dont think about any limits.. its allways traditions and "how the average person is", i dont agree with it, and i dont know why, sounds wierd

my parents allways tells me im "to kind to people"..
but i have sometimes these negative thoughts, and it makes me frustrated.. i dont want any negativity to be a part of me, but still i know i cant "deny" or "ignore" any parts of myself. whatever i do i end up confused. why am i not like everyone at work beeing out at weekend and drinking or something? you know, what people usually do these days..

what pisses me off and what i allways ask myself is, am i going crazy in any way or whats the deal?

anyways, what do do? which way to go? i have now been meditating for 3-4 months, not regulary, when i meditate i lay down and i get calm, and just sometimes i feel something amazing while meditating, beyond words, something that feels a bit like a dream but still not really..

how can i know if thats the real deal or is it something i create in my head? the last thing i want is to be creating and seeing whatever i want to se, i want it to be real, real meditation with real experiences, which helps me to become a better person.. how can i know this is real?

oh, and.. any tips about meditating?

any comments on this are appreciated

[MackBranon]

your words resonate deeply with me.

what your looking for in so many words is a subjective experience to validate your ideas about the world and god and your spiritual path.

at one point i was a christian, i no longer consider myself as such as i do not prescribe to the notion that salvation is needed, and thus no need for a savior. while that may seem blasphemous to some of the faith, my path up to this point is worth mentioning.

circumstances in my life had forced me to reevaluate the nature of right and wrong. at the time i had also finished the voyages series by robert monroe and also astral dynamics by robert bruce. you see, both of these talked about seeing the nature of spirituality in a different way, from a subjective standpoint rather than a theoretical one. instead of simply believing in faith these people had seen and experienced things that made it clear you didn't necessarily have to take things only on faith.

at one point, i had also considered giving up christianity. after a short search on the net i realized that there were others who had left the faith and had not been 'abandoned' by god, or cursed, or etc. however, it seemed that they went strait from not believing in christianity to being atheist. i didn't feel that was right either. just because i didn't know the truth didn't mean that god didn't exist.

so there i was, wandering the net trying to find answers about the how and what and why of the universe. after reading some other books, i began to accept myself as i am, flaws and all. i still need work, but we all do and our path is often just resolving those things piece by piece. i think my real turning point was in realizing that the search for god outside ourselves is hopeless, it puts a distance between us and god. that is where i think christianity is distorted in some respects, always putting something between you and god, faith, sin, guilt, salvation, etc. there is always something between you and him there.

however the real truth seems to be that he is us, we are him. there is no separation, not between him and not between us. look inside yourself to find the faith your looking for. look there to find the answers. trust in yourself and god to make your way clear. in the end it all works out, no matter how long that may take.

i notice that now that i have pulled away from that belief system (and there is nothing wrong with it, there are still things that people can and must learn while they are there, otherwise it would not exist.) i find that i have lost my crisis of faith. god seems more real to me now than before. i don't question his existence, i don't need to. i don't always have the answers i need, i don't always know the next step to take. some times i just have bad days when the negative thoughts won't quit, but i trust that all is well despite that.

i haven't had my subjective experience yet, i haven't had the empirical proof to prove anything. i can say i don't know and feel fine, the answers will come in their own time. how can you know any of this is real? the short answer is you can't, not at least while your in this body, in this distortion. what you can do is trust yourself to correct your way when you need it. trust that even though you don't know, a part of you really does know. just be patient while you meditate and listen.

if you still want empirical subjective evidence, you can get that too, but it takes a little more work in the realms of out of body experience or remote viewing. if your really lucky like dw and some others, when your ready your experiences will come to you. have faith and be patient.

[MpNelQTU]

hi clayman,

i would just like to say i'm in a very similar position to you- i'm also 20 and i experience a lot of the same problems with the youth culture- especially here in england where everyone just seems to go out to get drunk and be wild which is not my scene at all and it never has been. for a while i tried to just go along with it to try to 'fit in' but i realise that that is rather pointless as i never enjoyed doing those kind of things. those nights out where everyone drinks as much as possible just seem to be tailor-made for the ego. everyone goes out and dresses to impress, and they all spend huge amounts of money on alcohol and then can barely remember what happened when they wake up with a headache in the morning! you're not going crazy, that kind of thing is not for everyone. my parents find it strange that i avoid doing the things that 'every young person does' but what can you do? if it's not for you it's not for you. just keep doing the things that make you happy.

if you're feeling like that while meditating then surely that means that it's working. achieving feelings that are 'beyond words' is surely what everyone is aiming for when they meditate. if you want to be real then it is real.

[SteantyjetMaw]

anyways, what do do? which way to go? i have now been meditating for 3-4 months, not regulary, when i meditate i lay down and i get calm, and just sometimes i feel something amazing while meditating, beyond words, something that feels a bit like a dream but still not really..

how can i know if thats the real deal or is it something i create in my head? the last thing i want is to be creating and seeing whatever i want to se, i want it to be real, real meditation with real experiences, which helps me to become a better person.. how can i know this is real?

oh, and.. any tips about meditating?

hi tomislav,

20 years old, eh? wow, looks like folks are waking up younger all the time

[SteantyjetMaw]

whoops -- i wasn't quite finished!

anyway, i just want to welcome you to the vast exploration of your own individual spiritual process in all its mystery, surprise and adventure, without having much of anything to say about it whatsoever.

seriously. i mean, i suppose i could try to share with you details about my own process and stuff, but the beautiful thing to me here at divine cosmos is i actually feel moved to suggest that this is the last thing i should be doing. far more importantly, to me anyway, is the clear indication i get from my own history reading the law of one and going through all i have gone through -- is to leave others alone to make their own discoveries, and simply reinforce just how individual the spiritual process of self-discovery really has to be for it to take hold and "boot up".

i know there are tons of teachers and schools out there who would be happy to sign you up to their way of truthseeking, and i couldn't even say you or anyone would be wrong for signing up! but i can say that it is a great relief to me to encourage myself and you and anyone else to pursue your discovery process on your own, and let your dreams and your intuition and your deepest sense of truth be your emerging teacher par excellence.

that said, i can also say that my own path over the past 20 years has not kept me from making mistakes and suffering the consequences -- and thank god for that fact...for i have also learned that it is by listening to myself in my deepest place of peace, and also in my deepest sense of failure, that i find an emerging path forward that is one-person wide and dissolves behind me with each step.

because i do believe that we are each on our own in a very real way, i feel exactly that free to show up here and simply be my own very human self with you and others as moved, as we each encourage ourselves and each other along on this most marvelous, magical, mysterious emergence into our unknown future.

sincere regards from a fellow seeker....

fiz

[pymnConyelell]

let go of your expectations and allow for things to unfold naturally, none of us is in control of anything other than ourselves. be gentle with yourself. none of us can take in more than what we are ready for in the present, otherwise we would short circuit, my teacher reminds me over and over we take in energy and information then we must intergrate it until it is a part of us. it is a process not an event. meditation, begin with visualizations, think of a place in nature that you are attracted to and see it clearly in your mind's eye, allow yourself to experience it as fully as possible using every sense you have, sight, sound, feeling, touch, if you don't have a favorite place then make it up, use your imagination. these inward journeys of allowing our thoughts to deminish and become quiet is where we truely become in touch with ourself and god. may the great spirit guide you and protect you. donald

[Emunsesoxmete]

whoops -- i wasn't quite finished!

-- and thank god for that fact...for i have also learned that it is by listening to myself in my deepest place of peace, and also in my deepest sense of failure, that i find an emerging path forward that is one-person wide and dissolves behind me with each step.

because i do believe that we are each on our own in a very real way, i feel exactly that free to show up here and simply be my own very human self with you and others as moved, as we each encourage ourselves and each other along on this most marvelous, magical, mysterious emergence into our unknown future.

sincere regards from a fellow seeker....

fiz

hey mon, fiz.., nice words! you made me laugh, thats the wayz i seez it, too, and am glad for fellow seekers. and thank god there is no recipe, and i guess thats what i would have to say to you clayman, the closest way to know what is real, is just what you feeel is real, as you go along, as that sways, flows, shifts, and comes together again. always new, and always growing. the answers are natural, and naturally found. nobody can tell ya, because its truly your connection individually as well as collectively. its hard to be 20, but man, you sure got a fantastic start with all that good intention in you. you'll find, as we all keep finding, the spirit within works its own beautiful real magic.., thats why its real, the feeling of it becomes unmistakable. your heart is your compass. i love what you said about not ignoring any parts of yourself, a genuine quest for truth, and don't be hard on yourself.., rememeber we are all searching through and learning, and it will come together, as it always does, as it needs to. great words everyone has here!

love,
michelle

[EvaQWmrm]

good god thanx for the amazing words people! it means alot..

and yeah, i understand that there are differences on the view from person to person, so my reality isnt somebody elses..

nice to know im not the only person with thoughts like this, and more people "waking up" so to speak..

and, fiz, ive been like this for as long as i can remember. i survided a critical surgery after birth, doctors said i should have been dead, but i survived for some reason.. when i was a kid i liked to pick flowers from the forrest, and quit doing it because my friends laughed and pointed at me
ive done all these things and ive given up on some of them, and i should'nt have.. ive had two nervous breakdowns sofar because of overmotivation, and didnt want to have a third so i started to meditate and my boss wounders how the hell i can keep up with everyone else at work, knowing im the one with least experience in the area

but today, i learn more and more to actually focus on the stuff i want in my life, instead of thinking and crying over the things i havent got, or the things i dislike in my life, its like a course, you get more and more knowlage of your self if you want to.

ewhaz, i understand you fully for me its hard because i have to rebuld my self and let go of the past, and as you said, new view on right and wrong, and thats a good thing i think, because you let your self bee free, you release yourself from all traditions, and look at the world with new eyes.

because, christianity is more and more about traditions, and thats bad, because traditions can be manipulated and it seperates everyone in many levels..
when i used to go to church, it was as if everyone was competing about who was wearing what, and who gave the most money in church.. thats wrong..what happened to faith??? you know..
because if god would say something to us there he would probablly say "youve got me all wrong!!!"

but, thanx for all the kind words, it helps me alot in my "path to the unknown"

peace