[opelayday]

With such a monotone line of thinking it is no wonder you can only think of historical characters as one-dimensional creatures classified as "brave", "clever", "loyal", "bastard', etc.

Also for your info, 诸葛亮 contribution in the initial defeat of caocao is questionable. Again, read the narrative. Most of the strategies were devised by Zhou Yu. The only contribution of 诸葛亮 was building that 120 foot tower and praying for northeast wind -- an event that is most probably a figment of Luo Guan Zhong's imagination.

Look at it this way: If in history, 诸葛亮 had indeed played a major role, Luo Guan Zhong would be all over it and would have dramatized it. But no, the only contribution was his supernatural divine inspiration of praying for northeast wind. Doesn't that tell you something?

After liu bei's death, 诸葛亮 was on a decline intellectually. The ultimate cause of his demise was his stubbornness and inflexibility of character.

Which incidentally is how folks like you are proposing to handle the PAP. Sad.

It is terrible mistake in Singapore to use intelligence as a measurement respect deserved by people. This is NEVER RIGHT.

As you also know 诸葛亮，who was the ingenious strategist of war and witty intellect of his time, who defeated CaoCao in brilliance. 诸葛亮 never reached the level of 关云长 in gaining respect of Chinese people from their time until now. There may be some shrines for 诸葛亮 but in numbers probably 1:1000 ratio to that number of temples and shrines honoring 关云长。

诸葛亮 is surely at least 10X more intelligent than 关云长。

But the people respect 关云长 instead.

诸葛亮 is a genius that can only be born as one.

关云长 is a courageous fearless and faithful brother in Chinese 忠义刚烈之士 one can be cultured disciplined and strictly uphold himself to be respected as a character like this.

Therefore people educated their children using 关云长 as role model, that children learn how to behave themselves and conduct themselves to gain respect.

Singaporeans wrongly and childishly believe that children can be educated to become genius and neglected to learn on how to conduct and behave themselves. It is sad that many Singaporean parents who could not give birth to genius children still dream to have their children EDUCATED & REMODELED into genius, while neglecting the important upbringing of the characters and conducts of their children to become respectable persons.

The worst part is they have silly and sad assumption that they would be respected if they became rich.

In 5000 years of Chinese culture, no one had gain respect for being rich, not much respect had been given to the very intelligent either. The well respected characters are the brave, righteous and faithful persons.

And bastrads like 曹操 is meant to be spat on.

You know?
Phui! Phui! Phui!

[JeremyBalll]

With such a monotone line of thinking it is no wonder you can only think of historical characters as one-dimensional creatures classified as "brave", "clever", "loyal", "bastard', etc.

Also for your info, 诸葛亮 contribution in the initial defeat of caocao is questionable. Again, read the narrative. Most of the strategies were devised by Zhou Yu. The only contribution of 诸葛亮 was building that 120 foot tower and praying for northeast wind -- an event that is most probably a figment of Luo Guan Zhong's imagination.

Look at it this way: If in history, 诸葛亮 had indeed played a major role, Luo Guan Zhong would be all over it and would have dramatized it. But no, the only contribution was his supernatural divine inspiration of praying for northeast wind. Doesn't that tell you something?

After liu bei's death, 诸葛亮 was on a decline intellectually. The ultimate cause of his demise was his stubbornness and inflexibility of character.

Which incidentally is how folks like you are proposing to handle the PAP. Sad.

I don't need to go into your desperate side-track arguments from characters of 关云长 to 诸葛亮, as far as 曹操 is concerned. He is a despicable bastard deserving NO RESPECT.

Entire Chinese culture changed since this bastard by using equal meanings of his name 操 to be one of the same as 奸。

If you could translate the name of 曹操 into English, then his English name is FUCKER 曹! - because the word 操 is same meaning was the word 奸 today. It clearly and totally reflect that the bastard is hated by billions of Chinese in the past centuries.

奸 is the lack of respectable integrity, cunning betraying distrust despicable bastards that means also ruined or disgraced in particular - sexually!

奸臣 means Evil or Greedy Ministers.

奸人 means Evil Persons disrespected and distrusted individuals.

操 is directly used as with the Abusive Insulting meaning same as FUCK. 操=FUCK, FUCK=操.

The famous abuse phrase in Singapore known as KNN if written in formal Chinese language it is 操你妈 means Fuck Your Mother.

This illustrate that it became a part of the culture relating to disrespect, hatred, and despise against the bastard 曹操 .

When ever 诸葛孔明 is used as comparison it is always related to wisdom and righteous use of strategies particularly in military. When 关羽 is used for comparison or illustration it must be courage integrity and faithful brotherhood. When 曹操 is used, it is none other than a cunning selfish bastard.

It had been a part of culture for centuries. You can desperately argue all you want, it is not going to change anything.

PAp is deadmeat I have no doubt & it is mostly due to useless old dog thief LKy. It gets clearer to more people by each day. It does not require any much efforts to take it down. It's self-destruction is very well underway. And it is unstopable!

[Crilosajsamq]

How dare you show disrespect to a great legend!

一操曹操；曹操就倒！

My own version. Isn't that better?

曹操是不能用说的啦。要用操的啦。操倒他就了结啦！

[Crilosajsamq]

曹操嘛--当然是用操的对不对？Once we FUCKED CaoCao, that bastard collapsed.

[medshop]

this cb yap hv the same mentality as the old dying bastard lky. they are always right and refuse to see form other point of view. just like the old fart, sg would by ruin by cb yap as well.

[Crilosajsamq]

this cb yap hv the same mentality as the old dying bastard lky. they are always right and refuse to see form other point of view. just like the old fart, sg would by ruin by cb yap as well.

Well that may be true that when I am not convinced I will not compromise. There is no such need and no such obligation on my part to follow others. I am entitled to my own opinion.

As for weather SG will be ruined, I don't control any organization. You must had drank too much this New Year. Take it easy! Happy NY!

[Crilosajsamq]

There is dispute within the academy of Archeology towards the tomb's ownership. DNA from the skull of Cao Cao will therefore be needed to make comparison against his descendent's DNA.


http://hk.news.yahoo.com/article/091230/4/fw0v.html

有專家質疑曹操墓出土之說


(明報)2009年12月30日 星期三 20:25



河南省文物局聲稱在安陽縣豐鄉西高穴村發現曹操高陵後，有學者專家質疑並稱可能是炒作。


重慶晚報引述專家稱，要確認是不是曹操本人的頭蓋骨，還需要把骨頭上提取的DNA和曹氏後人做 比對。


專家指出，曹操陵為何沒有出土墓誌？刻有魏武王銘文的石牌，都是從盜墓者手中獲得的嗎？確認曹操高陵的證據 何在？


針對種種疑點，河南省文物考古所研究員郝本性說，西漢到東漢年間的葬制，一般情況下以墓前立碑說明墓主人身 分。但到魏晉時期，又嚴禁在墓前立碑，因 而才出現將小型墓碑埋入墓中的情況，這雖是墓誌的雛形，但稱不上是真正意義上的墓誌。真正在墓中設墓誌並形 成墓葬定制，是在北魏以後。(綜合)





http://hk.news.yahoo.com/article/091227/4/fuar.html

超世之傑 奸臣形象


(明報)2009年12月28日 星期一 05:05

【明報專訊】在中國傳統小說和戲曲裏，曹操的奸角形象活靈活現；但在陳壽的《三國誌》裏，曹操是「非常之人 ，超世之傑」。
曹操（公元155-220年），字孟德，小字阿瞞，沛國譙（今安徽亳縣）人。據史書記載，他生於官宦世家，少時已以俠義自任。 入仕後曾參與鎮壓黃巾軍，後起兵討伐董卓，直至建安元年（196）迎漢獻帝定都許昌，挾天子而令諸侯，取得 政治上優勢。
漢末天下大亂，他實行抑制豪強兼併及用人唯才等一系列措施，並創立屯田制，讓士兵在休戰時期耕作，減輕糧食 負擔。建安5年，他在官渡大敗袁紹後逐漸統一中原。建安13年，他率軍南下企圖一統天下，但在赤壁之戰敗於 孫權與劉備聯軍，中國歷史上魏蜀吳三國鼎立，自此形成。
曹操軍事與文學造詣均高，著有《孫子略解》、《書接要》等軍事著作和《觀滄海》、《短歌行》，其詩作以氣魄 沉雄，慷慨悲壯見稱。
曹操晚年先後自封魏公與魏王，但未稱帝。宋代理學思想崛起，推崇忠節，曹操漸被文學著作描述成顛覆漢室的奸 臣。《三國演義》便因推崇漢室正統而大貶曹操。

[medshop]

Well that may be true that when I am not convinced I will not compromise. There is no such need and no such obligation on my part to follow others. I am entitled to my own opinion.

As for weather SG will be ruined, I don't control any organization. You must had drank too much this New Year. Take it easy! Happy NY!

u may not control any org but what is more of u being more opportunist when the time comes.

while u are entitiled not to comparomise or to follow others with your own opnion, u have shown how inflexible u are when dealing with others. while majority is not always right, they are not always wrong also.

[Crilosajsamq]

u may not control any org but what is more of u being more opportunist when the time comes.

while u are entitiled not to comparomise or to follow others with your own opnion, u have shown how inflexible u are when dealing with others. while majority is not always right, they are not always wrong also.

When there is no substance that can convince, the numbers or the term majority has no significance. When there is convincing substance a single little inspiration from anything has more significance than a billion persons. I had given enough face to persons who deserved all these while but there is limit to that.

If a person isn't absolutely firm in own belief will never come out to confront famiLEE LEEgime. I am not the 66% which could be easily convinced or swayed by famiLEE LEEgime, the majority of is also nothing to me.

[medshop]

When there is no substance that can convince, the numbers or the term majority has no significance. When there is convincing substance a single little inspiration from anything has more significance than a billion persons. I had given enough face to persons who deserved all these while but there is limit to that.

If a person isn't absolutely firm in own belief will never come out to confront famiLEE LEEgime. I am not the 66% which could be easily convinced or swayed by famiLEE LEEgime, the majority of is also nothing to me.

its not there is no subastances, its u yourself that is unwilling to accept what others think, just like lky. in your mind, u are already saying u r right, all others r wrong. u brag about changes, yet u youself are unwilling to accept what u deem as no substance.

not everyone will confront pap in the way u do. u see opposition party doing that? so are the opposition party not in your so call abolutely firm in their own belief? while i believe opposition party still can do alot more than what are they doing now, i still do not believe they should do it your way.

what is majority is to u when i already say u r just simply a opportunist? u do not need the majority support at all when u can just simply come in and claim ur share of victory when the time comes.

[Crilosajsamq]

its not there is no subastances, its u yourself that is unwilling to accept what others think, just like lky. in your mind, u are already saying u r right, all others r wrong. u brag about changes, yet u youself are unwilling to accept what u deem as no substance.

not everyone will confront pap in the way u do. u see opposition party doing that? so are the opposition party not in your so call abolutely firm in their own belief? while i believe opposition party still can do alot more than what are they doing now, i still do not believe they should do it your way.

what is majority is to u when i already say u r just simply a opportunist? u do not need the majority support at all when u can just simply come in and claim ur share of victory when the time comes.

Everyone is entitled to do it in their own way. Especially when they don't see eye to eye. There is no right nor wrong the definition of that is relative and most of the time silly. I am doing what I think is necessary, and it is even more necessary when NO OTHERS ARE DOING when it had to be done. Get it?

It there are others already doing what I am doing, then I don't have to do. These day I have stop doing what I was doing in e.g. 2006, simply because there are already enough people doing that. I was doing that initially because there were NO BODY doing e.g. CPFB protest. I no longer have to do it because there are already sufficient people doing these. Therefore I can move on to the next new area. I will do what is necessary, I will not let famiLEE LEEgime nor the opposition stop me, I will pay the necessary price. Get it?

My view is not the same, I think most people only think in very narrow spectrum, therefore they can not convince me. I can not limit myself to their level, nor comply to their standard, nor concede to their demands.

I came out to fight for something I believe in, which is not entirely same as others. Because you don't know what I am doing, you have no idea therefore you are making wild guesses, just like some others.

As far as the current stage is concerned there is still famiLEE LEEgime around which is a common target. After famiLEE LEEgime, the different objectives among fighters will clearly show up. I am not seeking the same future Singapore. The definition of victory is not even the same. The direction of reform is not the same. It is naive to assume that everyone is trying to go to the same destination, I can tell you that it is not.

[Crilosajsamq]

Everyone is entitled to do it in their own way. Especially when they don't see eye to eye. There is no right nor wrong the definition of that is relative and most of the time silly. I am doing what I think is necessary, and it is even more necessary when NO OTHERS ARE DOING when it had to be done. Get it?

It there are others already doing what I am doing, then I don't have to do. These day I have stop doing what I was doing in e.g. 2006, simply because there are already enough people doing that. I was doing that initially because there were NO BODY doing e.g. CPFB protest. I no longer have to do it because there are already sufficient people doing these. Therefore I can move on to the next new area. I will do what is necessary, I will not let famiLEE LEEgime nor the opposition stop me, I will pay the necessary price. Get it?

My view is not the same, I think most people only think in very narrow spectrum, therefore they can not convince me. I can not limit myself to their level, nor comply to their standard, nor concede to their demands.

I came out to fight for something I believe in, which is not entirely same as others. Because you don't know what I am doing, you have no idea therefore you are making wild guesses, just like some others.

As far as the current stage is concerned there is still famiLEE LEEgime around which is a common target. After famiLEE LEEgime, the different objectives among fighters will clearly show up. I am not seeking the same future Singapore. The definition of victory is not even the same. The direction of reform is not the same. It is naive to assume that everyone is trying to go to the same destination, I can tell you that it is not.

its not there is no subastances, its u yourself that is unwilling to accept what others think, just like lky. in your mind, u are already saying u r right, all others r wrong. u brag about changes, yet u youself are unwilling to accept what u deem as no substance.

not everyone will confront pap in the way u do. u see opposition party doing that? so are the opposition party not in your so call abolutely firm in their own belief? while i believe opposition party still can do alot more than what are they doing now, i still do not believe they should do it your way.

what is majority is to u when i already say u r just simply a opportunist? u do not need the majority support at all when u can just simply come in and claim ur share of victory when the time comes.

Everyone is entitled to do it in their own way. Especially when they don't see eye to eye. There is no right nor wrong the definition of that is relative and most of the time silly. I am doing what I think is necessary, and it is even more necessary when NO OTHERS ARE DOING when it had to be done. Get it?

It there are others already doing what I am doing, then I don't have to do. These day I have stop doing what I was doing in e.g. 2006, simply because there are already enough people doing that. I was doing that initially because there were NO BODY doing e.g. CPFB protest. I no longer have to do it because there are already sufficient people doing these. Therefore I can move on to the next new area. I will do what is necessary, I will not let famiLEE LEEgime nor the opposition stop me, I will pay the necessary price. Get it?

My view is not the same, I think most people only think in very narrow spectrum, therefore they can not convince me. I can not limit myself to their level, nor comply to their standard, nor concede to their demands.

I came out to fight for something I believe in, which is not entirely same as others. Because you don't know what I am doing, you have no idea therefore you are making wild guesses, just like some others.

As far as the current stage is concerned there is still famiLEE LEEgime around which is a common target. After famiLEE LEEgime, the different objectives among fighters will clearly show up. I am not necessarily6 seeking the same future Singapore as you have in mind. The definition of victory is not even the same. The direction of reform is not the same. It is naive to assume that everyone is trying to go to the same destination, I can tell you that it is not. It is narrow to limit to only one direction, and rule out all others and narrowly believe that everyone wants to go in the same direction and that here isn't other ways.



After removing famiLEE LEEgime, there would be factions each wanting to their own direction, but there is only one Singapore. I can tell you that some ways are even more unacceptable than famiLEEs to some. If the post LEEgime government goes in directions that I disagree with I promise to stop them and if necessary fight them harder than I had fought famiLEE LEEgime, and I will do so for just the very same reason - in accordance with my own believes.

[medshop]

[QUOTE=uncleyap;374438]Everyone is entitled to do it in their own way. Especially when they don't see eye to eye. There is no right nor wrong the definition of that is relative and most of the time silly. I am doing what I think is necessary, and it is even more necessary when NO OTHERS ARE DOING when it had to be done. Get it?

It there are others already doing what I am doing, then I don't have to do. These day I have stop doing what I was doing in e.g. 2006, simply because there are already enough people doing that. I was doing that initially because there were NO BODY doing e.g. CPFB protest. I no longer have to do it because there are already sufficient people doing these. Therefore I can move on to the next new area. I will do what is necessary, I will not let famiLEE LEEgime nor the opposition stop me, I will pay the necessary price. Get it?

u are only doing it for the sake of doing it and getting the lime light while u can. y dun u ask y no ppl is doing it? what have change since u say u have been doing it? practically nothing. u claim cpf protets but where are the protest now since we got more urgent issues on hand. dun keep bragging some small achievement like what pap scums best in doing it, perhaps it can't even be considered achievement at all.

My view is not the same, I think most people only think in very narrow spectrum, therefore they can not convince me. I can not limit myself to their level, nor comply to their standard, nor concede to their demands.

I came out to fight for something I believe in, which is not entirely same as others. Because you don't know what I am doing, you have no idea therefore you are making wild guesses, just like some others.

yeah so i see u think u high up while others at the bottom, just like ur elite lky. u and ur lky are just plain elite while others are dirt peasant right? u fight for something so glorious while others are what? in your own eyes u think u are the best and u know best and whats gd for ppl. u have the vision. ur mindset is same as lky. u think u know best. everybody is just plain losers.

As far as the current stage is concerned there is still famiLEE LEEgime around which is a common target. After famiLEE LEEgime, the different objectives among fighters will clearly show up. I am not seeking the same future Singapore. The definition of victory is not even the same. The direction of reform is not the same. It is naive to assume that everyone is trying to go to the same destination, I can tell you that it is not.

no one seeks the same future (and i'm sure nobody here has the same thinking other than u who thinks everyone has it), thats y we have so many political parties but i see u belong to none yet u involve yourself in most of them. it either u are the one who is naive to think u can beat the crap out of pap or whoever win, u win.

[Crilosajsamq]

[quote=Whats4;374495]

Everyone is entitled to do it in their own way. Especially when they don't see eye to eye. There is no right nor wrong the definition of that is relative and most of the time silly. I am doing what I think is necessary, and it is even more necessary when NO OTHERS ARE DOING when it had to be done. Get it?

It there are others already doing what I am doing, then I don't have to do. These day I have stop doing what I was doing in e.g. 2006, simply because there are already enough people doing that. I was doing that initially because there were NO BODY doing e.g. CPFB protest. I no longer have to do it because there are already sufficient people doing these. Therefore I can move on to the next new area. I will do what is necessary, I will not let famiLEE LEEgime nor the opposition stop me, I will pay the necessary price. Get it?

u are only doing it for the sake of doing it and getting the lime light while u can. y dun u ask y no ppl is doing it? what have change since u say u have been doing it? practically nothing. u claim cpf protets but where are the protest now since we got more urgent issues on hand. dun keep bragging some small achievement like what pap scums best in doing it, perhaps it can't even be considered achievement at all.

My view is not the same, I think most people only think in very narrow spectrum, therefore they can not convince me. I can not limit myself to their level, nor comply to their standard, nor concede to their demands.

I came out to fight for something I believe in, which is not entirely same as others. Because you don't know what I am doing, you have no idea therefore you are making wild guesses, just like some others.

yeah so i see u think u high up while others at the bottom, just like ur elite lky. u and ur lky are just plain elite while others are dirt peasant right? u fight for something so glorious while others are what? in your own eyes u think u are the best and u know best and whats gd for ppl. u have the vision. ur mindset is same as lky. u think u know best. everybody is just plain losers.

As far as the current stage is concerned there is still famiLEE LEEgime around which is a common target. After famiLEE LEEgime, the different objectives among fighters will clearly show up. I am not seeking the same future Singapore. The definition of victory is not even the same. The direction of reform is not the same. It is naive to assume that everyone is trying to go to the same destination, I can tell you that it is not.

no one seeks the same future (and i'm sure nobody here has the same thinking other than u who thinks everyone has it), thats y we have so many political parties but i see u belong to none yet u involve yourself in most of them. it either u are the one who is naive to think u can beat the crap out of pap or whoever win, u win.

I will do what I believe is necessary and yet have not yet been done. If some one have done what is necessary than I need not do so. What I see as necessary is not necessarily the same as what you see.

is the part that is BIG JOKE, because LKy also said he is doing this. Of course that definition is relative and most of the time (again) invalid.

I have my believes and my vision, I am willing to hear if you had something to share, but I have no obligation to agree nor adopt.

I heard from many and most are not convincing because their scopes had limited to very narrow spectrum. My believes is where my resolve and strength and courage etc came from, I trust it because it had worked well for me, it helped me a long way, the famiLEE LEEgime is not able to stop me. I am given the helps and inspirations because I had carried out the right thing, and it should continue. I follow the guidance from above as well as my own conscience. If I had made mistakes I will receive signals which I can recognize.

You are second guessing my definition and my goal, without even adequately know the fundamentals. You have no clue and you made wild guesses again.

I came across views made on the basis of western values some of which with foundations are silly and I had rejected and will never accept. For the same reasons, I had attacked famiLEE LEEgime because they suck up to the west and betrayed Asians. If the post LEEgime govt of Singapore get more pro-west than LEEgime, I will fight against them as well. There is no question about this.