[LarryG1978]

Hey guys and gals!!!

Christ is Risen!!!

I was reading this encyclopedia dictionary site on the internet and I felt quite upset by some entries accusing us Orthodox of Iconoltry, Paganism, Idolatry, etc etc.

The good thing is that we can freely edit this site...so if you have spare time and would rather have people reading an un-biased opinion of Christian Orthodoxy, If you have the knowledge and time or know somone who has researched a particular topic, please help fix the problem. I tried to fix some entries already.

A good idea is to save the previous entry in case you delete it by accident.

They even said that the term Idol comes from Latin instead of Greek, unbelievable!!!

Please go here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthodox_church
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idolatry

in Christ

Kosma

[adolfadsermens]

Kosma,

I assume you made the changes on the Idolatry page as that says nothing negative about the Orthodox Church in my quick read.

Keep in mind Wikipedia is not written by "scholars" that I can tell.

Athanasia

[penpizdes]

> One should take into consideration that 40+% of Latin is taken from Greek. > Vasilis

[LarryG1978]

I know it's not written by scholars but some entries are biased, so at least we could help change that by editing these pages which are available for all people to see.

Most children researching topics for school think that anything on the internet is true and un-biased. I feel it's vital/impertative to be unbiased when dealing with religion.

[penpizdes]

> Re: "I feel it's vital/impertative to be unbiased when dealing with religion" That has got to be next to impossible. Anyway, when one is dealing with a philosophy that is evil there can be no "fairness doctrine". The Nazis philosophy is evil. Most German people are NOT evil. But during a point in their history the German people, their society adopted the evil philosophy of Nazism. They were duped into doing this because it provided some answers to pressing problems that had been dealing with for years; poverty. Poverty caused by the greed of the powers who won WW I. Their greed and desire for vengeance against the German people drove them to strip that nation of everything they could take and destroy what they could not. The English and French did this despite the pleas and forebodings of then President Woodrow Wilson. All people are quite similar as far as having equal percentages of very good and very evil people. There are always those who need little or no persuasion to do evil. Likewise there are always good people. Good people who would never harm anyone no matter the amount of persuasion they are tempted. Both kinds can be found in any society; any major group of people. When any society adopts a philosophy that permits one ounce of evil you can be certain that there will be that element present who are quite willing to carry out the permitted evil to the last degree. And there too is always the opposite. No amount of permission can persuade them to do an evil act. Good people can be found even among a nation that has turned Nazi. But does that make the Nazi philosophy any better? Any less evil? So too their are wonderful people who count themselves as Muslims, and who would never harm anyone. But that doesn't make the philosophy of Islam any less evil. Merely because particular members of such a group are so to speak "hard-wired" to be gentle folk and have a myopic view of the teachings of the philosophy they consider themselves a member, does not make the actual teachings of that philosophy any less evil. It is, therefore imperative that each society be viglante as to what it is their leaders are about to press upon them as a "new way of thinking" ..or "new order" or "new world order" as both president Bush and his father so fondly loves to tout. No matter how good their intent. Just remember the old saying has much truth, "...the road to hell is paved with good intentions". Ask any German of post Nazi Germany! Ask the Byzantines who were kind to the Muslims and allowed them to build their mosques in their city of Constantinople. Ask any Egyptian/Coptic who has found his race to be reduced by slaughter to 10% of the population and their entire nation over-run with Arab/Turks who now call themselves "Egyptian" but speak Arabic and not the true ancient language of Egypt, Coptic. The Egyptian people were and still are 100% Christian and NOT MUSLIM. What lives in Egypt now, the Muslim who rule and predominate in Egypt today are not Egyptians; they are Arab/Turks invaders who murdered all but 10% of the true Egyptian people who spoke Coptic for thousands of years and still speak it.

>

[LarryG1978]

Dear Vasili,

This is an interesting quote.

Just remember the old saying has much truth, "...the road to hell is paved with good intentions". I've never heard of that saying before, but it does to some extent make sense. Compromising for the sake of being "nice" can even mean that we would be asked to compromise our own faith.

Being un-biased however does not mean that we have to compromise our faith. it means that we are understanding and open to other people's opinions. However different situations call for different attitudes. For instance ... at a Bible lesson I can say to my listeners that it is better to go to church on Sunday than to go to football or soccer or baseball. I can't however go to a soccer match with my megaphone and start preaching how bad they all are and how they should repent. Firstly I would probably be dead in a few minutes, secondly the guys with the white truck and the suit with the long sleeves would take me away, and thirdly I am not representing Christ at all.

Isaiah says "He will not shout or cry out, or raise his voice in the streets." (Isaiah 42:2)If we also wish to be followers of Christ we should mimic Him and not improvise as some have done in the past. The Word of God is sacred and does not belong in the streets. It belongs in our homes. People who take the streets and spread the Word of God by door knocking are dishonouring God and the Word.

This might seem off the topic but what I am saying is that the Encyclopaedia is an object where one learns of many things and is offered an un-biased view of the world. Orthodox Books however can be biased and one sided since they are not teacing about all things but about the Truth, about God and the right way of worshipping Him of living a true Christian life etc...

We however should understand that by our silence and our living our faith in humility we are being more effective than confronting people all the time and degrading them because of their beliefs. This in most cases actualy could do more harm than good.

IN
ICXC

Kosmas

[LarryG1978]

"Tread wisely towards outsiders making the most of every opportunity. May your word always be filled with grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to respond to everyone." (Colossians 4:5-6)

[penpizdes]

> I think that we agree. However, when you say that being un-biased does not mean we have to comprise our faith; and that we can listen to others. I think your choice of words is a mixing of terms here. First you say we should be uncompromising regarding our faith, then you say we should be unbiased. I cannot see how one can be uncompromising and not biased. I think that what you are indicating is that we can listen others points of view without a confrontation or challenging them. I agree; just so long as their point of view is not dangerous. So there are exceptions as to how tolerant one should be; and evils such as Nazism, the KKK and Islam are not areas where I am willing to just sit back and listen. Islam, like Nazism is a philosophy of hate and intolerance. AND I AM NOT SAYING THAT ALL MUSLIMS ARE INTOLERANT AND FULL OF HATE. Look, statistically one can find about the same percentages of very, very good people and very, very evil people in any major group of people world wide be they Jews, Christians or Muslims or whatever. Therefore, one can find truly wonderful people who say they are Muslims. But that does not make the evil nature of the philosophy called Islam any less evil. Despite the fact that many, if not most Muslims would never overtly practice what Islam truly teaches, none-the-less Islam teaches to be intolerant and kill non-Muslims, and gives specific directions how to accomplish there murders! And in my book that makes Islam t an evil philosophy. Tolerance can go just so far. Having respect for wild poisonous snakes is one thing. Bringing them into one's home is quite another. And that is exactly what this nation is doing by inviting the practice of Islam in our nation. I would sooner have a regiment of Nazis live next door..and I hate Nazis. Vasilis

[WGfg4CCZ]

First you say we should be uncompromising regarding our faith, then you say we should be unbiased. I cannot see how one can be uncompromising and not biased. I think that if you are uncompromising about the faith you will be unbiased too. Unbiased must mean uncompromising in presenting truth. The only way you would feel that to present the faith without compromise would be 'biased' would be if you considered it no more true than alternative worldviews.
(By the way, Vasilis, while you can find in Islam such things as you mention, you can also find instruction to be peace-loving and caring for neighbour. Such is not so easily found in Hitler's writing: for this and many other reasons I think one should be very careful about seeing any equivalence between National Socialism and Islam.)

[LarryG1978]

I agree that we should strive to please God first and foremost.

Pleasing God means that we have to displease others. This I guess is the hard part of being Christian.

On the one hand we should "tread wisely" yet on the other we should not fear to say the Truth.

Thank God we live in countries where we are granted freedom of speach.

[Sheelldaw]

Vasilis originally posted:-

>> Just remember the old saying has much truth, "...the road to hell is paved with good intentions". <<

If I might interject, I must respectly disagree with this. Personally, I can see no truth in this at all. Intentions are aspirations, and good aspirations purify the heart. This is the essence of the Jesus Prayer. There is more truth in the saying that "the road to hell is paved with *evil* intentions," in my humble opinion:-

1 - "Charity ... hopeth all things." - 1 Corinthians 13:4,7

2 - "And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure." - 1 John 3:3

3 - "For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?" - Romans 8:24

Godly hope gives rise to that "single-minded" intention (aspiration) that lifts the mind continually to God in unceasing prayer.

(Message edited by theophilus on 25 May, 2005)

[LarryG1978]

I hope you visited the wikipedia pages and read what they say about Orthodoxy. I changed some things aboyut "idolatry" and "idols". I also changed some parts in "Icons". I may have to read the Church History to see if there is any bias there.

I guess we would have to rewrite whole pages about our Orthodox History which is usualy taking a western perspective.

[obegeLype]

Hell... good intentions...
I just heard a story about one of my favourite non-Orthodox (although now hopefully he is) characters- Winston Churchill.
Apparently once while he was campaigning for office and addressing a crowd, someone from the crowd shouted out to him, "I'd rather vote for the devil."
Without skipping a beat and with a twinkle in his eye Churchill replied, "Well just in case your candidate decides not to run would you consider voting for me?"
In Christ- Fr Raphael

[penpizdes]

> I agree. This is the true meaning. > > I like Emanuel Kant's "Categorical Imperative", that one should > measure all of their actions by examining what would happen if thus > and so action became universal law. Would the result be for the good > or for the evil? > Vasilis

[jamemeveRhype]

Hi,
Now if having "good intentions" are that good then why do people with "good intentions" often hurt others?

I think that everyone on earth has good intentions.

In fact even criminals might, in their own twisted minds, have good intentions.

* For instance, Hitler wanted to improve the conditions of his own country by wiping out the rest of the world. Look at how succesful Germany is today.
* Bin Laden wanted a better world... a world without Americans.
* The Western Christian Crusades wanted to see a successful spread of good Christian values by slaughtering the opposition.
* The North Korean government wants to be a stronger nation by making and possessing nuclear weapons.

So what is the definition of "a good intention"?

Obviuosly as Christians we have to have live a Christocentric life in order to approach the goodness of Christ.

Our Prototype is Christ. Our intentions to be like Him are the only "good intentions" that God would accept as being good. Every other intentions which are secular, worldly and selfish are bad.

So fooling ourselves into thinking that some people have good intentions where in reality they are bad can actually be harmful for us. Our paradigm, our model, our prototype is lost by the example of these "good intenders" who are in fact "bad intenders".

May God's will be done.

Peace in Christ,

Kosmas}

[LarryG1978]

"The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers." (Galatians 6:8-10)

[WGfg4CCZ]

I hope this is not too simplistic, but as I understand the saying

the road to hell is paved with good intentions it is simply saying: having the intention to start praying regularly and being happy with that intention alone is not going to take you off the road to hell. Actually doing the praying might help, though...

[kKFB1BxX]

Another possibility is to start our own "wiki". In fact somebody has already had this idea.

[LarryG1978]

Good on you Anthony

Your a legend, how did you do that?

[LarryG1978]

However, I would also like to see other people except Orthodox Christians reading un-biased entries in a Wikipedia. If we don't mix with the non-Orthodox then there is less of a chance of them being able to understand our Point of View.

Nevertheless,making our own Wiki is a great idea.