DiscussWorldIssues - Socio-Economic Religion and Political Uncensored Debate - View Single Post - Is there sutta basis for the modern bifurcation of jhanas?

**pokerbonuscod** · 01-03-2012, 02:58 AM

I am not quite sure what you are trying to say here but if jhana-induced vipassana is not sufficient then what is?

hi Deshy

imo, in jhana, the mind will have an emphatic experience of selflessness and will see the changing intensity of the rapture & happiness vibrations

but there is not enough arising & passing in jhana for strong vipassana resulting in dispassion because the mind, for the most part, is too "one"

in jhana, it is like time stops

this is different to say basic kayanupassana, where the mind can see time clicking away with each arising & passing of an in-breath & out-breath

one in-breath arises & ceases, forever. one moment of time is gone forever, as life is one breathe closer to death

one out-breath arises & ceases, forever. one moment of time is gone forever, as life is one breathe closer to death

in jhana, this kind of seeing (vipassana) does not occur

in jhana, the mind may develop a dispassion towards rapture & happiness by seeing clearly it is not Nibbana

but there is not enough arising & passing in jhana for strong vipassana resulting in destruction of the asava because the mind, for the most part, is too "one"

also, what insight that occurs in jhana is often defiled, immature and/or not yet to total vision of a Buddha

kind regards

There are these five aggregates where a monk should stay, keeping track of arising & passing away (thus): 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance. Such is feeling... Such is perception... Such are fabrications... Such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.' As he stays keeping track of arising & passing away with regard to these five aggregates, any conceit that 'I am' with regard to these five aggregates is abandoned. This being the case, he discerns, 'I have abandoned any conceit that "I am" with regard to these five aggregates.'

Maha-suññata Sutta And what is the development of concentration that, when developed & pursued, leads to the ending of the effluents? There is the case where a monk remains focused on arising & falling away with reference to the five aggregates: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its passing away. Such is feeling, such its origination, such its passing away. Such is perception, such its origination, such its passing away. Such are fabrications, such their origination, such their passing away. Such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.' This is the development of concentration that, when developed & pursued, leads to the ending of the effluents.

Samadhi Sutta

01-03-2012, 02:58 AM	#5
pokerbonuscod Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 556 Senior Member	I am not quite sure what you are trying to say here but if jhana-induced vipassana is not sufficient then what is? hi Deshy imo, in jhana, the mind will have an emphatic experience of selflessness and will see the changing intensity of the rapture & happiness vibrations but there is not enough arising & passing in jhana for strong vipassana resulting in dispassion because the mind, for the most part, is too "one" in jhana, it is like time stops this is different to say basic kayanupassana, where the mind can see time clicking away with each arising & passing of an in-breath & out-breath one in-breath arises & ceases, forever. one moment of time is gone forever, as life is one breathe closer to death one out-breath arises & ceases, forever. one moment of time is gone forever, as life is one breathe closer to death in jhana, this kind of seeing (vipassana) does not occur in jhana, the mind may develop a dispassion towards rapture & happiness by seeing clearly it is not Nibbana but there is not enough arising & passing in jhana for strong vipassana resulting in destruction of the asava because the mind, for the most part, is too "one" also, what insight that occurs in jhana is often defiled, immature and/or not yet to total vision of a Buddha kind regards There are these five aggregates where a monk should stay, keeping track of arising & passing away (thus): 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance. Such is feeling... Such is perception... Such are fabrications... Such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.' As he stays keeping track of arising & passing away with regard to these five aggregates, any conceit that 'I am' with regard to these five aggregates is abandoned. This being the case, he discerns, 'I have abandoned any conceit that "I am" with regard to these five aggregates.' Maha-suññata Sutta And what is the development of concentration that, when developed & pursued, leads to the ending of the effluents? There is the case where a monk remains focused on arising & falling away with reference to the five aggregates: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its passing away. Such is feeling, such its origination, such its passing away. Such is perception, such its origination, such its passing away. Such are fabrications, such their origination, such their passing away. Such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.' This is the development of concentration that, when developed & pursued, leads to the ending of the effluents. Samadhi Sutta
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