[gluckmeea]

Welcome to Heaf-Row

The Troof is Out There!

The opening of Terminal 5 in all of its splendor really does require its very own thread.

http://www.gulfnews.com/business/Aviation/10185850.html

What really happened:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle3645398.ece

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA0mQDMX8JI

The Heafrow opening reminds me of what happened last summer when USMC Harriers performed exercises with the RN on the British aircraft carrier.

The USMC Harriers performed more flight ops in one day than the whole RN did off two carriers in the entire Falklands War. Obviously, just like the tempo of operations in the RN, being in front of the telly to watch the football and getting enouff fish and chips and beer is more important than what should have been one of the the biggest events in British history with the opening of the brand spanking new terminal.

Even if Heafrow were demolished and rebuilt, Hong Kongs airport is still light years ahead.

The troof is out there. One more reason why London is falling behind.

[EzequielTMann]

Oh lets jump on a massively complex building's teething problems in the first three days of its existance and pretend thats the way it is all the time.

[BakerBonce]

No,

The opening of this Terminal was to be the seminal event in the history of LHR to drag it out of its already poor reputation.

Thats why everyone was open mouthed at what actually happened when it opened.

Incredible.

I imagine that some African and Middle Eastern airports like Dubai must be having quite a chuckle at how good the British organized all of this.

Its a disgrace however you look at it. Heathrow PR machine is always boasting about how good it is.

The troof and the reality were somewhat different.

[Acalsenunse]

Well you should be complaining about your own airports. T5 kills JFKs terminals anyday. Ny is the one losing out not London. Maybe yo should be ridiculing American Airlines at JFK who built HALF a terminal to cut costs -- JFK terminal 8 is terminal cut int HALF..what a half arsed job dude, LOL!!

[prmnwoks]

Notwithstanding Tenenbaum's usual chauvinist rant against those of Albion, as a Londoner and a frequent victim of Heathrow I can't help but be, once again, flabbergasted by the general inability of transport authorities in the UK to get things right which seem to be well within the reach of lesser nations.

It's all made more galling by:
1) the uncharacteristically boosterish and sycophantic press coverage of the T5 opening; more or less comparing a fairly humdrum modern airport terminal to some sort of 8th wonder of the world.
2) the fact that T5 was built against condiderably regional opposition and will result in a further runway being built in a very poor position (after the MoT perjured itself saying the new terminal would not lead to a new runway...)

It's just one of those national "black holes", which every country has (See: "Luca's theory of national 'black holes'").

I reckon that within weeks it will be running at a "normal" (for Heathrow) pace.

[Smalmslobby]

Who paid for LHR T5? The Gov or BAA? Why did they spend 6billion on it, thats quite a lot!!!

[Dstyeglm]

Who paid for LHR T5? The Gov or BAA? Why did they spend 6billion on it, thats quite a lot!!!

It was all paid for by BAA, now owned by the debt crippled Spanish company Ferrovial. I think even the extension of the London Underground was included in the cost.

[xyupi]

Wow Gregory. Why do you hate London so much?

Unless I'm mistaken, Hong Kong airport had a very similar start when it opened. And now it is considered one of the best airports in the world. T5 will be running normally in no time, and people will be able to appreciate how good it is better. From what I saw from the stupid coverage on the news (you would think the country had just declared war on someone, this is about the only thing they have been showing) even the people who have been delayed seem to appreciate how good the actual building itself is.

London isn't falling behind anyone mate. And you saying it is, and starting this thread, and basically your attacks against London are just making you look either ignorant or jealous.

[addisonnicogel]

^ Newcastlekid, you'll soon get used to his posts, he only has one subject of conversation, and evidently only one thought in mind (must be an interesting date). Far from being offended by old greggy's obsession, its becoming amusing: a couple of mishaps in the UK always bring him out of 'retirement' and you can bet money there will be a new thread.

Anyway, I'll be using T5 when i come over to the US in June - looking forward to it.

By the way, troof is spealt truth Greggy, and Heafrow is actually Heathrow - got a lisp old boy? Never mind - no one's prerfect.

[WelcomeMe]

No one here has said that "I hate London" but Ill take it as a reflection of whats going on in your mind.

The reality is that this event was billed as the one BIG event in the history of what is universally regarded now as one of the worst airports in the world (excluding some in third world countries) to drag it back into the fold as a decent place to transit through.

It failed.

It was just a new terminal. Hong Kong was a whole new airport miles away from its old one (Ive used both) built on a island reclaimed from the sea so if any airport was going to have problems, Hong Kong would be it.

LHR T5 was built attached to 4 existing terminals of an awful airport and was billed, if we are to believe English press releases/propaganda, to be a first class terminal with great service that was to sweep away all those bad memories of Heafrow.

It didnt. It was a failure.

Maybe the problem was: that it was attached to four terminals of one of the worlds worst airports.

I wonder just how lucky (unlucky) one would have to be to travel through T5 instead of the other equally awful four terminals.

Nuff said.

[TriamiCaw]

An observation from readers of The Guardian :



"Consider British trains. The First Great Western paid 1 Billion pounds to the UK government for its 7-year license. This has assured the daily commuter hell for thousands of hapless victims to both government and corporate greed, as FGW seeks to recover its license fees and maximise its profit.
UK has uniquely converted its national infrastructure into a series of local private monopolies. The public has been converted into objects of extortion. The airport hell is there for all to see. UK public pays three to four times as much for their grossly sub-standard train service than anywhere else in Europe.
All this for what? UK public still pays taxes. In other countries you get infrastructure in return for your taxes. In this country you get taxed first, then exploited by private monopolies that operate in collusion with greedy government.
UK remains a feudal society. This is how its public infrastructure is organised.
And this country presumes to put itself forward as a model for the rest of Europe, for countries such as France, to follow?"


And another somewhat more pointed:

"Let's not avoid the truth here. The problem is Britain and the British people, and not politics or anything like that.
Look, you're a useless people when it comes to organizing things. Inefficiency seems to be the national value. The railways are an obvious example. Every time I visit Britain I am further amazed how how much crap Britons will put up with. The last time I was there, the rail companies shut down a large chunk of the network.... on the busiest holiday weekend of the year.
The last great piece of reliable technology made in Britain is probably the Supermarine Spitfire. Even that was an aberration. When I was a kid "British made car" was a synonym for "lemon".
If I go into a shop in the UK I practically have to smack a store employee in the face to get any service - half the time they are talking to their friends on a cell phone. British banks suck beyond belief, and ordinary goods are ridiculously expensive (rip-off Britain). If only Britons could understand that the purpose of a job is to create value for the community, and not to work out increasingly arcane rules for the benefit of the employee.
How you managed to con them into giving you the Olympics is beyond me, but I predict disaster. It's the same with the England football team. It has great players, but can't get organized to save its life.
You're a crap country and the Scottish will be better off on their own."

Read it for yourself here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...irlineindustry

Heaf Row. The Troof is out there.

[objennasweene]

Tripe.

[97dYA9L3]

Turtle Bay indeed...

Ooooh, ey've goh eh tertle-heed poking oot

You know we hadn't had an anti-British (or is it juts the English?) Tennen-Troll (tm) Thread in a while; I was beginning to miss it.

One of the less edifying aspects of having lived both in the US and the UK is the inability to suffer exposure to facile, uninformed criticism and stereotyping of one country by another.

[eCw56dzY]

Wow Gregory. Why do you hate London so much?

Unless I'm mistaken, Hong Kong airport had a very similar start when it opened. And now it is considered one of the best airports in the world. T5 will be running normally in no time, and people will be able to appreciate how good it is better. From what I saw from the stupid coverage on the news (you would think the country had just declared war on someone, this is about the only thing they have been showing) even the people who have been delayed seem to appreciate how good the actual building itself is.

London isn't falling behind anyone mate. And you saying it is, and starting this thread, and basically your attacks against London are just making you look either ignorant or jealous.

One word: Jealousy. He can laugh all he likes about startup issues (of which there is no excuse for), but T5 is larger than any of New York's airports and has its own dedicated rail links to Central London - something that is almost magical when talking about New York.

In a months time the issues will be sorted and people will wonder what all the fuss was about, and he'll be the one left with the disjointed terminals and unable to get a one-seat train ride to Manhattan.

And to re-cap over other major terminal/airport openings:
- With Hong Kong's new airport the old airport had to remain open for a further 6months to handle the problems there. People were even told to avoid Hong Kong because the issues got so bad at one point
- Paris' latest terminal collapsed and killed several people
- At Changi's new Terminal 3 - an A380 rolled off the runway because of the new apron layout
- Madrid's Barajas airport also had similar baggage problems as Heathrow.

[intisgunkas]

And another somewhat more pointed:

"Let's not avoid the truth here. The problem is Britain and the British people, and not politics or anything like that.
Look, you're a useless people when it comes to organizing things. Inefficiency seems to be the national value. The railways are an obvious example. Every time I visit Britain I am further amazed how how much crap Britons will put up with. The last time I was there, the rail companies shut down a large chunk of the network.... on the busiest holiday weekend of the year.
The last great piece of reliable technology made in Britain is probably the Supermarine Spitfire. Even that was an aberration. When I was a kid "British made car" was a synonym for "lemon".
If I go into a shop in the UK I practically have to smack a store employee in the face to get any service - half the time they are talking to their friends on a cell phone. British banks suck beyond belief, and ordinary goods are ridiculously expensive (rip-off Britain). If only Britons could understand that the purpose of a job is to create value for the community, and not to work out increasingly arcane rules for the benefit of the employee.
How you managed to con them into giving you the Olympics is beyond me, but I predict disaster. It's the same with the England football team. It has great players, but can't get organized to save its life.
You're a crap country and the Scottish will be better off on their own."

Read it for yourself here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...irlineindustry

Heaf Row. The Troof is out there.

Using comments that are equally as idiotic to back up your own claims doesn't do you any favors. "You're a crap country and the Scottish will be better off on their own." Seriously? Then make me happy and p*ss off out the union then, is what I say to that. I'd like to see how the scots do without the ENGLISH paying for their health care and free university education.

Greg, you call terminal 5 a failure, and it has been open less than a week. I'm sure in a few years time when everyone has forgotten about the problems (just like they seem to do with all the other airports)

T5 has been built, soon terminals 1 and 2 will be knocked down and replaced with Heathrow East, and both terminals 3 and 4 are being modernized. Heathrow will be one of the best airports in the world by the time the Olympics comes, and that will be just another thing that London has that is bigger and better than what most other places have.

[enentique]

And to re-cap over other major terminal/airport openings:
- With Hong Kong's new airport the old airport had to remain open for a further 6months to handle the problems there. People were even told to avoid Hong Kong because the issues got so bad at one point
- Paris' latest terminal collapsed and killed several people
- At Changi's new Terminal 3 - an A380 rolled off the runway because of the new apron layout
- Madrid's Barajas airport also had similar baggage problems as Heathrow.

Exactly. But when it suits people they conveniently forget...

[Reatclaplen]

I wonder just how lucky (unlucky) one would have to be to travel through T5 instead of the other equally awful four terminals.

Nuff said.

Have the courage to stand up for your convictions - you do hate London and the English - admit it, whey else would virtually all of your posts say the same thing.

The problem is on this particular topic, had you simply pointed out that the opening of T5 was a fiasco, and not gone on to spam your usual anglophobic Stereotypes, most people may have agreed with you, myself included. You spoiled the effect by lacking any form of restraint, (as with your comments about the death of Heath Ledger).

It has been open just a few days now.

Yes the opening day was a fiaco.

It will settle in time - keep an open mind and don't write T5 off so readily.

Its not the end of the world - no one has been killed, and at worst a few thousand passengers (mostly on domestic flights) have temporarily lost their luggage, or their flights have been cancelled.

I consider myself lucky enough to travel through terminal 5 in two months, and i'm looking forward to it.

Nuff said

[WXQMQFIr]

One word: Jealousy. He can laugh all he likes about startup issues (of which there is no excuse for), but T5 is larger than any of New York's airports and has its own dedicated rail links to Central London - something that is almost magical when talking about New York.

In a months time the issues will be sorted and people will wonder what all the fuss was about, and he'll be the one left with the disjointed terminals and unable to get a one-seat train ride to Manhattan.

And to re-cap over other major terminal/airport openings:
- With Hong Kong's new airport the old airport had to remain open for a further 6months to handle the problems there. People were even told to avoid Hong Kong because the issues got so bad at one point
- Paris' latest terminal collapsed and killed several people
- At Changi's new Terminal 3 - an A380 rolled off the runway because of the new apron layout
- Madrid's Barajas airport also had similar baggage problems as Heathrow.

Nick, you're just as bad as Greg in an opposite way, and your current boasting about T5 is proof of it -- Bigger than any NY's airports (what?), we have the best rail, we have the best airports, etc, etc...on, and on.. What childish boasting, and all this comes out on your London project thread. Are you a little boy playing a mine is bigger than yours game?

All that comes out of your mouth is: London has this, New York hasn't, London has that, its the best, yadayada... You are an incredibly biased, arrogant and annoying poster. How bloody dare you come to a New York board and have the audacity to constantly brag about London and how much better it is and never ever return anything positive about the city where most of us here live. All you do is take, take take. I've hardly every heard you say anything positive about us here. Its always your silly childish attitude about your "perfect" city of London. No wonder people like Greg exist here to balance you out.

Your disugsting booterism is sooo tiring that I would rather you piss off and stay on Skyscrapercity and never come back. You are ten times worse than any dubai fan boy.

[lidya-sggf]

and that will be just another thing that London has that is bigger and better than what most other places have.

Ooh, looky here. Another childish, arrogant snob, London centric remark. We are the London Overlords, we are the best, everything we do is better. Get out, I hope you are banned for being a complete **it. I never new the English were such snobby creeps.

[Lhtfajba]

FC you need relax. You are going way over the top with your reations at the moment. Your replies are childish. Grow up. In case you havent noticed this is the World forum so London is perfectly welcome here.

And another thing you have no right to tell people to leave the forum so give it up.