[Aswdwdfg]

From the proceedings at the recent conference in Athens on Elder Sophrony, it seems that the move to canonise him is well under way. There has also been a resounding refutation of those few (like Prof. A. I. Osipov) who still consider Elder Sophrony to have been in prelest.

[Ltftujkg]

From the proceedings at the recent conference in Athens on Elder Sophrony, it seems that the move to canonise him is well under way. There has also been a resounding refutation of those few (like Prof. A. I. Osipov) who still consider Elder Sophrony to have been in prelest.

Andreas, there was a documentary about him on TV a week ago.

Do you know the requirements for someone to be canonised in the Orthodox Church? I know the Catholic Church now requires at least 3 documented miracles. Is it the same for our Church?


Effie

[Aswdwdfg]

As I understand it, our procedure is different from the RC Church. We glorify our saints in a mystical rather than juridical way. When a person is accepted as having been distinguished by asceticism, holiness of life, how they have edified others, and where there have been miracles (perhaps before and after repose), and where the people venerate the person as a saint already, then that person is glorified during a special liturgy. Elder Sophrony, like Elders Paisios, Joseph, and Porphyrios, and some others, are obvious candidates.

[popsicesHoupe]

Do you know the requirements for someone to be canonised in the Orthodox Church? I know the Catholic Church now requires at least 3 documented miracles. Is it the same for our Church?

There are a couple of documents online about this. One is What does "Glorification" Mean? by Fr. Alexy Young; another is The Glorification of Saints by Protopresbyter Michael Pomazansky.

An excerpt from Fr. Young's article:

Thus, in the case of St. Herman of Alaska, St. John of Kronstadt, and Blessed Xenia of Petersburg, after there had already been a long-standing private devotion to these saints among Orthodox believers, the bishops requested a formal investigation into the lives and miracles of these saints, in order to determine their sanctity for the whole of the Russian Church. This is not, however, a "test" of righteousness, but a search for and collecting of information about holiness, which rises far above simple righteousness. When, in the fullness of God's time, it is apparent to the Church authorities that an individual's life and works have been filled with the grace and glory of God, the bishops commission the writing of a service to that saint, the painting of an icon, and the establishment of a feast day on the calendar. I don't think there are any "requirements" in the legal sense, beyond what is mentioned in the above excerpt.

In Christ,
Mike

[Freeptube]

I did not hear about Elder Sophrony until I came to this website. Maybe I had heard about him but not with the impact that I had here from what I learned from Andreas, Andrew etc. So thank you! I love this Elder now, and can't wait to have more saints! Also I can't wait for the rest of the Elders to be canonized. I am very fond of Elder Paisios. My spiritual father always taught us about him and told us stories and sayings from Elder. I always loved the Elder and after he passed away I had a problem which for the moment it seemed so huge to me (now I do not even remember what the problem was ) and I prayed to the Elder with tears. I just remember that in about half hour my problem was solved.

[12Cickprior]

From the proceedings at the recent conference in Athens on Elder Sophrony, it seems that the move to canonise him is well under way. There has also been a resounding refutation of those few (like Prof. A. I. Osipov) who still consider Elder Sophrony to have been in prelest.

Why did A.I. Osipov and some other Russians consider Elder Sophrony to be in prelest?

[Aswdwdfg]

Why did A.I. Osipov and some other Russians consider Elder Sophrony to be in prelest? Elder Sophrony writes about his experiences of the Uncreated Light and this led some to think that he was deluded. They couldn't understand how a man could be so bold about God. This was to ignore similar boldness on the part of Fathers such as St Symeon the New Theologian and St Gregory Palamas. It was also to ignore the fact that experience of the Uncreated Light is more common than some think, and is not confined to those proclaimed as saints. True, such experiences are not normally spoken of, but Elder Sophrony has a special mission for our times. The Holy Spirit has not abandoned us but has, in our own days, given us saints such as Elder Sophrony to encourage us so that we may know that what read in the lives of the Fathers are not things of old but are such things as may happen now. Elder Sophrony writes from experience and it is this experiential quality which marks out his writings from those of academic theologians.

[12Cickprior]

Elder Sophrony writes about his experiences of the Uncreated Light and this led some to think that he was deluded. They couldn't understand how a man could be so bold about God. This was to ignore similar boldness on the part of Fathers such as St Symeon the New Theologian and St Gregory Palamas. It was also to ignore the fact that experience of the Uncreated Light is more common than some think, and is not confined to those proclaimed as saints. True, such experiences are not normally spoken of, but Elder Sophrony has a special mission for our times. The Holy Spirit has not abandoned us but has, in our own days, given us saints such as Elder Sophrony to encourage us so that we may know that what read in the lives of the Fathers are not things of old but are such things may happen now. Elder Sophrony writes from experience and it is this experiential quality which marks out his writings from those of academic theologians.

That is what I thought too. The saints suffer persecution... it seems that all those who experience this great grace are attacked as deluded at some point. Elder Joseph, Saint Silouan, St. Gregory Palamas, Elder Sophrony, etc. And now in America, Elder Ephraim.

[Freeptube]

That is what I thought too. The saints suffer persecution... it seems that all those who experience this great grace are attacked as deluded at some point. Elder Joseph, Saint Silouan, St. Gregory Palamas, Elder Sophrony, etc. And now in America, Elder Ephraim.

Wow! They must accuse all saints for prelest then because all saints had experience -in a way, or another- of the Uncreated Light. That comes with deification. Some choose to speak about the experience and some do not. It is all according to the guidance of the Holy Spirit and the holy discernment they posses. This last is so neglected in our times, that we do not hear much about it. But it is very important. Why do we always advise each other to speak about one's personal problem, with one's spiritual/confessor father? Because he has discernment. When we hear that the matter is pastoral, the key behind it is really the discernment. Accusing saints for prelest because they write about their relationship with God, shows lack of discernment, and even more so of holy discernment.

[Aswdwdfg]

There were some murmurs on the Holy Mountain when St Silouan was canonised. Some said, 'why him? What did he do that was special?' Father Sophrony suffered a lot in many ways. The Russian community on Mt Athos suffers disadvantage, and Father Sophrony was even suspected of being a spy! He tried to go back to Russia, to the Lavra, but the Soviet authorities wouldn't allow him to. He went to Paris but was not accepted there which is why - thankfully for us! - he came to England. He was helped by the then Home Secretary, R. A. Butler. Father Sophrony's application to come and live here was referred to Butler. He was a pious man (his favourite reading was the Homilies of St John Chrysostom), and when he looked at the file on Father Sophrony, he wrote across it, 'give the Archimandrite every assistance'. Father Sophrony looked all over Britain for some suitable property for his little community, and eventually found the Old Rectory at Tolleshunt Knights. At first, they were very poor. The local Anglican priest gave them food, but they had no service books which was why they started to use the Jesus Prayer morning and night, and this still takes the place of the usual services of Matins and Vespers. Many years ago, Bishop Eirenaios was looking for a spiritual father and confessor, and he went to Athens to ask Elder Simon of Penteli, who replied, 'why come to me when, in England, you have a diamond?' He meant Father Sophrony. So, the Bishop went to ask Father Sophrony to be his spiritual father. He replied, 'but you are a bishop - how can this be?' But the Bishop insisted, and became his disciple. I met the Bishop in 1992, and shortly after, he took me to meet Father Sophrony and take his blessing. That was it! I knew I had to become Orthodox. Father Sophrony is spiritual father to all who love him.

[Ltftujkg]

Andreas, he is spoken of with great respect here in Greece.

Effie

[Aswdwdfg]

Father Zacharias has been tireless in 'spreading the word' about Father Sophrony in Greece, Russia and elswhere. I have no doubt that Father Sophrony is a saint.

[Enjknsua]

Here is a link to a wonderful set of CD's of Father Zacharias speaking of the teachings of Elder Sophrony. If you can get a set, I HIGHLY recommmend it.
The Hidden Man of the Heart.

Disk 1:
"The Mystery of Man's Heart"
Disk 2:
"The Awakening of the Heart by the Mindfulness of Death and the Moment of Death"
Disk 3:
"The Awakening of the Heart by the Fear of God and by Bearing Shame in the Sacrament of Confession"
Disk #4:
"The Building Up of the Heart by Vigilance and Prayer"
Disk #5:
"The Building Up of the Heart by the Grace of Repentance"
Disk #6:
"Go In and You Will Find Rest"
Disk #7:
"The Vulnerability of the Gift of Speaking in Tongues"

Copyright 2007
by the Clergy Brotherhood of the Diocese of Wichita and Mid-America
and the Patriarchal Stavropegic Monastery of St John the Baptist



Your prayers,
Paul

[Jannet.K]

From the proceedings at the recent conference in Athens on Elder Sophrony, it seems that the move to canonise him is well under way. There has also been a resounding refutation of those few (like Prof. A. I. Osipov) who still consider Elder Sophrony to have been in prelest.

Are we to idolize our elders? I think not. I know people deeply venerate Elder Sophrony, but some retired bishops seem to be critical of this elder idolization... I know people respect Elder Sophrony very much, but the tone of some of these posts makes me highly uncomfortable... Let us not get closer to the decease elders than to our own living priests, especially our dearly beloved parish priests who labor ceaselessly for our souls!

[12Cickprior]

Are we to idolize our elders? I think not. I know people deeply venerate Elder Sophrony, but some retired bishops seem to be critical of this elder idolization... I know people respect Elder Sophrony very much, but the tone of some of these posts makes me highly uncomfortable... Let us not get closer to the decease elders than to our own living priests, especially our dearly beloved parish priests who labor ceaselessly for our souls!

What do you mean? Please clarify!

Saint Symeon the New Theologian had icons painted of his spiritual father after he reposed, because he knew firsthand that he was a saint. The same goes for Elder Sophrony. He has worked miracles beyond the grave. As Metropolitan Hierotheos Vlachos says (and he is a teacher of great renown throughout the world), "If Elder Sophrony was not a saint, than there are no saints!" The Fathers of the Holy Mountain count him as one of the great saints of our era, along with Saint Silouan and Elder Joseph. Icons of him are painted throughout the world. He is venerated throughout the world as a saint. How is this un-Orthodox or idolization? I think a lot of these people who argue against the veneration of elders have a mindset similar to the Iconoclasts, or the Barlaamites. Here we have living, breathing, holy men who have been transfigured by the grace of God, and aid in bringing us into union with Our Beloved Lord.

Our priests are aided by the prayers of the saints. If someone has a deep love for the saints, I think they too will have a love for their priest.

[Aswdwdfg]

Are we to idolize our elders? I think not. I know people deeply venerate Elder Sophrony, but some retired bishops seem to be critical of this elder idolization... I'm sure no one 'idolizes' Father Sophrony. But he is very widely ackowledged to be a great saint, for example by Metropolitan Hierotheos Vlachos and by the Lavra Fathers. Is it not a great encouragement that God has given us in our time a saint who stands with the prominent Fathers of old? I only met him twice but I know those who knew him very well and I believe what they say of him.

Let us not get closer to the decease elders than to our own living priests, especially our dearly beloved parish priests who labor ceaselessly for our souls! The elders are not deceased - they are alive, more than they were when in this life. They also labour for our salvation; they care for us and help us. Please do not separate heaven and earth - they are bridged by the activity of the saints.

[Freeptube]

The elders are not deceased - they are alive, more than they were when in this life. They also labour for our salvation; they care for us and help us. Please do not separate heaven and earth - they are bridged by the activity of the saints.

Yes, they have passed from the Church Militant to the Church Triumphant. They are never deceased. We all need their prayers. And Andrew is right also because whoever does not love saints (fathers/elders), will not love priests and will not love God. All are intertwined.

[redDoodia]

Elder Sophrony is a saint because he is treated as a saint by the Church. Just because he hasn't been canonised (yet) by the Holy Synod doesn't change this.

With love in Christ

Alex

[illerlytoindy]

Does anyone have a link to some good source(s) of information on Elder Sophrony?

[ronaldasten]

Here you are! Everything on a tablet:

http://www.google.at/search?q=Elder+...fficial&hs=ihr

In Christ, Nicolaj