Buddha's Certainty?
 

Hello,

I'm new and not really a buddhist but it is the closest philosphy to my own and I am considering the studying of buddhism for my own personal growth.

I have many questions but I would like to ask the following first:

In Buddha's teachings did he ever suggest, admit or hint at the possibility of being completely wrong on any aspect of his words, did he portray infallible wisdom or admit potential errors due to ignorance?

Sorry if that is too strong, its not my intention to insult only to find clarification.

Many thanks

Hi Ticktock,
Because Buddhism isn't a philosophy or a religion in the sense we understand them Buddha was only ever speaking from personal experience. He went through what he taught and instructed his followers not to take anything on faith but to verify it for themselves.

No insult taken btw. Welcome on board.

Thank you Srivijaya,

I want to keep an open mind whilst only accepting what I can comprehend as a truth myself.

Did Buddha ever express doubt in his own teachings, I find it an important aspect to development, from Socrates I have taken to heart "I know, I know nothng"

Welcome Ticktock,

In answer to your question, not that I know of from my readings of the Pali Canon so far.

He didn't started teaching others until after his enlightenment..

This article "The Buddha and his Dhamma" might be of some help to you:


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/a.../wheel433.html


with kind wishes,

Aloka-D http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/grin.gif

Hello Ticktock,

Be welcome to BWB.

Feel free to ask any questions. At "Buddhism for Beginners" forum there are two attachments; "What is Buddhism?" and "On The Four Noble Truths" by Tamara Engle. Both readings are a good starting point.

Kind wishes,

http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/grin.gif

Ticktock,

My personal take on this is that Buddha indeed developed a deep understanding of mind, the origin of the endless state of unsatisfactoriness and the way to its cessation.

The teachings of Buddha are not exactly a philosophy nor a religion. In some way it is a science of mind that is supported by three fundamental characteristics: The ethical aspect, the meditative aspect and the development of the wisdom aspect as its ultimate fruition.

The Buddha was perfectly clear about what he experienced and the path to deliverance from craving and thus, from stress and suffering.

But your question rises a fundamental issue:

Even when what the Buddha taught arouse for his awakening and his wisdom it is fundamental to verify his teachings through our own experience because the teachings of Buddha are not subject to faith but to confidence through personal verification.

And, unlike faith, verification takes time and effort so to develop the qualities of a mind that knows with wisdom.

http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/grin.gif

The way I see it the words of Socrates are not the expression of doubt having gained enlightenment, but more a strategy for seeking it. This in the sense of not claiming to "know" when such is not possible.

Also, I would say that if "truth" is more a state of being (or non-being) that issues in spontaneous expression and creativity within the world - rather than an accumulation of knowledge that is accessed - then "not knowing" can take on different connotations.

But as has been said, I know nowhere of the Buddha expression doubt concerning his own "enlightenment".

Ticktock,

If you are tempted to go to the early teachings of Buddha, this guidelines can bring you some help:

"Befriending the Suttas: Tips on Reading the Pali Discourses" by John T. Bullitt

http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/grin.gif

Hi Ticktock,

The Buddha taught a path, and like all teachings, he had to make some assertions. At a certain level, all assertions begin to break down and have to be abandoned, because, ultimate truth can only be experienced. It can't be conceived by thought and words, except through simile, of which there are many that seem to contradict each other, but they really don't. At an extreme level, one can pick apart anyone's assertions through reductio ad absurdum (Nagarjuna, a buddhist philosopher, showed this to be true) As such, when one gets to the ultimate truth, nirvana, one drops the teachings one used to get there. Buddha said his teachings were like a raft built to get us from one shore called Samsara, or the world as we normally percieve it, to another shore, Nirvana, the world as it actually is. He said that you use a raft to carry you across the water, and then when you get to the other shore, you leave the raft behind on the beach. You don't need it anymore.

Thank you everyone for your time and thought.

I shall mull over your words and links :)

Best regards

Hey Ticktock, welcome to BWB http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/wave.gif

Srivijaya said
He went through what he taught and instructed his followers not to take anything on faith but to verify it for themselves. This is what attacted me to Buddhism.

Fee

Hi All,

I’d just like to confirm my question is answered, I find that I have to challenge every insight I have into spirituality with wanton ferocity; so that if the insight succeeds I can accept it as a truth.
I would expect Buddha to challenge his own knowledge but I can never really know if he felt it needed or didn’t.
The answer to my question is immaterial to what I seek, I see that the Buddhist teachings can offer challenge and guild lines for me to follow.

Thank you

Hi Ticktock, This is precisely the attitude that you need to have in order to succeed.

That's excellent news, Ticktock ! Please feel free to start new threads as required, or join in our other discussions,

I'll close this one now. http://www.discussworldissues.com/fo...ilies/grin.gif