[NikkitaZ]

Kadhafi forces report gains, launch offensive

WTF.. Why are we there, if we cant get a two bit dictator to step down or die? How long have we been killing his family?

Kadhafi forces report gains, launch offensive - Yahoo! News

Rebels in the western Libyan town of Zliten were said to be low on ammunition and on the defensive on Sunday, as the regime said its forces had retaken the strategic southwest town of Bir Ghanam.

Abdul Wahab Melitan, a rebel spokesman in the port city of Misrata near Zliten, said forces loyal to strongman Moamer Kadhafi had launched an assault on rebel positions in Zliten's Souk Telat area, killing three and wounding 15.

"The rebels lack ammunition to advance and we do not want to risk losing any ground," Melitan said.

Meanwhile, a rebel source at Al-Qusbat, around 90 kilometres (55 miles) east of the capital Tripoli, said that town was living through its fourth day under siege.

A group of rebels on Thursday overran Kadhafi forces based in one of the town's schools, but since then the rebels have been battling to hold on to their gains.

Raed Hussein, an envoy from Al-Qusbat's military council, said he expected more Kadhafi troops to be sent from nearby Al-Khums to bolster the siege.

In Tripoli, Prime Minister Baghdadi Mahmudi told reporters that government troops had recaptured the strategic town of Bir Ghanam, southwest of the capital, from insurgents.

[amagmasia]

The reason we couldn't take him out was because we didn't get involved enough and, unlike what the Western elites sold all the gullible sheep, Kadhafi had the support of his people. The Western manufactured revolt was put down because of this. Does a leader who's people hate him arm his people?

Gaddafi arms Libyan 'home guard' ? minimum age 17 | World news | guardian.co.uk

As part of the drive towards an unofficial civilian army, the government is releasing thousands of AK-47 assault rifles into communities and is organising classes in the use of weapons.

At a women's training centre in the town of Sbia, 30 miles south of Tripoli, young women crowded round a trestle table as a soldier wearing camouflage fatigues and thick red lipstick demonstrated how to field-strip and reassemble the guns.

[foonlesse]

This could have been over in weeks had Obomber parked the Enterprise off the coast of Tripoli.

But he is not interested in a humanitarian liberation, this is a social fox hunt with Europe.

[foltdan]

This could have been over in weeks had Obomber parked the Enterprise off the coast of Tripoli.

But he is not interested in a humanitarian liberation, this is a social fox hunt with Europe.

Why would it be humanitarian to destroy the leader who has built up his nation to have the highest valued currency out of all of Africa? Who brought water to the desert? Who was trying to set up an African central bank?

[SkatrySkith]

trying to set up an African central bank?

Oh, so that's why he's being bombed, it all makes sense now.

Here I thoughtit was because he had a history of being a terrorist supporting p.o.s. but surprise surprise it's all about the all mighty dollar, pound and euro.

[Ad0i89Od]

Sadly he is making the western powers look like fools...0

[Stacypettlerr]

Oh, so that's why he's being bombed, it all makes sense now.

Here I thoughtit was because he had a history of being a terrorist supporting p.o.s. but surprise surprise it's all about the all mighty dollar, pound and euro.

If it was because of him being a POS we would have done something about it long ago.

[IRMartin]

This could have been over in weeks had Obomber parked the Enterprise off the coast of Tripoli.

Another deluded notion.

It all would've been over in a matter of days if "democratic international community" would not have supported God knows whom against a legitimate leader of Libya.

Btw, in the last three months Taliban managed to shoot down ten helicopters thanks to US, UK, France and the rest of "international community" who allowed "Libyan freedom fighters" to loot Libyan arsenals the contents of which "freedom fighters" then sold to other "freedom fighters" pissing off Israel in a process.

[interznakinfo]

The very fact that our nation feels the need to waste money and men, in another conflict involving oil rich, islamic nations, in which both sides obviously see us as a "great satan", leaves me pretty confused. Why must we repeatedly make the same mistakes and errors that have plagued our recent history, even when we realize that the truth of the matter demands that we change our position? How many times will the citizens of the U.S.A. allow our resources to be wasted in conflicts of a foreign nature, due to oil, instead of committed to the research and development of petroleum alternatives? We must come to realize that no matter what we do, the barrels will run dry one day, and this reality is fast approaching as Chine and other countries, increase their use and the demand of petroleum to new heights. If we would have simply advanced to a comparable degree in non petroleum fuels, as with the rest of technology, we would have no need to waste the lives of our fellow country men, in a war with a group of muslims that are fighting another group of muslims over things we are not involved in, or have any right to interfere in.

[cestsennY]

ahoy all,

'tis interestin' to see what almost seems like...well...enthusiastic support fer the survival 'o Mr. Kadhaffi. indeed, thar be some on USPO who appear to be silenty cheerin' fer a routin' 'o NATO forces.

whilst i be on the fence on our own involvement in this conflict, imma surprised how quickly many 'o our folk on USPO have forgiven the murder 'o 178 Americans from the Lockerbie bombin'.

i guess thats ancient history now, aye me friends?

- MeadHallPirate

[Enjoymms]

ahoy all,

'tis interestin' to see what almost seems like...well...enthusiastic support fer the survival 'o Mr. Kadhaffi. indeed, thar be some on USPO who appear to be silenty cheerin' fer a routin' 'o NATO forces.

whilst i be on the fence on our own involvement in this conflict, imma surprised how quickly many 'o our folk on USPO have forgiven the murder 'o 178 Americans from the Lockerbie bombin'.

i guess thats ancient history now, aye me friends?

- MeadHallPirate

That is a huge stretch and one that, I think, should be beneath you.

Would you also suggest that those that believe in the rights of criminals somehow forgive or approve of their crimes?

[Borrinas]

Kadhafi forces report gains, launch offensive

WTF.. Why are we there, if we cant get a two bit dictator to step down or die? How long have we been killing his family?

Kadhafi forces report gains, launch offensive - Yahoo! News

Rebels in the western Libyan town of Zliten were said to be low on ammunition and on the defensive on Sunday, as the regime said its forces had retaken the strategic southwest town of Bir Ghanam.

Abdul Wahab Melitan, a rebel spokesman in the port city of Misrata near Zliten, said forces loyal to strongman Moamer Kadhafi had launched an assault on rebel positions in Zliten's Souk Telat area, killing three and wounding 15.

"The rebels lack ammunition to advance and we do not want to risk losing any ground," Melitan said.

Meanwhile, a rebel source at Al-Qusbat, around 90 kilometres (55 miles) east of the capital Tripoli, said that town was living through its fourth day under siege.

A group of rebels on Thursday overran Kadhafi forces based in one of the town's schools, but since then the rebels have been battling to hold on to their gains.

Raed Hussein, an envoy from Al-Qusbat's military council, said he expected more Kadhafi troops to be sent from nearby Al-Khums to bolster the siege.

In Tripoli, Prime Minister Baghdadi Mahmudi told reporters that government troops had recaptured the strategic town of Bir Ghanam, southwest of the capital, from insurgents.

Well, if Bush were still in office you'd be hearing that we are there to fatten up his Haliburton buddies, or other govt contractors. Or we are there for the oil.
Maybe one of our resident Obama nut suckin' liberals can explain why THEIR president has us involved there.

[Unwiseevove]

That is a huge stretch and one that, I think, should be beneath you.

Would you also suggest that those that believe in the rights of criminals somehow forgive or approve of their crimes?

ahoy Thorhammer,

'tis just an observation from this and other Libya related threads, matey. it just seems like outrage and a yearnin' fer justice hath a short half life here on USPO. 'tis like Lockerbie happened in the 1800's.

...and, thar does appear to be a kind 'o glee at the prospect 'o a NATO defeat.

thats just what i see, Thorhammer, at least in some quarters 'o USPO.

- MeadHallPirate

[EliteFranceska]

ahoy Thorhammer,

'tis just an observation from this and other Libya related threads, matey. it just seems like outrage and a yearnin' fer justice hath a short half life here on USPO. 'tis like Lockerbie happened in the 1800's.

...and, thar does appear to be a kind 'o glee at the prospect 'o a NATO defeat.

thats just what i see, Thorhammer, at least in some quarters 'o USPO.

- MeadHallPirate

Knock on wood but it does seems Gadaffi is nearing his end in power, e.g.,

Libya: former prime minister defects, dealing Col Gaddafi another blow
Libyan rebels have said that a former deputy of Col Gaddafi has defected in another blow to the increasingly isolated Libyan leader.
By Damien McElroy in Zawiyah and Richard Spencer, Middle East Correspondent11:16PM BST 19 Aug 2011

Abdessalam Jalloud, a former Libyan prime minister who was sacked by Gaddafi in 1990s fled Tripoli to rebel-held Zintan on Friday.

Mr Jalloud joined the daily exodus of hundreds of Tripolitanians out of the beseiged capital and declared he would support the uprising against the dictator. "This is very big news. He has declared that he will work with the revolution," said an official with the Western Military Council.

The official said that Mr Jalloud has not met Col Gaddafi in many years. But he did report that checkpoints out of Tripoli had been abandoned as security forces desert the regime.

Mr Jalloud is due to make a public statement denouncing Gaddafi in Benghazi, the rebel capital on Saturday.

The defection came as aid workers were preparing a mass evacuation of foreigners from Tripoli on Friday night as Western leaders discussed plans for the likely fall of Col Gaddafi, the long-term Libyan leader.

. . .

Bitter fighting continued on the two main front lines near the capital, at Zawiyah 30 miles to the west of Tripoli and in Zlitan, 70 miles to the east, where the rebels have pushed out slowly from their enclave in Misurata.

The rebels said they had taken control of most of Zlitan, seen as a Gaddafi stronghold, though they had lost 32 men in doing so.

Gaddafi troops fought back in Zawiyah, but last night the rebels claimed to have taken the central square and the hospital in the east of the city, consolidating their hold. Air raids have damaged the regime’s ability to reinforce its troops.

One raid hit a large compound, which neighbours said belonged to Abdullah al-Senussi, Col Gaddafi’s brother-in-law and security chief. A child’s swing and a fountain could be seen in the ruins, but neighbours were unable to say if Mr Senussi, who faces charges at the International Criminal Court along with Col Gaddafi and the leader’s son, Saif al-Islam, had been at home.

Another casualty was the brother of Mussa Ibrahim, the main government spokesman who regularly addressed televised press conferences.

Hasan Ali Ibrahim, described as a student, was in the centre of Zawiyah when he was hit by a missile fired by a Nato helicopter, officials said.

Nato also dropped leaflets over Tripoli itself, calling on residents to rise up against the regime, a clear attempt to discourage forces being redeployed away from the city.

. . .
Libya: former prime minister defects, dealing Col Gaddafi another blow - Telegraph

Report: Gaddafi ill and ready to leave Libya
Published August 17th, 2011 - 17:22 GMT

A Libyan military source was quoted as saying on Wednesday that Libyan leader Colonel Muammar Gaddafi was likely to step down and delegate his powers to Muhammad Alqamoda, the Minister of Justice in the Libyan regime.

An Arabic newspaper quoted a source in the Libyan army as saying: "Colonel Gaddafi's conditions are an immediate ceasefire and the withdrawal of NATO forces." Then he and his family would departure Libya.

"Two Airbus aircraft from South Africa landed at Tripoli International Airport. One of them included a delegation while the second was empty of passengers," the source said, adding that the planes may be ready to transfer Colonel Muammar Gaddafi, his family members and some members of his regime to Venezuela.

It seems that these recent developments are the result of a significant progress made in negotiations between the rival parties. These talks are being held in Tunisia. It is reported that the envoy of Venezuela President Hugo Chávez, arrived to the island of Djerba, Tunisia, where he met, according to informed sources, representatives from Gaddafi government.

Some sources claim Gaddafi is ill and in need for urgent medical treatment outside Libya. It is reported that the Libyan leader sent his chief aide, Bashir Saleh to Mali and the island of Djerba in Tunisia to meet with British and French officials, in order to search for a way "how to get Gaddafi and his family out from Libya." Report: Gaddafi ill and ready to leave Libya | Al Bawaba

NBC: Gadhafi making plans for leaving Libya
Leader, family could be granted exile in Tunisia, US intelligence reports say
Below:
NBC News and news services
updated 8/19/2011 7:57:20 AM ET

Moammar Gadhafi is making preparations for a departure from Libya with his family for possible exile in Tunisia, U.S. officials have told NBC News, citing intelligence reports.

One official suggested it was possible that Gadhafi would leave within days, NBC News reported.

The information obtained by NBC News follows a series of optimistic statements this week from U.S. officials that Gadhafi would soon give up the five-month-old fight and and leave Libya.

. . . NBC: Gadhafi making plans for Libya departure - World news - Mideast/N. Africa - msnbc.com

In Libya, rebels plan for post-Gaddafi era - The Washington Post

[wallyfindme]

That is a huge stretch and one that, I think, should be beneath you.

Would you also suggest that those that believe in the rights of criminals somehow forgive or approve of their crimes?

Then why not support what Obama is doing to bring Ghaddafi closer to the hangman's nose?
Bush forgave Ghaddafi and welcomed him back to the community of nations, heck, Bush called off the dogs chasing Bin Laden, his old partners brother.

Obama hurts people who hurt Americans and the right goes apoplectic.

[mikaelluioy]

Well, if Bush were still in office you'd be hearing that we are there to fatten up his Haliburton buddies, or other govt contractors. Or we are there for the oil.
Maybe one of our resident Obama nut suckin' liberals can explain why THEIR president has us involved there.

If Bush were here the emphasis would be on how many no-bid contracts he could issue to Haliburton.

Obama is hurting a guy who hurt Americans, I know that concept is foreign to the "What's in it for me" GOP approach to war. But Ghaddafi killed hundreds of Americans, and Obama is using a little english to tilt the table against that sorry prick.

Wanna tell us how Bush forgave and forgot Bin Laden?

[AdobebePhoto]

ahoy Thorhammer,

'tis just an observation from this and other Libya related threads, matey. it just seems like outrage and a yearnin' fer justice hath a short half life here on USPO. 'tis like Lockerbie happened in the 1800's....and, thar does appear to be a kind 'o glee at the prospect 'o a NATO defeat.

thats just what i see, Thorhammer, at least in some quarters 'o USPO.

- MeadHallPirate

For more historical perspective:

In Sept 1983 The US Battleship New Jersey began shelling Lebanon in support of invading Israeli forces.

In Oct 1983 the US Marine barracks in Lebanon was bombed, killing 220 Marines, 18 Sailors, and 3 Army personnel.

In 1986 a Berlin, Germany night club was bombed killing a Turkish woman and two US soldiers, and over 200 people, including 72 US soliers, were wounded. This was said to be the work of Kaddafy.

July 1988 Iranian Flight 655 was downed by the guided missile cruiser USS Vincennes, killing all 290 passengers.

Dec. 1988, the Lockerbie bombing, mentioned above, said to be the work of Kaddafy.

[SDorothy28]

Of course today's headline from the NY Times reads
Qaddafi’s Hold in Tripoli in Doubt as Rebels Advance Quite simply it is really hard for republicans to make that mental gymnastic of having for 8 years denounced as traitors those who did not support the commander in chief, celebrated themselves as liberators, argued that they were making the world a safer place through war to now argue roughly the exact opposite.
Obviously the same is true for liberals in their non-support/support for the various admins.
Blind ideology makes it hard to be objective.
For my part, if Qaddafy falls in the next month, that their continues to be no American casualties, and the rebels are able to impose their planned election with no one pulling a coup, (none of these things are guaranteed by any stretch mind you) I have a hard time seeing how or why the neocons froth at the mouth on this issue...
...But I would look forward to more pretzel logic as to why this was an awful, horrible, terribly bad thing to do

[CalBettaulp]

Obama is hurting a guy who hurt Americans, I know that concept is foreign to the "What's in it for me" GOP approach to war. But Ghaddafi killed hundreds of Americans, and Obama is using a little english to tilt the table against that sorry prick.

Wanna tell us how Bush forgave and forgot Bin Laden?

And how many people around the world did Americans "hurt"? Since the end of 40-s the US killed more people then were killed during WW2! Does it mean that your country should be erased from the face of the Earth? Would you agree with that?

Besides, I can't believe you can be THAT naive to think that Obama is in Libya because of a terrorist act that happened many moons ago.

Come to think of it, THERE IS NO WAR in Libya!!!!!!! Your president together with some other "international community" are PROTECTING CIVILIANS in Libya!!!!!

[hoarrimilsora]

Of course today's headline from the NY Times reads

Quite simply it is really hard for republicans to make that mental gymnastic of having for 8 years denounced as traitors those who did not support the commander in chief, celebrated themselves as liberators, argued that they were making the world a safer place through war to now argue roughly the exact opposite.
Obviously the same is true for liberals in their non-support/support for the various admins.
Blind ideology makes it hard to be objective.
For my part, if Qaddafy falls in the next month, that their continues to be no American casualties, and the rebels are able to impose their planned election with no one pulling a coup, (none of these things are guaranteed by any stretch mind you) I have a hard time seeing how or why the neocons froth at the mouth on this issue...
...But I would look forward to more pretzel logic as to why this was an awful, horrible, terribly bad thing to do

.


I agree with Alma, rocheteau, that Republicans haven't lost their love for the military-indutrial establishment. But, as I said before, I think that they are mainily opposed to intervention in Libya and Syria because it distracts from attention given to their big bete noir, Iran. Some history:

We probably all know by now that the US and England overthrew the only elected Muslim democracy in the Mid-East in 1953 when the CIA and MI 6 overthrew the government of Dr. Mohammed Mossedegh in Iran and installed the Shah.

In 1979 there was an Iranian revolution sparked by a student rebellion, civil disobedience, and riots, and the US puppet Shah fled to the US. Then, Irainian students took US employees at the US Embassy hostage, demanding the Shah's money back, and that he and his SAVAK secret police be tried for crimes against humanity, creating the "Iranian hostage crisis," that went on for months.
Iranian Revolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, here's the case against Iran:

1. The Pentagon and State Department still resent the Iranians kicking out their guy.

2. The Iranians are now a relatively wealthy Mid-East country which wants to develop nuclear weapons to neutralize Israel's nuclear trump card (Or to do evil, depending on your viewpoint.)

3. Iran now buys its weapons from Russia, China, and elsewhere, and no longer from the US military-industial complex.

All three of these reasons contribute to McCain and Santorum wanting to Bomb, bomb, bomb. Bomb, bomb Iran. But, IMHO the real driving force behind the Hate Iran effort are Orthodox Jewish neocons like Richard Perle and Charles Krauthammer.

For those non-North Americans, McCain's "Bomb, bomb Iran" was sung to the tune of the Beach Boys' song, Barbara Ann.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wbMqRO6lnc

BTW, there are plenty of Democrats also itching to bomb Iran and plenty of others who love military-industrial complex donations to their re-elction campaings who would happily vote to attack Iran if push came to shove.