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**Rememavotscam** · 08-11-2011, 05:20 PM

as i said you are generalising too much when you have no clue.

from Thourios

the ottoman empire was an ISLAMIC empire, the austrohungarian wasn't, and the conditions and situations were different.
you do understand the differences between islam and christianity don't you?

the greek revolution didn't happen because of nationalism, it happed due to "real reasons" that had to do with oppresion, economical, social, political and so on.
simply enought, when you got a muslim who will chop your head off with the first opportunity, if you do make a revolution usualy there are far greater reasons than concepts like nationalism.
also nationalism itself developed after the greek revolution, along with the identity swift.

i do suggest you do read abit before you comment on my answer.

first of, you should not take the precursors for empires to intervene too seriously, like the russian empire using Christianity to attack the Ottomans at every chance they get, it is clear that empires usually behave in a pragmatic way, otherwise they would not last very long.

secondly, the conditions for ethnic tension all over the Balkans are the same regardless of imperial ruler, the outcome and reasons for revolt differ yes, but not in a radical way, Greek nationalists may have used Christianity as a motivator, but it was not the main reason to separate themselves from Ottoman rule, if you believe that you do so with little understanding of history.

third, nationalism had everything to do with the breakup of the Ottoman empire, without it Greece would not have become independent as it did, though Greece relied more on western sympathies and the balance of power then anything else, it did not manage independence on its own.

nationalism in the Balkans spread to Christian merchants/translators first as these where the people who behaved as intermediates between the Ottoman empire and the rest of europe, until nationalism caused open rebellions, after that other ethnic groups took over due to Ottoman fears that they relied too much on Greeks (mainly) for their contact with an increasingly powerful europe.

from your other posts ect ive noticed that you keep seeing the world through religion allot, it would serve you best to not do so when dealing with history, the biggest agent in history is Economical and that is usually the agent for change in society...

08-11-2011, 05:20 PM	#27
Rememavotscam Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 500 Senior Member	as i said you are generalising too much when you have no clue. from Thourios the ottoman empire was an ISLAMIC empire, the austrohungarian wasn't, and the conditions and situations were different. you do understand the differences between islam and christianity don't you? the greek revolution didn't happen because of nationalism, it happed due to "real reasons" that had to do with oppresion, economical, social, political and so on. simply enought, when you got a muslim who will chop your head off with the first opportunity, if you do make a revolution usualy there are far greater reasons than concepts like nationalism. also nationalism itself developed after the greek revolution, along with the identity swift. i do suggest you do read abit before you comment on my answer. first of, you should not take the precursors for empires to intervene too seriously, like the russian empire using Christianity to attack the Ottomans at every chance they get, it is clear that empires usually behave in a pragmatic way, otherwise they would not last very long. secondly, the conditions for ethnic tension all over the Balkans are the same regardless of imperial ruler, the outcome and reasons for revolt differ yes, but not in a radical way, Greek nationalists may have used Christianity as a motivator, but it was not the main reason to separate themselves from Ottoman rule, if you believe that you do so with little understanding of history. third, nationalism had everything to do with the breakup of the Ottoman empire, without it Greece would not have become independent as it did, though Greece relied more on western sympathies and the balance of power then anything else, it did not manage independence on its own. nationalism in the Balkans spread to Christian merchants/translators first as these where the people who behaved as intermediates between the Ottoman empire and the rest of europe, until nationalism caused open rebellions, after that other ethnic groups took over due to Ottoman fears that they relied too much on Greeks (mainly) for their contact with an increasingly powerful europe. from your other posts ect ive noticed that you keep seeing the world through religion allot, it would serve you best to not do so when dealing with history, the biggest agent in history is Economical and that is usually the agent for change in society...
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