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Old 01-14-2008, 07:51 PM   #13
bp9QxekG

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Oct 2005
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Europeans have better vacation packages, but the other points are silly and in certain cases factually incorrect. Also, just a note about an American paradox is that rich people cluster in places like Manhattan where there is kind of a self imposed poverty, but middle income people can get a big house and a life similarly rich people in Europe can hardly imagine. America is surprisingly equal in that respect, for all our talk about rich and poor. Anyways - here's some rebuttals on your specific omparisons. And here are mine:

Food: Check out a Zagat guide and it will always point out that even though Americans think New York dining is expensive, its cheaper than comparable places anywhere in Europe. What I said was: "We could start with the food supply in America. It's mostly genetically poisoned frankenfood. If you want to actually eat healthy in America, you pay much more than in Europe."

First, New York is not typical of America. Restaurant prices/quality, even if what you said were true, is not the aspect of the food supply that I was talking about; I specifically mentioned food supply in regards to genetically modified crops and the price of eating healthy food that isn't stewing in a soup of chemicals. Don't even get me started on the meat supply in America. Crap food is plentiful and cheap, fresh healthy food costs a premium.
Your focus on restaurants is puzzling until it is considered that you're a New Yorker and probably eat out more than you eat home cooked food. So that's what you're thinking about when you read my comment. Again, we in NYC are not typical of people outside the City or in most of Europe. Or the world for that matter. More relevant than Zagat restaurant ratings might be an examination of the prices/offerings in supermarkets. In America, they are huge, with so much variety on offer, but like I said the wholesome stuff is ridiculously overpriced.

I spend quite a bit of time in Europe and much of it is not in hotels or tourist zones but in self-catering apartments or with friends, so you might say I've shopped in many, many supermarkets there. The variety is smaller, but the standards are higher and the prices for wholesome foods are lower. (increasingly not for us though, with the dollar sinking like Titanic.)
In Dusseldorf, for example, you find stores selling "bio" food (organic) for amazingly low prices all over the place.


Besides, America is a diverse country and we have restaurant variety here, which I like. London has decent ethnic food but most of Europe doesn't. In America, even second tier cities like Dallas and Atlanta have great food and great variety. We do have a portion control problem - but our issue isn't frankenfood - we just eat too much because food is so much cheaper than it is elsewhere in the world. Again, restaurants seem to be your main concern. And yes, frankenfood IS an issue if you are paying attention to what is legal and typical in Europe compared to here.

Education: The US indisputably has the worlds best univesity system. If you are rich or willing to submit to outrageous loans.

And what about our public schools, before you even get near a university? I was really talking more about public education, which is what matters as an average child growing up when you are stuck in a place. If you were lucky enough to go to a public school with computers and books more important than security guards and metal detectors I suppose it all looks peachy keen. There are two Americas.

Also, we don't force people in high school to make vocational choices but rather encourage them to broadly explore a liberal arts education and pursue their dreams. huh?

Finally, on the one issue Americans like to worry about, poor people in the US go to school and consistently achieve happier and better outcomes as fully integrated members of society than anyone gives them credit for. Any facts to offer, or are you giving us personal impressions? Are you just talking about universities again? The American public school system is crap in so many communities (not the rich ones, of course). SO much inequality and underfunding. Just really pathetic for a country like this.
Your defense seems limited to such a narrow realm of existence and, perhaps, experience.

Nightlife: When European cities start running their subways 24 hours, come back and we'll talk. Doesn't matter. We run the subways 24 hours a day, but run our nightlife industry into the ground.

Anyway, most cities in America shut down by 2 am. And don't have a subway at all.
In Madrid or Athens, people are still having their after dinner drinks.

And have you ever heard of Vegas? Ever heard of someone NOT actually interested in giant silicone tits or plastic versions of the real thing in actual cities?
I've been to Vegas 4 times for menswear industry conventions and I can tell you that the nightlife there is not great unless Celine Dion, erotic dancers or the Hard Rock Cafe are what you get into to.

Plus, they don't even run subways at all in Vegas

Parks: Yosemite, YellowStone, etc. Those aren't urban spaces so that isn't a rebuttal to any of my points.

All I know is everything I ate in Italy was exorbitantly expensive except for the pasta. This may be in part because it was in tourist zones, but still, I was surprised by how high the prices were. Yes, you must have stayed in tourist zones. Understandable, and typical for most Americans with their small vacation packages; you didn't have the chance or the interest to see the real neighborhoods.
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