[corolaelwis]

I know you don't pay critical attention, but check out post 37. Further, While I recognized this as just one more unfounded complain by you. But this part of the statement makes absolutely NO sense regardless of your intent

Doniston, look at your post, 37 and then look at Hank's post, 35.

Now for homework today do you think you could make your post look like his?

Really, its not a failure of the system, its you!!!!

[9V42h1eT]

I'll ask the obvious question. If this guy can get the death penalty for killing a fetus (and its mother), under this new 2003 Texas law defining a fetus as a person, what penalty do abortion doctors get for deliberately killing THOSE fetuses?

----------------------------

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...02-07-19-35-27

Texas Man Gets Death for Killing Fetus

By ELIZABETH WHITE
Associated Press Writer
Feb 7, 7:35 PM EST

SAN ANTONIO (AP) -- A former youth pastor was sentenced to death Wednesday for killing a teenager and her fetus in what is believed to be the first such order in Texas, the nation's busiest death penalty state.

Adrian Estrada, 23, was convicted Friday of one count of capital murder for the death of Stephanie Sanchez and the fetus, of which he was the father.

"This is a significant case," said Bexar County prosecutor Susan Reed. "This is significant for the state."

A 2003 Texas law amended the definition of the word "individual" to include an "unborn child at every stage of gestation from fertilization until birth."

The death sentence is Texas' first in the death of a fetus, said Dave Atwood, founder of the Texas Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty, which monitors capital cases.

Sanchez, 17, was three months pregnant Dec. 12, 2005, when her body was found in her family's home. She had been choked and stabbed 13 times. During the trial, DNA evidence was presented to show Estrada was the father.

Estrada, a former youth pastor for a church, admitted to the stabbing the day after the killings. Prosecutors also said he worked out at a gym and went shopping after the crime. He showed no emotion when his punishment was read.

"The bad guy that you don't suspect is the one that you can't protect your loved one from," said Scott Simpson, Bexar County assistant prosecutor. "And that's what he was and that's what he is."

Estrada's attorney, Suzanne Kramer, had argued that her client made bad decisions.

"It that enough to execute him? Is that enough to kill him?" she asked the jury.

According to the Web site of the National Conference of State Legislatures, at least 36 states have homicide laws defining a fetus as a person.

[meteeratymn]

See Its Liberals who think its OK for a doctor or Woman kill a child.Remember a woman who shot herself in the stomach cause she couldnt afford an abortion? Well the PIGS wouldnt charge her with murder. They wouldnt charge her with an illegal posseson of a firearm nether.Lok at Scott Peterson they gave him death for killing Lacy his wife and her fetus. We need to Change these laws.If you shoot yourself or try to kill yourself THATS ATTEMPTED MURDER CHARGE If you live.If a doctor performs an abortion THATS MURDER! At Kansas doctor who gave underage teens an abortion and the DA wouldnt charge him anything.This was on OReilly Factor. Its Liberals who think Doctors and women are extempt of murder.

[Susanleech]

well, considering he also killed a teenager........

[annouhMus]

This is bad presidence and will likely be overturned. It will certainly end up with the supreme court.

[Usogwdkb]

If it was just the unborn child that was murdered, I have to wonder if this guy would have gotten the death penalty. However, he has murdered two people, so even if the fetus conviction is taken to the SC, he can still face execution for killing the mother.

Louisiana has a feticide law which carries a lesser sentence than a homicide so even if a baby is killed when the mother is in labor and on her way to the hospital, the murderer gets very little jail time. Bastards.

[bettingonosports]

[QUOTE=Little-Acorn;915214]
I'll ask the obvious question. If this guy can get the death penalty for killing a fetus (and its mother), under this new 2003 Texas law defining a fetus as a person, what penalty do abortion doctors get for deliberately killing THOSE fetuses?


The article makes no mention of the man being convicted on two counts of murder, therefore we can only assume that he was convicted on one count of murder, ie stabbing the mother, and it is for that he is receiving the death penalty. I wouldn't try and read too much more into it.

[9V42h1eT]

He was convicted on one count of CAPITAL murder - murder deserving the death penalty. I gather that if he had just killed a girl who was not pregnant, but everything else was the same, then it would not have been capital murder.

Anyone know what the different degrees of murder are in Texas?

[corolaelwis]

Too many, way too many. At the federal level there's the law that was enacted after Scott Peteron killed Laci and Connor which does now bring a charge for murdering an unborn child but i think that's ony in conjuntion with the mother being killed too.

Depending on the way this law was phrased and dependant on who's sittng on the court at the time if the SC upholds this law it may be in fact the strongest argument for overturning Roe if and when that is next brought before them which will be pretty soon as SD has put in strong bans against abortions so it may be a race as to which case they hear first.

I guess they can scrap the Anna Nicole case off the books....

[Susanleech]

sorry, but if someone takes a knife to some womans stomach--that should at least warrant sitting in prison to the point of death.

[buyviagraonlineusatoday]

sorry, but if someone takes a knife to some womans stomach--that should at least warrant sitting in prison to the point of death.

Exactly.

[annouhMus]

I'll ask the obvious question. If this guy can get the death penalty for killing a fetus (and its mother), under this new 2003 Texas law defining a fetus as a person, what penalty do abortion doctors get for deliberately killing THOSE fetuses?

----------------------------

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...02-07-19-35-27

Texas Man Gets Death for Killing Fetus

By ELIZABETH WHITE
Associated Press Writer
Feb 7, 7:35 PM EST

SAN ANTONIO (AP) -- A former youth pastor was sentenced to death Wednesday for killing a teenager and her fetus in what is believed to be the first such order in Texas, the nation's busiest death penalty state.

Adrian Estrada, 23, was convicted Friday of one count of capital murder for the death of Stephanie Sanchez and the fetus, of which he was the father.

"This is a significant case," said Bexar County prosecutor Susan Reed. "This is significant for the state."

A 2003 Texas law amended the definition of the word "individual" to include an "unborn child at every stage of gestation from fertilization until birth."

The death sentence is Texas' first in the death of a fetus, said Dave Atwood, founder of the Texas Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty, which monitors capital cases.

Sanchez, 17, was three months pregnant Dec. 12, 2005, when her body was found in her family's home. She had been choked and stabbed 13 times. During the trial, DNA evidence was presented to show Estrada was the father.

Estrada, a former youth pastor for a church, admitted to the stabbing the day after the killings. Prosecutors also said he worked out at a gym and went shopping after the crime. He showed no emotion when his punishment was read.

"The bad guy that you don't suspect is the one that you can't protect your loved one from," said Scott Simpson, Bexar County assistant prosecutor. "And that's what he was and that's what he is."

Estrada's attorney, Suzanne Kramer, had argued that her client made bad decisions.

"It that enough to execute him? Is that enough to kill him?" she asked the jury.

According to the Web site of the National Conference of State Legislatures, at least 36 states have homicide laws defining a fetus as a person.

Sorry, but there is nothing shown here that the sentence was because of the killing of the fetus.

it lists one conviction for murder, and obviously the young woman was murdered.

simply stating that a fetus was also killed DOES NOT show that he was convicted of it's murder.

This is, or at least almost is, a Strawman.

[Sdinozes]

I don't think this will effect abortion in any way, as the two situations are much too different.

For abortion, the mother is responsible for the life of her baby and the decision rests with her on whether to terminate the baby or keep it. There are restrictions on whether she can get an abortion or not, and it must be performed by a doctor that is legally able to do such procedures.

In this case, a man killed a woman, resulting in the unwanted death of her child.

No real parallel.

[annouhMus]

This is bad presidence and will likely be overturned. It will certainly end up with the supreme court.

After further consideration, "STRIKE THIS"

[annouhMus]

I don't think this will effect abortion in any way, as the two situations are much too different.

For abortion, the mother is responsible for the life of her baby and the decision rests with her on whether to terminate the baby or keep it. There are restrictions on whether she can get an abortion or not, and it must be performed by a doctor that is legally able to do such procedures.

In this case, a man killed a woman, resulting in the unwanted death of her child.

No real parallel.

Agreed, I was taken in but the OPs spin.

[LesLattis]

Forget all the BS about fetusus and Life vs. Choice aguments:

Can we all agree that:

A) Killing Woman = BAD
b) Killing Pregnant Woman = WORSE ??

Please stop with all the pro-life or pro-choice overtones. What would you have done as a juror?

[ahagotyou]

Murdering a person (even an unborn person) is illegal according to federal law.

[annouhMus]

Murdering a person (even an unborn person) is illegal according to federal law.

Show me where? I beleive The supreme court has denied that an unborn is a person.

[meteeratymn]

What about Dr Kevorkian? So assistant suicide isnt ok right?

[Andoror]

This is bad presidence and will likely be overturned. It will certainly end up with the supreme court.

These type of positions aren’t real positions, they don’t work in the real world.
A loving mother with child being assaulted and resulting in the death of her baby but just bruises to her is most certainly a capital offense. If the man who killed her baby was charged with simple misdemeanor assault “as to accommodate a class action lawsuit by a small group of socialist 60’s activists,” you disembody a justice system result of thousands of years of trial and error.

Those who are lost and don’t see for whatever reason, need to slow down and not view what we tell you as an assault on what you believe to be an ideology or political position. We are right here. No arrogance in the declaration and no aggressions in our intend to save you and civilized man.