[Nurse_sero]

My point is that even French and German companies will have access.

They will? Well that will keep France and Germany quiet then. Small wonder Chancellor Merkel was buddying up with President Bush a while ago. As for President Chirac..........hmmmm..........not so sure there, I wonder if Total will get a look in for example.

[Enrivaanonock]

It's still about oil in Iraq
It's still about oil in Iraq - Los Angeles Times

A centerpiece of the Iraq Study Group's report is its advocacy for securing foreign companies' long-term access to Iraqi oil fields.

WHILE THE Bush administration, the media and nearly all the Democrats still refuse to explain the war in Iraq in terms of oil, the ever-pragmatic members of the Iraq Study Group share no such reticence.

Page 1, Chapter 1 of the Iraq Study Group report lays out Iraq's importance to its region, the U.S. and the world with this reminder: "It has the world's second-largest known oil reserves." The group then proceeds to give very specific and radical recommendations as to what the United States should do to secure those reserves. If the proposals are followed, Iraq's national oil industry will be commercialized and opened to foreign firms.

The report makes visible to everyone the elephant in the room: that we are fighting, killing and dying in a war for oil. It states in plain language that the U.S. government should use every tool at its disposal to ensure that American oil interests and those of its corporations are met.

It's spelled out in Recommendation No. 63, which calls on the U.S. to "assist Iraqi leaders to reorganize the national oil industry as a commercial enterprise" and to "encourage investment in Iraq's oil sector by the international community and by international energy companies." This recommendation would turn Iraq's nationalized oil industry into a commercial entity that could be partly or fully privatized by foreign firms.

This is an echo of calls made before and immediately after the invasion of Iraq.

Big Oil in, stability out under new Iraqi law
Asia Times Online :: Middle East News - Big Oil in, stability out under new Iraqi law

While debate rages in the United States about the military in Iraq, an equally important decision is being made inside Iraq - the future of its oil. A draft Iraqi law proposes to open the country's currently nationalized oil system to foreign corporate control. But emblematic of the flawed promotion of "democracy" by the administration of US President George W Bush, this new law is news to most Iraqi politicians.

A leaked copy of the proposed hydrocarbon law appeared on the Internet at the same time that it was introduced to the Iraqi Council of Ministers (cabinet). The law is expected to go to the Iraqi Council of Representatives within weeks. Yet the Internet version was the first look that most members of Iraq's Parliament had of the new law.

Many Iraqi oil experts, such as Fouad al-Ameer, who was responsible for the leak, think this law is not an urgent item on the country's agenda. Other observers and analysis share Ameer's views and believe the Bush administration, foreign oil companies and the International Monetary Fund are rushing the Iraqi government to pass the law.

Not every aspect of the law is harmful to Iraq. However, the current language favors the interests of foreign oil corporations over the economic security and development of Iraq. The law's key negative components harm Iraq's national sovereignty, financial security, territorial integrity and democracy.

The exploration and production contracts give firms exclusive control of fields for up to 35 years, including contracts that guarantee profits for 25 years. A foreign company, if hired, is not required to partner with an Iraqi company or reinvest any of its money in the Iraqi economy. It's not obligated to hire Iraqi workers, train Iraqi workers or transfer technology.

Under the proposed law, the council has the ultimate power and authority to approve and rewrite any contract using whichever model it prefers if a "two-thirds majority of the members in attendance" agree. Early drafts of the bill, and the proposed model by the US, advocate very unfair, and unconventional for Iraq, models such as production sharing agreements (PSAs), which would set long-term contracts with unfair conditions that may lead to the loss of hundreds of billions of dollars of the Iraqi oil money as profits to foreign companies.

Passing this oil law while the political future of Iraq is unclear can only further the existing schisms in the Iraqi government. Forcing its passage will achieve nothing more than an increase in the levels of violence, anger and instability in Iraq and a prolongation of the US occupation.

[Enrivaanonock]

Your point still doesn't make sense. Why doesn't the US government make sure only US oil companies have control then? After all, we went in for the oil, why don't we get all the oil and all the profits along with it?

Too easy.

Because the fraud would be too obvious and people like you would have nothing to counter the obvious with. Without question, the US would take the lion's share of the spoils.

[Mappaindy]

Think the worst about the invasion- and it's all true.

Foreign investments - God forbid any thing new that allows more money to flow into Iraq, especially if they are joint ventures - that's just sinister.

[TOD4wDTQ]

Not entirely, until today. Now it does.

So the liberals were just full of sh*t up until this point

and if that's the case how can you be so sure they aren't full of the same now?

Varus

[usatramadolusa]

Foreign investments - God forbid any thing new that allows more money to flow into Iraq, especially if they are joint ventures - that's just sinister.

What a cute describtion for by-passing oil revenues from the Iraqis directly to the foreign "investors" pockets. I thought your nation invaded Iraq out of charity. How about some zero-percent loans to fire up Iraqs national oil industry? Or are they too stupid to get it out of the soil themselves, now that Saddam "left for paradise"?

[Nurse_sero]

Foreign investments - God forbid any thing new that allows more money to flow into Iraq, especially if they are joint ventures - that's just sinister.

The devil's in the detail - the terms need to be carefully examined. The first point that has to be made is that the oil in Iran is/was nationalised. Now it's going to be privatised. How much evidence do you need that the invasion and occupation was about oil?

[TOD4wDTQ]

How much evidence do you need that the invasion and occupation was about oil?

Obviously more than just vague accusations that the govn is getting screwed because they're privatizing an industry. Oh and historically industries that are private are infinitely more successful than state run companies. H*ll why do you think China is so pro-capitalism these days?

Varus

[Nurse_sero]

Obviously more than just vague accusations that the govn is getting screwed because they're privatizing an industry. Oh and historically industries that are private are infinitely more successful than state run companies. H*ll why do you think China is so pro-capitalism these days?

Varus

No worries when the details come out that should throw more light on the subject.

Privatisation is more successful? I don't think so, not for natural monopolies anyway - but I suppose that's another subject away from this particular fourm area.

China is pro-Capitalism because of Deng Zhao Ping.

[TOD4wDTQ]

No worries when the details come out that should throw more light on the subject.

Privatisation is more successful? I don't think so, not for natural monopolies anyway - but I suppose that's another subject away from this particular fourm area.

China is pro-Capitalism because of Deng Zhao Ping.

Capitalism creates wealth. Wealth enables freedom and independence. China still desires to conquer the world but they've come to realize that they can do much more if their citizenry are producing and consuming more.

Varus

[vasyasvc]

So the liberals were just full of sh*t up until this point

and if that's the case how can you be so sure they aren't full of the same now?

Varus I'm speaking for myself. I don't really know what a Liberal is. I just could never imagine that the puppet Iraqi government would sell out its own resources. I was wrong. They really are traitors to the Iraqi people.

Of course, you know what's going to happen to them, don't you . The Deputy PM came within a whisker of assassination on Saturday. I forsee a steep rise in attacks on oil installations and anybody associated with oil production. You'd have to be mad to work there.

What's the price of a barrel of blood ?

[TOD4wDTQ]

What's the price of a barrel of blood ?

Quotes like this illustrate that you are a rabid left wing radical. Thanks for playing though.

Varus

[vasyasvc]

Originally Posted by moon
What's the price of a barrel of blood ?

Quotes like this illustrate that you are a rabid left wing radical. Thanks for playing though.

Varus I've been labelled and left. Devastating.

[cialesxtr]

Since this story is all over the media (and this forum), how is it "under the radar"?

It's an act of legislation by a democratically elected government.

Matt

[vasyasvc]

This morning even the BBC was touting this story as 'a breakthrough' in Iraq's oil dispute. That story has now disappeared from their site. It didn't even mention western involvement in the draft law.

That's why it was 'under the radar' , Larson. Many , no doubt of similar mindset to yourself, were hoping that western involvement wouldn't become an issue.

Now it has. Sorry about that. Lol.


And the puppet regime is not 'democratically' elected, Larson. The wartime election was a sham.


Posted (much) earlier today;
Quote:I may be writing more on this later, if I have the stomach for it, but read through the above New York Times report on the new oil law approved by the Iraqi government – and gasp in shock-and-awed wonder that the leading newspaper in the United States could file a story like this and only note – in the next-to-last paragraph – that Iraq's oil will controlled by the iron fist of a "central body called the Federal Oil and Gas Council" which will have "a panel of oil experts from inside and outside Iraq" as part of the operation… without telling us that these "oil experts" will in fact be executives and representatives of American and other Western oil companies.

When he's not globetrotting with rightwing bagman and arms-dealing cult godli... (Bush, Piece, Her, Rightwing, Being)-Chris Floyd - Empire Burlesque - High Crimes and Low Comedy in the Bush Imperium

[icerrelmCam]

So when the last American soldier has been chased from Iraq, what will stop the Iraqis from nationalizing the oil industry, like every other oil producing nation (except one) has done?

[cialesxtr]

This morning even the BBC was touting this story as 'a breakthrough' in Iraq's oil dispute. That story has now disappeared from their site. It didn't even mention western involvement in the draft law.

That's why it was 'under the radar' , Larson. Many , no doubt of similar mindset to yourself, were hoping that western involvement wouldn't become an issue.

Now it has. Sorry about that. Lol.

No need to be sorry - I don't give a crap about it, so your "revelation" doesn't bother me at all.

And the puppet regime is not 'democratically' elected, Larson. The wartime election was a sham.

Hmmm. So not all democratically elected governments are legitimate. A new standard from moon. Excellent.

Matt

[Nurse_sero]

So when the last American soldier has been chased from Iraq, what will stop the Iraqis from nationalizing the oil industry, like every other oil producing nation (except one) has done?

Are we talking Shi'ite oil, Sunni oil or Kurdish oil?

[vasyasvc]

Hmmm. So not all democratically elected governments are legitimate. A new standard from moon. Excellent.

Matt You really should work on the delivery of your attempted sarcasm, Larson.

You come across as a fanboy.

[Mappaindy]

What a cute describtion for by-passing oil revenues from the Iraqis directly to the foreign "investors" pockets. I thought your nation invaded Iraq out of charity. How about some zero-percent loans to fire up Iraqs national oil industry? Or are they too stupid to get it out of the soil themselves, now that Saddam "left for paradise"?

[emphasis mine]
How about forgiving debt for Iraq?