[dahlilaninfo]

You liberals always tell half truths to scare the public. The truth is Ryan's plan revamps the tax code eliminating tax loop holes thus allowing a lower tax tax rate. Remember Obama's close friend GE made billions yet only paid a pitons in tax, all because of loop holes. This revamping of the existing tax code to eliminate these loop holes everyone should be in favor of. Are you not?

Oh, I'm all in favor of eliminating loopholes. But until someone has the courage to explicitly state which loopholes are to be targetted, it's all mamby-pamby rhetoric and loose talk.

The revenue loss from Ryan's tax cuts for the rich and powerful would cost almost $3 trillion over the next ten years. In order to close enough loopholes to cover that cost, you'd have to do some really serious loophole closing. For example, even completely eliminating one of the biggest deductions in the tax code, a deduction not normally considered a "loophole," the mortgage interest deduction, wouldn’t come close.

"Loopholes" are almost entirely written by and for the rich. So you believe the Republican Party is going to close their precious loopholes that they paid so much to get written into our tax code? Seriously? What planet do you live on?

Do you really think that the party that caters to big business's every whim is going to close loopholes so that General Electric's tax bill would go from zero to 25% of their profits? Please.

Ryan's plan isn't serious. It's a fraud.

[D6Ri5u13]

You liberals always tell half truths to scare the public. The truth is Ryan's plan revamps the tax code eliminating tax loop holes thus allowing a lower tax tax rate. Remember Obama's close friend GE made billions yet only paid a pitons in tax, all because of loop holes. This revamping of the existing tax code to eliminate these loop holes everyone should be in favor of. Are you not?

The loopholes will never be removed. Not as long as money writes policy. And that sure as hell won't change.

[D6Ri5u13]

I believe your talking about all the money Obama gave to these companies and the unions.



Here I take it you want to continue to borrow and spend to keep all your beloved entitlements in place. Yes borrow and spend liberal, with no idea on how to pay for anything.



To you liberals, communism is your goal. We know that, you want big daddy government telling you how to live, you can then sit back and go into a vegetable state of mind.



I agree with the Cuban cigars and the Rum, but the pay thing, hell we pay all the illegals here at home way more than 5 bucks an hour, not a day. Yes those illegal aliens that you liberals let into this country taking good American jobs.

I hate communism. Hate to burst that bubble. BUT seems like the cons love it more than the far left. You guys love enriching china, and allowing our dollars to build up their military. So just admit you love communism. admit that as long as a communist state makes a few rich, it is perfectly fine! Red States, mean commie loving states. Traitors is what you guys are, you just refuse to admit it. The communists have their own elites, and you guys are no different.

[dahlilaninfo]

Former Reagan OMB Director David Stockman's take on the Ryan plan:

"It doesn't address in any serious or courageous way the issue of the near and medium-term deficit," David Stockman told me in a Thursday phone interview. "I think the biggest problem is revenues. It is simply unrealistic to say that raising revenue isn't part of the solution. It's a measure of how far off the deep end Republicans have gone with this religious catechism about taxes."

Couldn't agree more.

Since some posters here are libertarian, here's a libertarian economist's take on Ryan's plan.

[casinobonusfrees]

cut 20% all programs... everything ..

raise ss cap to 120k, and eliminate EITC.

[D6Ri5u13]

Former Reagan OMB Director David Stockman's take on the Ryan plan:

"It doesn't address in any serious or courageous way the issue of the near and medium-term deficit," David Stockman told me in a Thursday phone interview. "I think the biggest problem is revenues. It is simply unrealistic to say that raising revenue isn't part of the solution. It's a measure of how far off the deep end Republicans have gone with this religious catechism about taxes."

Couldn't agree more.

Since some posters here are libertarian, here's a libertarian economist's take on Ryan's plan.

Hell, lets get into more wars and cut taxes again. Then when the deficets grow,cut taxes to the bone. Let's send more jobs to china to decrease the tax base. THEN, you would have to get rid of most of the gov't. That is the Repub plan, make no mistake. The means justify the end, as Stalin knew. He is the poster child of the modern Cons. Who also love Red Chiina. Just not cuba as not enough cheap labor there for our greedy elites to use. They don't have a billion poor folks to use to create their wealth.

[ljq0AYOV]

Doing more with less?

No wonder libs hate the idea. It's the very basis of efficiency...

[Peertantyb]

Oh, I'm all in favor of eliminating loopholes. But until someone has the courage to explicitly state which loopholes are to be targetted, it's all mamby-pamby rhetoric and loose talk.

The revenue loss from Ryan's tax cuts for the rich and powerful would cost almost $3 trillion over the next ten years. In order to close enough loopholes to cover that cost, you'd have to do some really serious loophole closing. For example, even completely eliminating one of the biggest deductions in the tax code, a deduction not normally considered a "loophole," the mortgage interest deduction, wouldn’t come close.

"Loopholes" are almost entirely written by and for the rich. So you believe the Republican Party is going to close their precious loopholes that they paid so much to get written into our tax code? Seriously? What planet do you live on?

Do you really think that the party that caters to big business's every whim is going to close loopholes so that General Electric's tax bill would go from zero to 25% of their profits? Please.

Ryan's plan isn't serious. It's a fraud.

You continue with you lie, lowering taxes would only come into effect if the existing tax policy was revamped. What you want us to believe is there is going to be reduced taxes with no tax policy changes. That is dead wrong and it's a lie.

[Peertantyb]

The loopholes will never be removed. Not as long as money writes policy. And that sure as hell won't change.

Your absolutely right as long as Obama is in office. All you have to do is look at the rosy relationship between Obama and GE. However the Repubs are trying to change that. Cut out the loopholes and lower taxes. Obama will never do that to his CEO buddies.

[Noilemaillilm]

I bet I am, considering the fact that I'm not "saying" anything.

I asked to profoundly ridiculous questions, and the stumped you. You were a complete failure at answering either of them.

But, hey, you're consistent, I'll give you that much...

Wow, you characterize your own post as "profoundly ridiculous", I can't handle this much truth from the right in one day....

[Peertantyb]

To you conservatives, fascist theocracy is your goal. We know that you want big Father government to control what you think, read, hear, and say, so that you can work for the Company, producing what the wealthy tell you to produce, at the hours they tell you, at the pay that they tell you, because God ordains it to be so.

Oh you think we want big Father government, I don't think so, we can manage just fine without government. In fact we want government out of our way, it is your big daddy government that is strangling this country. Take oil as an example, your Obama is shutting down permits, to raise the price of oil to energize is windmills and solar BS. I mean he is so stupid to think he's going to fly around air-force 1 on windmill power or power our ships and move our cargo or heat our homes. This is the guy you want telling you how to live. Only you liberals love to be told how to live, not us Conservatives.

[Peertantyb]

Hell, lets get into more wars and cut taxes again. Then when the deficets grow,cut taxes to the bone. Let's send more jobs to china to decrease the tax base. THEN, you would have to get rid of most of the gov't. That is the Repub plan, make no mistake. The means justify the end, as Stalin knew. He is the poster child of the modern Cons. Who also love Red Chiina. Just not cuba as not enough cheap labor there for our greedy elites to use. They don't have a billion poor folks to use to create their wealth.

Blue your old hat, wars that's exactly what loved Obama did without a way to pay for it. Obama kept the same tax rate that Bush put in place, yes that was again your loved Obama. Deficits have grown the largest under who? Obama, of which it is your loved Obama that did not want to cut anything.

You see Blue it is the Dem's not the Pub's that are doing what you claim. In fact Obama is going to raise the national debt this year by 1.6 trillion and on and on. This is your Obama the borrow and spend president. Look at my signature.

[ljq0AYOV]

Wow, you characterize your own post as "profoundly ridiculous", I can't handle this much truth from the right in one day....

I guess I shouldn't be surprised at your profound inability to properly decipher what I wrote.

The questions were profoundly simple. They needed to be, as they were posed to liberals, and liberals prove, time and time again, that complex questions are far too much for them to handle...

[Old-old-Ivy]

But, then you go off the rails of reality, and pretend that it's the rich that are being penalized.

Really, how do you arrive at the notion that the people in the nicest houses, with the nicest things are the people who are being punished, and the people living at the edge of poverty are the people being favored? Because they are, by infringing upon their rights to keep their property.

You see, everybody has a right to keep their property, because the 5th Amendment says that people shall be safe and secure from unreasonable search and seizure.

And to take stuff away from people just because they have more stuff is very unreasonable indeed.

Now, they should pay their taxes just like everybody else, and they should have the same voting strength just like everybody else, and money should not have an undue influence in politics that it does have today, which is one of the shortsightedness our Founding fathers had.

But to take things away from people out of envy and jealousy is just wrong, and shows that people don't understand that America was founded in order to get away from that mindset, and that they too have the same opportunities to make in America as everybody else does.

And the thing is this: if the government or the people have the power to take away anything they want, they can do the exact same thing to you.

And why anyone would want to live in a society where there is no protection against that kind of thing is beyond me.

Human rights are for everyone, and you just can't pick and choose which group gets them. Selecting which group gets them and which group does not is not really human rights, it's special privileges and double standards.

[SallyIsNice5]

So the wealthy will still be paying more in pure dollars and in percentage.

[wrewsTear]

The GINI coefficients between us and our peers tells a lot of the story. We have some of the worst wealth disparity in the developed world.

Granted, our status as "developed" may change over the next century.

The GINI coefficient is just a poor statistic but with the way technology is moving all developed nations' status as "developed" could very well change in the next 100 years, so I don't know what that really means.

[meteeratymn]

Well, it really isn't fair for one group of people to be paying higher taxes than another group. The fair thing to do would be to have one flat rate for all citizens of America.

People do have a right to their earnings you know.

However, it's not fair for any one single group of people to have more tax breaks than another, too.

But that's just too radical. We've got to punish the rich because they have more stuff and take their stuff away. How dare the rich have more stuff than anybody else.

More stuff, more taxes only equates

[hujdrftgkas]

Do more with less. Do more with less.
This is the GOP's challenge to Americans.

Well, not ALL Americans. Mostly just poor Americans, and some middle class Americans too.
But rich Americans won't have to tackle that challenge. The GOP is making sure they'll be able to have more, not less. Much more. No "making do" for the rich. No sir.

In addition to savage cuts for poor folks, the Ryan plan calls for a massive tax cut on the richest Americans. The plan would sharply cut taxes on corporations and to bring the tax rate on high earners down to its lowest level since 1931.

Why? Because taxes are so high on the only interest group the Republicans really care about? Hardly.

Well--I really don't know any "TRILLONAIRS" out there that can pay this:--we are currently at 14.3 TRILLION in the hole--and we've got 18,000 baby boomers retiring DAILY and that will continue for the next 15 years--which results in another 53 TRILLION in unfunded liability.

WE'RE NOT COMING OUT OF THIS ONE.

So what's one TRILLION dollars? Sit down before you click this link.

What does one TRILLION dollars look like?

Our dollar is going to be worse than the peso. It's going to collapse.

And which SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP are YOU--and how much money do you want?--LOL.

[dahlilaninfo]

Oh you think we want big Father government, I don't think so, we can manage just fine without government. In fact we want government out of our way, it is your big daddy government that is strangling this country. Take oil as an example, your Obama is shutting down permits, to raise the price of oil to energize is windmills and solar BS. I mean he is so stupid to think he's going to fly around air-force 1 on windmill power or power our ships and move our cargo or heat our homes. This is the guy you want telling you how to live. Only you liberals love to be told how to live, not us Conservatives.

That seems like a remarkably juvenile opinion to have. Is there anyone in your life who's a Democrat? Any friends who don't believe in everything you believe in? For that matter, do you have any friends? Do you enjoy discussing differing opinions with others or does that frighten you?
Do you mind my asking how old you are and what your education level is? Do you live in America? Have you served in the military?
I only ask these questions because you sound remarkably sheltered and as if you live in a right-wing fantasy world.

[dahlilaninfo]

WE'RE NOT COMING OUT OF THIS ONE.

Few mainstream economists agree with you. Instead of pictures of what 1 trillion pennies look like, just use percentages. That way you can reasonably compare our situation to times past, and to other countries.

The debt is big, but so is our economy.