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**sisuarmalmicy** · 03-01-2011, 05:25 AM

I would need to know the specifics. Simply saying a civilian was targetd is not enough. If someone is involved, for example, as an informer, then he's not longer a civilian. You are free to bring up a case for me too look at.

Yes, always. From your own link.

The fact that they called up doesn't change the fact that 21 people died, and I wouldn't have been born had my dad not left when he did.

Perhaps they should have bombed places when they were closed and empty if property damage was their only aim.

In the above instance the person who planted the bomb and his/her cohorts would be guilty of murder, planting a bomb in a building where it is clear to anyone that there will be lots of people is murder.

You can't seriously compare the two. Paisley wanted to turn it into a sectarian war when religion wasn't the motivation for the IRA. What he did was paint all Catholic Irish as the enemy. He helped define how the Ulster Scots would perceive the conflict.

Well, to Paisley and his ilk Irish Catholics were the enemy. I'm not saying he was an admirable person but he wasn't any worse than those spewing vitriol on the other side. Both sides had their leaders who fomented trouble and, morally, they bear some responsibility- if not legally- for the actions their followers took based on their rhetoric.

Well, they wouldn't be a sceretive intelligence organization if they didn't behave secretly. It's not the first, or the last time, people will bring up their actions.

It's already established that British agents, M15 or not, supplied information and weapons to Loyalist paramilitary groups.

Fair play to them, MI5 are tasked with protecting our 'interests' and the gov't of the day felt it was imperative that anti-British groups didn't gain an upper hand, so to that end supporting Loyalists made sense. I'm not condoning it but Loyalists aren't the worst people the British government, or most other governments, have worked with/aided.

As you say violent organisations attract violent people, whenever wherever. It seems that determined whether you were a Loyalist or a Republican was whether you were born into a Unionist or a Republican family/community. Most of the time people who plant bombs are either sadistic or delusional or psychopaths looking for a thrill or being paid very well.

The problem is that it's hard to separate fact from fiction/conjecture whenever someone writes about the actions of MI5/MI6/CIA/Mossad etc There is too much room for bullshit, if they can produce credible evidence then it becomes a different matter.

---------- Post added 2011-02-28 at 22:26 ----------

[/COLOR]lol@want a cheeseburger bobby sands. A funny tag.

Thank you.

03-01-2011, 05:25 AM	#35
sisuarmalmicy Join Date Oct 2005 Posts 409 Senior Member	I would need to know the specifics. Simply saying a civilian was targetd is not enough. If someone is involved, for example, as an informer, then he's not longer a civilian. You are free to bring up a case for me too look at. Yes, always. From your own link. The fact that they called up doesn't change the fact that 21 people died, and I wouldn't have been born had my dad not left when he did. Perhaps they should have bombed places when they were closed and empty if property damage was their only aim. In the above instance the person who planted the bomb and his/her cohorts would be guilty of murder, planting a bomb in a building where it is clear to anyone that there will be lots of people is murder. You can't seriously compare the two. Paisley wanted to turn it into a sectarian war when religion wasn't the motivation for the IRA. What he did was paint all Catholic Irish as the enemy. He helped define how the Ulster Scots would perceive the conflict. Well, to Paisley and his ilk Irish Catholics were the enemy. I'm not saying he was an admirable person but he wasn't any worse than those spewing vitriol on the other side. Both sides had their leaders who fomented trouble and, morally, they bear some responsibility- if not legally- for the actions their followers took based on their rhetoric. Well, they wouldn't be a sceretive intelligence organization if they didn't behave secretly. It's not the first, or the last time, people will bring up their actions. It's already established that British agents, M15 or not, supplied information and weapons to Loyalist paramilitary groups. Fair play to them, MI5 are tasked with protecting our 'interests' and the gov't of the day felt it was imperative that anti-British groups didn't gain an upper hand, so to that end supporting Loyalists made sense. I'm not condoning it but Loyalists aren't the worst people the British government, or most other governments, have worked with/aided. As you say violent organisations attract violent people, whenever wherever. It seems that determined whether you were a Loyalist or a Republican was whether you were born into a Unionist or a Republican family/community. Most of the time people who plant bombs are either sadistic or delusional or psychopaths looking for a thrill or being paid very well. The problem is that it's hard to separate fact from fiction/conjecture whenever someone writes about the actions of MI5/MI6/CIA/Mossad etc There is too much room for bullshit, if they can produce credible evidence then it becomes a different matter. ---------- Post added 2011-02-28 at 22:26 ---------- [/COLOR]lol@want a cheeseburger bobby sands. A funny tag. Thank you.
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