[tgs]

You're telling me?

The guy on Ummah forum who runs the sticky thread titled "My Palestine is bleeding" has been linking to and borrowing from neo-Nazi websites. I caught him linking to The National Alliance and notified the mods. They banned the link, but the guy didn't receive as much as a formal warning.

[Beerinkol]

http://www.azure.org.il/magazine/magazine.asp?id=260


Well I was reading "Cruel Britania" by Robert Wistrich and it doesn't really amaze me. I have to say though that as far as England is concerned with this recent spate of bombings, you really can't say you didn't see it coming. Nor can you feel too bad for all media types and politicos who fomented it. Chickens coming home to roost, I say.


At any rate, in the US as far back as before the Iraq war you could go to any antiwar rally and see the Muslims, CAIR, the Nation of Islam, the Klan, the American Nazi Party standing shoulder to shoulder sceaming epithets that would be entirely familiar to Die Sturmer. I myself was subjected to this kind of thing literally just walking by on my way. Since I'm obviously Jewish to everyone but the dumbest redneck, I was accosted and people shouted all kinds of things in my face from Die Jew Die to F**ck all the *ikes to Death to Israel and Death to all the Jews and so on. This was from the student radicals, the NoI agitators and from the Confederate flag waving, white sheet wearing, sieg heiling skinheads who were up there with them.

[radikal]

Officials see growing terror ties
between radical Islam, skinheads
Posted: August 5, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern

WASHINGTON – Neo-Nazi skinheads are working with radical Islamists in a growing unholy alliance that has European law enforcement officials concerned about a new front in the war on terrorism, reports Joseph Farah's G2 Bulletin, the premium, online intelligence newsletter published by the founder of WND.

Sources in the UK, the Netherlands, Scandinavia, Italy, Switzerland and in the Middle East are warning that the world should not be surprised to see young, white males involved in terrorism and in league with Osama bin Laden.

Source: http://worldnetdaily.com/news/articl...TICLE_ID=45618

[Beerinkol]

An unholy alliance
Aryan Nation leader reaches out to al Qaeda

By Henry Schuster
CNN

SEBRING, Florida (CNN) -- A couple of hours up the road from where some September 11 hijackers learned to fly, the new head of Aryan Nation is praising them -- and trying to create an unholy alliance between his white supremacist group and al Qaeda.

"You say they're terrorists, I say they're freedom fighters. And I want to instill the same jihadic feeling in our peoples' heart, in the Aryan race, that they have for their father, who they call Allah."

With his long beard and potbelly, August Kreis looks more like a washed up member of ZZ Top than an aspiring revolutionary.

Don't let appearances fool you: his rיsumי includes stops at some of America's nastiest extremist groups -- Posse Comitatus, the Ku Klux Klan and Aryan Nation.

"I don't believe that they were the ones that attacked us," Kreis said. "And even if they did, even if you say they did, I don't care!"

Kreis wants to make common cause with al Qaeda because, he says, they share the same enemies: Jews and the American government.

The terms they use may be different: White supremacists call them ZOG, the Zionist Occupation Government, while al Qaeda calls them the Jews and Crusaders.

But the hatred is the same. And Kreis wants to exploit that.

A Nation in turmoil

The best thing that can be said about August Kreis is that he has helped preside over the decline of the once-feared Aryan Nation, a movement inspired by the racist tenets of Nazi Germany. He cannot or will not say how many followers the group now has.

What's clear is that Aryan Nation had a violent streak aligned with its anti-Semitic and racist ideology. One of its followers, Buford Furrow, received two life sentences, plus 110 years, for an August 1999 shooting spree in which he shot and wounded four children and one adult at a Jewish community center in the Los Angeles suburb of Granada Hills. Furrow then drove to nearby Chatsworth, California, where he shot and killed a Filipino-American postal carrier.

Others had been accused of involvement in bank robberies, shootouts with authorities and the murders of blacks and others.

More recently, the Aryan Nation lost its Hayden Lake, Idaho, compound, after losing a civil suit led by the Southern Poverty Law Center. Last year, founder Richard Butler died just as the group's leaders were fighting amongst themselves.

Around that time, Kreis tried to open up shop for Aryan Nation in northern Pennsylvania, but got run out by locals. Now he is in Sebring, Florida, and, although his rhetoric is full of revolution and defiance, he wanted to meet our CNN crew at a local park because he didn't want trouble from his neighbors.

You might think white supremacists like Kreis would spurn al Qaeda, since they tend to view non-Aryan Christians as, in their own term, "mud people." In fact, most of them do. But Kreis wants to change that.

"That's old-school racism, white supremacy, this is something new," he said. "We have to be realists and realize what didn't work [previously] isn't going to work in the future."

Supremacist, Islamist connections

The idea of a Nazi-Islamic alliance dates back to World War II, when Adolf Hitler played host to the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, that city's Muslim leader. Some Nazis, moreover, found refuge in places like Egypt and Syria after the war.

Three years ago, I met a Swiss Islamic convert named Ahmed Huber, who began his life as a devotee of Adolf Hitler and moved on to praising former Iranian leader Ayatollah Khomeini, who led that nation's Islamic revolution and vigorously opposed U.S. policies.

Huber wanted to forge a fresh alliance between Islamic radicals and neo-Nazis in Europe and the United States. And he cannot be simply dismissed as a crackpot: Huber served on the board of directors of a Swiss bank and holding company that President Bush accused of helping fund al Qaeda.

Mark Potok, of the Southern Poverty Law Center, said that while some U.S. extremists applauded the September 11 attacks, there is no indication of such an alliance -- at least not yet, and not on a large scale. If it exists anywhere, he said, it is in the mind (and the Internet postings) of August Kreis.

For its part, the FBI says it hasn't seen any links between American white supremacists and groups like al Qaeda.

"The notion of radical Islamists from abroad actually getting together with American neo-Nazis I think is an absolutely frightening one," said Potok. "It's just that so far we really have no evidence at all to suggest this is any kind of real collaboration."

So while August Kreis may be calling, there is no sign that al Qaeda is listening.

But that hasn't stopped him. As we ended our interview, we asked Kreis if he had any message for Osama bin Laden and his lieutenants.

"The message is, the cells are out here and they are already in place," Kreis said. "They might not be cells of Islamic people, but they are here and they are ready to fight."

[Lillie_Steins]

Biaresh: "Surely that's anti-israeli and not anti-semitic the two are not one and the same"

KW: "There is no difference"

KW, I am thinking, more than any people in the world, Jews should avoid and abhor such generalizations.

Surely you cannot equal political criticism with ethnic hate.

Any justification of a generalization justifies all other generalizations, just as any "acceptable" kind of racism justifies per se
Racism.

Of course, I am intently keeping it simple, but be sure in such matters people tend to instantly adhere to the simplest model.

Racism / shovinism / antisemitism are the simplest, they don't require any intellectual effort.

Such as: "Romanians are a people of thieves, my last mobile phone was stolen by a Romanian!", "Hungarian women are all sluts, I know it for a fact, my last girlfriend was a Hungarian!". And imagination tends to go wilder and simplification more extrem when l'autre looks / dresses / speaks differently... "Maybe they event think differently about good and bad... Maybe they even think differently about our children, than about theirs ... Maybe they even have horns, why else would they wear those hats"?

Don't take me wrong, I am not trying to justify anything, I am just explaining a mental model that makes me sick every time I hear of it... even from people I respect and ...even from someone whose sarcastic reaction I fear

I understand where you're coming from, especially since some of my grandparents are from Romania, and I lived in Moldova for some time.

Regarding criticism of Israel vs. anti-Israelism, the two are not the same thing. There is also a huge difference between disliking some politicians and their policies and working to harm a country, and even more so denying the Jewish people the right to live in an independent country on our homeland.

I was, and still am, an ardent critic of Rabin and his government's actions, but I would never use what they have done to try to undermind Israel existence, or to harm the country. What Woody Allen, Noam Chomsky, and others like them propose is explicitly intended to harm the country, its integrity and independence, and its people. And I don't see how this, or saying that Jews should be the only nation not allowed to have the right of self-determination or of being independent, isn't anti-Semitism.

[doctorzlo]

Islamofascists and anti-American government, white supremacists groups have been in league since prior to the Oklahoma City bombing. One neo-Nazi member from East Germany was sighted in a known supremacist compound in Oklahoma shortly before the bombing. This adds (not that it didn't already exist anyway) a European feature to the North American-ME cabal. US "intelligence" agencies were so concerned with saving face that the facts got lost in the shuffle. Too bad - because they all lost face on 9-11 anyway. If one wants to believe all the mythology surrounding Oklahoma City, Flight 800, 9-11, et al; feel free to remain "intellectually euthanized." It's not conspiracy; it's agenda!!! In the US it's not all about the Jews - it's about us "mud races" too. White purity = bushgallata!!!

[LottiFurmann]

There is no difference. Unless you believe that someone can be anti-Iran and not anti-Iranian.

arabs are semites too, dont you know. So?

[Lt_Apple]

Surely that's anti-israeli and not anti-semitic the two are not one and the same.

I am anti-British.

He is a Jew anyway, I doubt he is anti-jew. arabs are semites too, dont you know.

Yep, that's why there are no Jews in the Arab world. Lets call Arabs anti-semites.