[DesautocaD]

Hey everyone,
I was wondering if I could get some pointers on manners during taikai. Not the actual matches, but in terms of waiting, conversations, solo practice, etc. I've noticed that I tend to get restless while waiting, and would like to improve on this.
Cheers!
Nick Petersen

[goctorsurger]

try to meet new people.

[autolubitelone]

Cheering for the competitors is okay (clapping, "Let's go Jim!" -- that kinda thing). Shouting out specific instructions or warning them that they might be close to the boundary of the court is a big no-no.

[prehighaltitudesjj]

Cheering for the competitors is okay (clapping, "Let's go Jim!" -- that kinda thing).

Most places. Strictly speaking, no.

[CULTDIAMONDS]

Most places. Strictly speaking, no.

Really, I thought that was ok as well. Is there a place in the rules where it covers this, or is one of those things that is just understood?

[TNgqZhLR]

Really, I thought that was ok as well. Is there a place in the rules where it covers this, or is one of those things that is just understood?

I don't see anything in the rules but I only have the old ones available online, my current copy is at home. There isn't anything about not coaching, either but I think most people understand that coaching is not allowed while the competitors are fighting.

Just a few weeks ago I was at a seminar in Winnipeg where we did a team match. Murao-sensei encouraged us to cheer, although he said normally that was prohibited. Most tournaments I've been to the teams cheer for their members when they are up.

Not sure there's much they can do about the audience cheering.

[Abebpabeniemo]

They were all cheering like crazy this weekend at the PNKF, including Steveston. Had to tell a couple of mine to hold it down to a reasonable level. I was on the lookout for any coaching.

[Nurfzerne]

I was just at a judo tournament this past weekend, my first time as shimpan for judo. They allow coaching there, though. There's space by the mats for one coach for each side, and they are yelling out advice quite a lot.

Marsten-sensei, is there anything written down about cheering and/or coaching anywhere? These are things I've understood for a long time but I don't recall ever seeing a written rule.

[FourEsters]

So far the discussion seems to consider only Kendo.

In terms of Iaido Tai Kai;
Only the 'folks on the floor' [and officials] should be moving around;
spectators - keep quiet! [shows respect - and increases the pressure...lol]
A respectful round of applause for the 2 competitors who have just contested the final at their grade level;
Perhaps the applause may be held back until ALL finals are completed/decided......
A generous round of applause at prize-awarding time.............

No whooping, hollering, yelling, whistling, cheering, over-effusive clapping......... [I have witnessed all of these at Kendo events]

Iaido - in fairness - is more about dignity and restraint than the bully-boys [I include me] of the Kendo world appreciate.

[salomal-qask]

I knew about iaido, generally you can almost hear a pin drop at the taikais, but for kendo I've always seen people cheering. I have seen people get reprimanded for coaching but never cheering. Interestingly enough though someone was cheering during a recent finals match and the shushin said something, the person quieted down fast, it was in japanese so I have no idea what was said.

[Tusanoc]

Usually there is a statement issued at the managers meetings of the bigger taikai, such as the WKC where 'the management' say 'no cheering' and 'clapping only', however, in reality there is nothing in the rules that allow this to be enforced. Under the rules that most taikai are played under, a player can't be disqualified for the actions of spectators, or the vocalisations of their coach. Nor can the coach or spectators be 'punished'... so in the end they are kind of 'guidelines'...

[escolubtessen]

I was just at a judo tournament this past weekend, my first time as shimpan for judo. They allow coaching there, though. There's space by the mats for one coach for each side, and they are yelling out advice quite a lot.

Marsten-sensei, is there anything written down about cheering and/or coaching anywhere? These are things I've understood for a long time but I don't recall ever seeing a written rule.

The rule book only addresses the players. The guide likewise only mentions the players. It has always been one of the cultural guidelines governing behavior at the tournament as far as I know. Even in Japan I have seen that change over the years with quite a bit of cheering. Still, coaching is frowned upon, but at the US Junior nationals I witnessed it going on in 3 different languages.

I find it can interfere with calling points if it is too excessive. Makes it hard to hear and focus with someone directly behind you yelling. At Steveston one year there was someone yelling like crazy for one of the college kids. She then screamed out "kick his ass". At that point I stopped the match, turned around and told her to shut up or I would give him a hansoku.

[excivaamome]

I knew about iaido, generally you can almost hear a pin drop at the taikais, but for kendo I've always seen people cheering. I have seen people get reprimanded for coaching but never cheering. Interestingly enough though someone was cheering during a recent finals match and the shushin said something, the person quieted down fast, it was in japanese so I have no idea what was said.

I saw that, but he did not reprimand them for cheering. At some point, somebody in the group was warning one the players that he was going to go out of bounds. It was then that the shushin told them that this was not acceptable.

[Amerworma]

Hey everyone,
I was wondering if I could get some pointers on manners during taikai. Not the actual matches, but in terms of waiting, conversations, solo practice, etc. I've noticed that I tend to get restless while waiting, and would like to improve on this.
Cheers!
Nick Petersen

Your thread has been hijacked to discuss spectator's behaviour, rather than competitor's.

Prior to matches beginning, it's appropriate to warm up in bogu as a group. Often this is done on a dojo-by-dojo basis, but if it's a friendly it's nice to warm up with new acquaintances. Once matches have started, it's best to limit yourself to stretches and suburi without kiai so the shinpan have some quiet for refereeing.

I find conversation awkward before matches and avoid it, but some people find it settles them. If that's the case for you, let a friend/sempai know that you'd appreciate a little pep talk before hand. Keep it quiet as the shinpan will be refereeing.

If you're competing as part of a team, you will generally be sitting in seiza while your team-mates compete. It's best just to sit still and clap for your team-mate's cuts that look good to you. This is a great opportunity to figure out what the shinpan are looking for, if you haven't done so already. No vocalization and keep the facial expressions to a minimum.

When it's coming up for your turn, get your men and kote on and stand up and stretch your legs. You can encourage team-mates by banging your do with your right kote instead of clapping. Making sure you've got the right ribbon on and relax.

If you're competing in an individual competition you'll likely be waiting with a group of strangers. Try to avoid kiai, fumikomi, and shinai contact when warming up, as again this can be distracting for the shinpan. I generally hold off on the conversation until after I've competed, but other seem happy to converse while they wait. Just keep it quiet.

There's lots to keep you busy while you wait - watching matches, checking your bogu, rehearsing waza. Just don't get distracted and miss your turn!

[sztc38tg]

Hey everyone,
I was wondering if I could get some pointers on manners during taikai. Not the actual matches, but in terms of waiting, conversations, solo practice, etc. I've noticed that I tend to get restless while waiting, and would like to improve on this.
Cheers!
Nick Petersen

Just introduce yourself to the Kent people and they will take care of you at the tournament.

[ñàéäèíã]

I know people who wear iPod earphones to stop people coming up and making small talk while they are waiting for a match. They don't necessarily have any music playing. b

[LSDDSL]

I know people who wear iPod earphones to stop people coming up and making small talk while they are waiting for a match. They don't necessarily have any music playing. b

Yeah, I made that mistake early on. Unless you know the person well, don't be chit-chatting with them before their matches. Lots of people just want to concentrate.

[VQdeochratis]

I prefer to be laughing loudly drawing pointed stares from various sensei. There is always some hilarious joke or another that gets us a few looks. Depends whats actually going on, if i'm up soon I have my men on and that usually discourages any discussion beyond someone saying 'good luck' Any other time I am off chatting with people/meeting new people and keep my ears peeled for the kiai of people who I want to watch/videotape. Also volunteer to help if you know whats going on. 9/10 the volunteers dont understand how brackets work or how to properly record scores and hansoku, especially if they are hangers on and not people that do kendo. Now that i'm sandan I'm sure i'll get roped into shinpan duty as well.

[Erawise]

The suggestion, especially to newer folks who are not up to compete for a while, to volunteer, is well placed. There's lots to learn at taikai beyond that which you can get from your matches. The general gist otherwise is to be aware of things bigger than yourself going on around you and be respectful of what they might need in order to do their jobs.

One solid piece of advice I've heard communicated in the past - when you have your men on, you will find you talk louder if you're speaking to someone standing right next to you than you otherwise would without it. Be careful of what you say. You might think you're talking to yourself or being discrete when you say something like - 'That wasn't a kote... or, get a load of that guy's jacked up kamae..."

I'm not going to pretend that everyone here, myself included is perfect and has never thought, much less vocalized some of those kinds of things in the past. But when you're waiting for a match and everyone can clearly hear what you think of the shinpan's abilities, much teeth sucking will likely result - at best. Regardless, people will think you're a douche.

[saopinax]

Adding to what's already been said, you never know who is standing around you or who is in earshot. It's best to treat everyone with courtesy and not say anything disparaging. I've watched things get said that have had a way of coming back to people, either during shinsa or at a banquet. Or worse.

As others have already mentioned, either find a safe spot to warm up quietly or volunteer. When you're busy volunteering you don't have time to worry about your upcoming matches.